wheelsmithy (Joe-with-an-L)
wheelsmithy (Joe-with-an-L) GRM+ Memberand UltraDork
4/28/20 1:55 p.m.

Like the title says, who has experience with ball joint reamers?

I'm adapting an AW11 MR@ suspension to my Fiat X1/9, and this is going to require control arms front and rear. Ball joints are stock Mr2. Does anyone know the angle? I admit, I haven't yet begun the googling, but would love some knowledge if the hive has it.

Edit, I'm having better luck with taper, rather than angle.

Be well.

oldopelguy (Forum Supporter)
oldopelguy (Forum Supporter) UberDork
4/28/20 3:26 p.m.

Almost everything is 7 degree taper, and what isn't is overwhelmingly 10 degrees. That's all I know. 

Trent (Generally supportive dude)
Trent (Generally supportive dude) PowerDork
4/28/20 3:39 p.m.

I can only say that 80's/90's Toyota pickups and a lot of European cars use 1:10 taper or 5.71 degrees. I have matched that to late 70's Corolla so it is probably a safe bet Toyota uses it as their primary taper.

 

My 60's Ford used 1-1/2" TPF Which is the really common 7.15 degree.

 

My reamers came from X-cut.

wheelsmithy (Joe-with-an-L)
wheelsmithy (Joe-with-an-L) GRM+ Memberand UltraDork
4/28/20 5:39 p.m.

In reply to Trent (Generally supportive dude) :

I only knew they existed due to one of your threads.

I've been fiddling around, and it appears the outer ball joints from my PT cruiser parts car are a good match for the MR2 uprights I have.

Does anyone know an accurate way to measure?  

My only thought was to ream a hole, sharpie the ball joint, and check how it wears. I hate to spend 50 bucks on speculation.

Most of what I'm seeing is 7 degree (as oldopelguy says)

Brotus7
Brotus7 HalfDork
4/28/20 6:43 p.m.

There was/is a Moog catalog floating around the web with part numbers and ball joint dimensions.  It shows up from time to time on the locostusa forum.  I may have a copy saved on my laptop.

Professor_Brap (Forum Supporter)
Professor_Brap (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
4/28/20 6:59 p.m.

In reply to Brotus7 :

+1 on this

Honsch
Honsch New Reader
4/28/20 7:03 p.m.

If you want to check comparability, blue it up, bolt it together, then pull it apart and check for good contact via blue transfer.

Brotus7
Brotus7 HalfDork
4/28/20 7:05 p.m.

This isn't what you're looking for, but it may benefit someone else in the hive.

https://www.moog-suspension-parts.com/universal_outer_tie_rod_ends.asp

What you're looking for, but for tie rod ends.

Brotus7
Brotus7 HalfDork
4/28/20 7:08 p.m.

I went up one more level and found this, still not what you want.  Coil springs, inner and outer tie rod ends, tie rod adjusters, and if you drive a dinosaur - drag links.

https://www.moog-suspension-parts.com/shop-universal-parts.asp

Vigo (Forum Supporter)
Vigo (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
4/28/20 9:37 p.m.

I got bored of figuring this out on some drop spindles i bought for my b250 van (they are not for a b250 van...) so i had a machine shop size them to a stock tie rod i supplied. They charged more than i thought, so in hindsight i would do what you are doing and try harder to figure it out! On the plus side, i have drop spindles on my van. 

wheelsmithy (Joe-with-an-L)
wheelsmithy (Joe-with-an-L) GRM+ Memberand UltraDork
4/29/20 6:15 a.m.

While it is true I am interested in the lower ball joint on a MR2, Tie rod ball joints are of interest, as well. It appears the tie rod ball joints from my PTGT donor work with the MR2 uprights.

wheelsmithy (Joe-with-an-L)
wheelsmithy (Joe-with-an-L) GRM+ Memberand UltraDork
5/5/20 8:00 p.m.

Selfish bump, because I'm still lost.

Anyone know how to determine/measure ball joint/tie rod end taper? 

Edit: Wait a minute. Get the part #s and research specs from manufactures? I'll see about that.

jimbbski
jimbbski SuperDork
5/6/20 10:11 a.m.

Speaking of MR2's.  A few years ago I did some work on a guys MR2 spider?  The last version of it. Don't flame me as I'm not a Toyota expert.

Anyway I built some taller ball joints for it using a stock car style "monoball" and stud. I reamed the ball joint bore on the knuckle to the 7 deg common to US cars and he ended up with adjustable height ball joints that kept the LCA angle close to stock but the car lowered.   I did some other mods but I don't remember everything.  It's been a while.

I'm thinking of building some LCAs using my friends '74 Capri LCAs to copy. I want to make them adjustable for length so camber is adjustable and also incorporate taller ball joints or some version of a monball and stud. They offer some adjustable LCAs in England but not with taller ball joints.

wheelsmithy (Joe-with-an-L)
wheelsmithy (Joe-with-an-L) GRM+ Memberand UltraDork
5/7/20 7:22 a.m.

In reply to jimbbski :

No flaming here. That's actually quite helpful. I'm trying to figure out those exact kind of things, so any other ways to skin the cat are most welcome.

  I had been eyeballing machining a roll center correcter, and using the stock MR2 lower ball joint.

Somewhat like this:

In a lot of ways, your method is simpler. Now, I just have to see about budget. 

Input greatly appreciated.

malibuguy
malibuguy GRM+ Memberand Reader
12/19/20 9:22 p.m.

Im in a similar predicament with my fwd toyotas.

I know I can ream and make other BJs work however I want to be able to sell a few custom control arms that do not require any modifications

I broke down and bought a 7* reamer, and am going to try it and see. Maybe do as jimbbski suggested. Maybe keep buying reamers until I get one I can use. 

Curtis73 (Forum Supporter)
Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
12/20/20 11:28 a.m.

Sorry I missed this the first time around.

I went through this many moons ago.  I can't speak to your specific application, but I recall finding a dizzying array of tapers, lengths, and flavors of taper.  Many of the SAE (American) stuff used a ratio, like 1.5 or 1.25 and measured per inch.  So if the skinny end was 1/2" with a 1.5 taper and a 1" length, the fat end would be 3/4".  Cumbersome, but it works.  That technically translates to 7.125 degrees.

Thanks, Curtis!

I fitted tie rod ends from a PT Cruiser into AW11 MR2 knuckles, and they seemed identical. Note, I didn't get too precise with my measurement yet.

 

WonkoTheSane (FS)
WonkoTheSane (FS) GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
12/22/20 10:07 p.m.

I haven't seen this thread before, so sorry if it's too late, but just measure the top and bottom diameter of the socket or ball joint with calipers or bore gauge, and the distance between your measurement points.

After that, SOH CAH TOA (Google angle calculator...)

WonkoTheSane (FS) said:

I haven't seen this thread before, so sorry if it's too late, but just measure the top and bottom diameter of the socket or ball joint with calipers or bore gauge, and the distance between your measurement points.

After that, SOH CAH TOA (Google angle calculator...)

See now, I assumed I wouldn't be accurate enough doing it that way, so I didn't try. Advice appreciated.

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