Insult to Injury--GM recall

(CNN) -- The possibility of engine fires has prompted General Motors to recall nearly 1.5 million passenger sedans manufactured between 1997 and 2003, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration announced Monday.

GM issued a recall on a similar engine in 2008, according to the company's filing with the government. That problem was traced to a faulty gasket on the engine rocker cover

I remember catching flak here a year or two ago when I asked "why does it seem that so many American car recalls involve potential bursting into flames???"

I suppose I'm still off base on that one.

This is painful to see happening.

Yea, they had the same recall on the supercharged ones last year. IMO its pretty bad they didnt do this years ago, I have seen many many burned ones in message board pics and in the junkyard.

maybe they should fix the oil leak...but thats why i drive a ford!! but seriously this is a shame to see, i cant imagine the world without the "big 3" but chryslers dead in the water, and unbelievably it looks as if gm could be next... sad times.

Sounds like the Fiero recall.

Transverse Iron Dukes run a quart low on oil because incorrect marks on the dipstick and a misprint in the owners manual.

Couple that with a connecting rod Q/C problem and you have an engine that easily runs out of oil and spits a rod out of the block when run low on oil.

FWD cars aren't a problem because the hole just spews oil on the ground.

The Fiero has cat located right under the hole and gets hot oil spilled on it causing engine fires.

The solution was to install drip trays to catch the oil and a heat shield on the firewall so it wouldn't burn through as fast.

Cute.

Yes, I own a Fiero that has been on fire.

Wow, that fix is some clever engineering! It's obviously the best solution to the problem

Escorts had a recall for heads which would crack vertically on the front side. This would leak oil onto the exhaust manifold and, you guessed it, start a fire.

GM also had a recall on 3800's for a bad fuel pressure regulator; it would leak excessive fuel into the intake and on startup BOOM. This would blow the plastic intake manifold apart and possibly start a fire. I had a couple of little old ladies with Buicks that this happened to; going to church on Sunday morning and KABOOM. Then there was the OTHER 3800 fire related recall, which was engine coolant leaking at the throttle body (yes antifreeze can be flammable). Never saw one actually catch fire but I saw a bunch leaking.

So let me get this straight.
1) The engine leaks enough oil that hard braking can cause it to flow onto the exhaust manifolds.
2) Because manifolds are hot, the oil catches on fire.
3) That fire melts the plug wires causing an even bigger fire.

So they have an engine that at 6-9 years old leaks enough oil to start a fire on the manifolds and the solution is to move the plug wires out of the way? What?

MrJoshua wrote: So they have an engine that at 6-9 years old leaks enough oil to start a fire on the manifolds and the solution is to move the plug wires out of the way? What?

They've done it before, it's called a "smallblock"

Shawn

gamby wrote: I remember catching flak here a year or two ago when I asked "why does it seem that so many American car recalls involve potential bursting into flames???"

To be fair to the General, Nissan has a pretty good run on the "all our cars burst into flames" title, too. That QR engine... E36 M3.

Hey, now that we all own GM, we need to stop diss'n them, err, us. Try this instead: "Why, sir, it's perfectly normal for your engine to burst into flames. They all do that."

Didn't the new beetle catch fire too?

Shawn

Don't worry sir, They all do that.

My '99 Sunfire had a recall a while back - they don't start very easily, and the starter wiring would get hot enough to burst into flames. Recall was to use another relay and bigger wires. Not fix the stupid "hard start" problem.

G

Random fires are a new feature in your GM vehicle.

Geez. If they can get oil to burst into flames that easily, think of what the Volts lithium ion batteries will do

Holey Macbook Batman!

Shawn

I seem to remember Ford had a small issue of fires in the Crown Vics, like a rear impact caused the fuel tank to rupture

and a short in the cruise control module on the f150

not bursting into flames, but the 97+ f150's also had a wierd issue with the door skins cracking where they turned to go up the windowframe on the rear side of the door. when you rolled the window up, and it hit the top of its travel, the mechanism would bow the doorskin out. it would go out/in any time the window opened or closed. you also couldn't stop the window where it didn't bend the door either, or you'd get wind noise. the fix? reinforce the back of the doorskin in that area, so it wouldn't crack from the flexing. at least not as quickly this time.

The really sad thing is it's not even oil. Anybody on the 3800/GP/GTP forums will tell you the fuel rails/lines are what leaks. It's a stupid accounting design and GM absolutely refuses to fix it right. Any mechanic can see the spark plug wire "valley" thing is a bad idea period, I tossed ours as soon as we got the car and used old school wire looms.

Also aussiemg on the CV rear hit issue, because cops sit on the side of freeways and get rear-ended at 70-90MPH, every once in awhile one's gonna blow. Ford was actually pro-active in that one and released a real fix long before the Gov't said they had to. It's a really nice multi-piece shielding on the rear axle and gas tank to prevent metal/metal contact in extreme rear impacts. And yes, my P71 has it. Ford was pretty diligent about hunting them all down and installing the kits.

How are we gonna move the new ones if we don't get rid of the old ones.

Nothing burned like old VW Beetles.

Passenger sits in the back seat, shorts out the battery, ignites the horsehair insulation. Stinky, but since the rear seat popped out easily, it wasn't a huge problem.

But the engine fires. The gas lines popped off easily, fuel pooled everywhere and ignited. Remember those fires well.

But wait, there's more! Engine bay is insulated with asphalt. Once that gets burning, it's nearly impossible to put the fire out with normal sized extinguishers.

But wait, there's still more! The gas tank is up high, so it's gravity fed. When the fuel line pops off or gets burned through, the fuel tank happily supplies gasoline to the fire until it's completely empty. Now that's fine engineering.

Got to the point that in my last Beetle I carried around a huge (40 lb?) PKP fire extinguisher and a bag of marshmallows.

Trans_Maro wrote: Sounds like the Fiero recall. Transverse Iron Dukes run a quart low on oil because incorrect marks on the dipstick and a misprint in the owners manual. Couple that with a connecting rod Q/C problem and you have an engine that easily runs out of oil and spits a rod out of the block when run low on oil. FWD cars aren't a problem because the hole just spews oil on the ground. The Fiero has cat located right under the hole and gets hot oil spilled on it causing engine fires. The solution was to install drip trays to catch the oil and a heat shield on the firewall so it wouldn't burn through as fast. Cute. Yes, I own a Fiero that has been on fire.

The rather significant difference is that non of the recalled cars have ever caught fire for this issue. It's just a risk that they want to nip in the bud.

But it's fun to blow it way out of proportion, isn't it?

Eric

Ford had a recall on the big E series vans (E250/350) back in the '80's, it applied to the dual tank versions and ambulance conversions. The story: the body hung down very low past the frame rails. If the vehicle sat and idled for a very long time (like an ambulance or a small bus), the underbody temps would go WAY up there (exhaust, catalytic converters, engine heat etc couldn't escape) and this would cause the fuel tank pressure to rise. If it got high enough, the fuel fill hoses could rupture or blow off of the tank, particularly when the tank was around 3/4 full.

The first time I got involved with one of those was an ambulance which was idling outside of an ER in Rock Hill, SC. The tank blew while under the ER entrance canopy and it burned the entrance up bad.

Hmmm, sounds like the Z34 needs some work done.

foxtrapper wrote: Nothing burned like old VW Beetles. ... But the engine fires. The gas lines popped off easily, fuel pooled everywhere and ignited. Remember those fires well. But wait, there's more! Engine bay is insulated with asphalt. Once that gets burning, it's nearly impossible to put the fire out with normal sized extinguishers.

That's exactly how I lost my Beetle.

New Dodge Ram pickups seem to have a tendency to want to burst into flames as well. Not sure why, or if a fix has been implemented, but we've gotten several '06 and newer burnt up Dodge pickups.