HPDE crash holy crap zomg

I guess it could be considered NSFW because there is a LITTLE cursing but... good lord. It's an older video (2006) but its stunning.

hope everyone was ok

I didn't know there were 3 cars involved until i saw the NSX in the photos. Looks like everyone was okay. At least the worker got out of the way in time.

In car video of the same affair.

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/Happens-to-the-best-of-us_43500.htm

whoa...

why in the heck were those cars staged so close to the track? and why was that G35 driver prancing around outside his car when staged?

it's screw-ups like this that make it so hard for me to choose a new HPDE group to run with: you never know what someone's concept of "safe" is going to be.

dyintorace wrote: In car video of the same affair. http://videos.streetfire.net/video/Happens-to-the-best-of-us_43500.htm

Lemme tell ya, if ANYONE grabs the steering wheel from the passenger seat, EVER there's gonna be a dent in his/her melon real quick!

peter wrote: why in the heck were those cars staged so close to the track? and why was that G35 driver prancing around outside his car when staged?

The first question = good question. The second question = he's lucky he was prancing around outside.......can you imagine if he was strapped in!!

Note to self: Stick to autocrossing,

peter said: why in the heck were those cars staged so close to the track?

As soon as I saw that, I knew how the video would end.

I think the G35 driver was in his car when it was hit. The NSX driver was the one standing there and the one who luckily looked back when he heard the tire noise rapidly approaching from behind.

Agreed, a horrible place to stage cars.

That NSX driver is really damn lucky he looked when he did. He would've been in the middle of that G35/Evo sammich.

Lots of things went wrong there.

Not only that, he made the mistake of trying to run away from the car. It's instinct, but it's wrong. The right thing to do is run perpendicular to the direction the car is coming at you. That way, it only takes a few steps to get out of its path, rather than trying to outrun an Evo (or any car) on foot, which doesn't work too well. Guy is lucky the stationary cars stopped the Evo before it got to him.

And yeah, staged WAAAAAAY too close to the track.

DrBoost wrote:

dyintorace wrote: In car video of the same affair. http://videos.streetfire.net/video/Happens-to-the-best-of-us_43500.htm

Lemme tell ya, if ANYONE grabs the steering wheel from the passenger seat, EVER there's gonna be a dent in his/her melon real quick!

I heard that the story on that is that the instructor was insisting that they continue on to the pits to clear the track, but that the student wanted to sit there and catch it on tape or whatever. The reason for the lame "experience" sound over is to hide that drivers blatant disregard of the instructions of the instructor.

at least that is what I heard on another forum

Just out of curiousity.................how does insurance work in a case like that?? Does the club carry insurance to cover mishaps?

SCCA does...I am unsure about NASA...but would assume so.

If it is a "school" no racing no timing then my auto coverage will cover any mishap. As soon as you add any timing racing or awarding anything my coverage is null and void. I got this directly from my agent. ( I asked)

By the way this means that a mishap during an autocross event will not be covered due to it being timed.

I could hear everything the instructor was saying in my head and when she started turning his steering wheel for him to try and get him to pull away and clear the track for the emergency crew. If it were me and my "student" I would have smacked him so hard on his helmet it would have rung his ears and if that didn't get his attention, I would have "disabled" his camera if that's what was motivating him to disobey my instruction and then I would make sure he was banned from any future events that I was even remotely involved in.

As far as insurance coverage, it really depends on where you are and who you have. Dean got his info straight from his agent, so that info is accurate for him. A few years back, there was a case in Mass. of a guy balling it up at the track, and then claiming a "one car accident on a private road." They covered it, but then he went even further and tried to get his mods and such covered. Further investigation revealed that the "private road" was a track, and the mods were a roll cage and go-fast goodies. His claim was then denied - mostly because he didn't tell the entire truth - and wording was changed on many policies to exclude all "speed events" from coverage. Timed or untimed.

So if you're concerned, either do what Dean did and check with your particular agent, buy HPDE insurance, or don't say a word, fly under the radar, and hope for the best. E36 M3 happens.

I have to wonder how accurate your agent is on these things. He may say (and think) your covered, but once you have a claim, he really isn't the one making the decision about if you are covered or not. I would have him show you the wording in your contract to back that up.

You need to read your policy. What your agent says is meaningless. So few agents actually know what they are talking about (they are salespeople, after all) they are next to useless for anything other than collecting your money. There are exceptions to that, yes, but few.

90% of insurance policies DO NOT cover any shenanigans on a track or autocross surface. The popularity of HPDE programs in the last 10 years coupled with far too many idiots making claims they really shouldn't has prompted a huge shift in the language within policies. What may have been once covered is probably now excluded. Those little notices you get with your premium bill that you never read? There ya go...

If you can't afford to wad it up and eat the loss, you shouldn't have it on the track. That's just life.

A side observation...why is it always the drivers of Evos and R32s that seem to cause most of the destruction?

my agent told me I would be covered .... once... and then dropped... never to have coverage with them again... now the Integra has been returned to pure street duty, and the CRX is the auto-x and track day toy.... still street legal but does nothing but go to races and return....

Not so sure about that NSX being repaired....aren't those Aluminum frames next to impossible to fix in an event like that?

Either way it sucks, and crap like this has pushed me away from HPDE events, although I love going fast, if something like that happened you'd better just bend over with no lube when it comes to dealing with insurance.

You should certainly read the wording in your policy when it comes to this.

The agent may not know much more than you do about your policy and most people only know that basics. Liability, Comprehensive, Collision. Its the actual wording which will determine it.

I also don't understand why people think that insurance should cover these type of accidents. You know the risks when you get out on track. That doesn't mean I would not be upset with the Evo driver but the purpose is to cover accidents, not intentional risks.

To be honest the NSX and the G35 owner should known better than to stage there, reguardless of what the officials think. It is only a calculated risk if you actually do the calculations.

I've done a number of HPDE's and the only I've felt unsafe was when I made a mistake on the track. The course officials may or may not know what they are doing, they are usually volunteers and ultimately you have to make safety decisions for yourself.

fiat22turbo wrote: To be honest the NSX and the G35 owner should known better than to stage there, reguardless of what the officials think. It is only a calculated risk if you actually do the calculations. I've done a number of HPDE's and the only I've felt unsafe was when I made a mistake on the track. The course officials may or may not know what they are doing, they are usually volunteers and ultimately you have to make safety decisions for yourself.

All but one of my track days have been with TrackDaze© and the safety level and concern has to be seen to be believed

the only other track day was a SCCA event at Rockingham and while it wasn't unsafe I felt a little intimidated since it was my first time as an intermediate (running with the advance drivers , because of small run groups) and several of the drivers were SM drivers practicing for the race the next day, and were accustomed to passing any where with no point by.... made for some interesting mirror watching in my under powered CRX