Living with a 4th gen Camaro

I posted a thread several weeks ago when I first started considering replacing for my 200k mile e36 asking the advice of the fine grm community on potential candidates. Well, my need for a new car suddenly became much more urgent last friday when some poor sap tried to park his Tacoma in my trunk whilst on my way home from work.

So far i have looked at a 2nd gen MR2 (beat to crap), an NA Miata (also beat to crap, and too small to boot), a 300zx (nice, but have you ever looked under the hood of one? Holy cluster berkeley, Batman!), and an ls1 Camaro (neglected). I think I have pretty much set my heart on a piece of American iron at this point, specifically an LS1 6 speed 4th gen f body. I went to look at another one this evening and I think it might be "the one."

So to those of you who have owned, what made you buy it, what made you keep it, why did you sell it, and what did you hate about it? Keep in mind this would be my dd and only car.

I just bought a 2000 Firebird V6 as a daily driver. The sight lines aren't as good as a third gen car, but the overall size isn't much different when parked side by side. The seats tend to be pretty broken down in high mileage cars, so swapping the bases left to right helps alot. Suddenly you're sitting a couple inches higher and can see! (if you're short like me). For the money, an LS1 car is a great value but prices run a very wide range. From 3k beaters to 15k garage queens. Drive several and buy the best in your budget. 6 speed cars are more expensive than automatic ones. SS/WS6 cars really aren't worth the extra money people ask for them. Gas mileage isn't too bad if you keep your foot out of it (this is hard). Hard top is better than t-top but tougher to find, add sub frame connectors, particularly for t-top cars.

Look at the floors where the rear control arms attach. The control arm mounting bracket is spot-welded to an expanse of flat, uncreased sheetmetal, and this area is both weak and rust-prone. About five-six years ago, I started seeing 4th-gens with severe rot here including control arm separation from the shell. Now, I don't see 4th-gens anymore except for diaper-rubbed garage queens.

+1 on the fuel economy. You can almost but not quite touch 30mpg in an LT1 car if you drive them properly. 25mpg is more typical. They don't quite have the pull or the moddability of the LS1 cars, but the flip side of this is that the LT1 cars were practically as fast as a contemporary Cobra, and given that any engine modding will require dropping the drivetrain out the bottom, are you really going to modify it anyway?

The 300zx engine bay is actually not at that bad to live with, to be honest. For one, they're reliable, and two, while yes... the bay is full, it's layered quite smartly. Takes longer to do things, but it's not hard. Very well-designed cars.

Wife had an '01 SS, for ten years. Bought it in '03, with 65k on the clock.

Furious_E wrote: What made you buy it?

She had an '03 V6 Mustang, bought new, a year before. She realized, within days, that she should have gotten the V8. She wasn't fond of it. Saw an ad for the SS. Traded Mustang for it. The torques made her do it.

Furious_E wrote: What made you keep it?

The torques.

Furious_E wrote: Why did you sell it?

Wife wanted something with a warranty and better fuel economy.

Furious_E wrote: And what did you hate about it?

10-12mpg. I was tired of fixing the damn thing: steering rack, alternator, PS return line, etc. This all started happening in the last year, before we traded it. It was starting to find the next weakest link about three weeks after I'd fix something.

Furious_E wrote: what made you buy it

It was a running, $700 z28. 'nuff said

Furious_E wrote: what made you keep it

well, I "kept it" in one piece for about a week. Then I disassembled it in my employer's parking lot using hand tools, an engine hoist, and poor decision making. They were....displeased.

Furious_E wrote: why did you sell it

Mostly because the scrap value of the rolling chassis just about paid for the drivetrain that I kept.

Furious_E wrote: what did you hate about it?

Every body panel was damaged, as was the top and the interior.

Speaking of, the interior looks like it was made by Fischer-price. It will also be squeaking and rattling by this point.

The seating position is atrocious and the seats are uncomfortable to boot.

Mediocore brakes, laughable handling, OEM tires are too skinny.

...but dat torque. My God, dat torque

Bought a 99 Z28 M6 because I wanted an ESP autocross car and I found a smoking deal on one already built. It's an unsophisticated car in every way, but so much fun. Love the engine and even the handling. Love the fact that it's one of the last cars you could order with manual everything and even a rear defrost delete option. Hate the glass-jawed 10-bolt diff; I've been through 4 of them. Hate the fact that I spun the #6 rod bearing autocrossing it, and I don't have it rebuilt yet. But I'd buy one again in a second. Drive one and you'll have too much fun to remember that you're not supposed to like big, dumb American stick axle cars.

I just sold my 98' LS1/6spd Camaro after using it as a daily driver for the last four years. The car was coming up on needing some maintenance but I ran it for 40k with very little trouble.

The Good: Power. Power can be addicting sometimes but luckily I never got in any trouble with this car. It will however out run a 5th gen SS on the highway. Handles surprisingly well on a road course, and much better than a mustang of the same vintage. Good enough to impress the BRZ and GTI drivers who thought it was a muscle car that would go around corners like a pig. Not as good for autocross due to its size, but I was also on crap tires and stock suspension components. I broke 30mpg regularly on the highway and never less than 15mpg beating the crap out of it. Hard to beat the performance for the money. Can be autocrossed, tracked, rallycrossed, used as a moving truck, etc.

The bad: For such a large car, the interior is tiny. GM quality plastics aren't much to look at but they did hold up well as time passed. The t-tops tend to leak. Replace the stock shifter as it has a giant rubber isolator and ruins the feel. My B&M ripper felt great. Not the best winter weather vehicle, but I ran it year round anyway. I ran snow tires on mine and once I moved further north I either needed a new set or was tired of the extra work I needed to do just to drive to work.

Overall I enjoyed the car but was ready for something different. If you have the extra cash I bet a GTO is a much nicer option with fewer redneck jokes.

I love 4th gen Camaros. In the family, there has been a 94 LT1, a 98 LS1, and my favourite, the full load triple black 2002 SS SLP convertible my father currently owns.

There's nothing quite like it... but the interiors suuuuuuuuuuure are E36 M3ty!

I had one for a while. It was crap at everything except hauling ass in a straight line. Mine had a 4" high rise hood on it (for no reason) so visibility was even worse than usual.

It sure liked it when you put the hammer down, though. So I took out the part that did that and sold the shell.

Thanks for all the responses guys. I have looked at two Camaros already. The first one I went to see last saturday was fairly cheap for a 6 speed LS1, but had kinda high miles and the owner gave the impression that he didn't really care for the car much or look after it too well.

Camaro #2 I saw yesterday evening, and even after sleeping on it, am still leaning towards buying. Its a 98 (Ls1 6 speed of course) with 73k on it. Exterior is pretty much flawless (aside from aftermarket headlights, if you consider that an issue), interior is good too aside from a big rip in the drivers seat bottom. It drove well, had no immediately apparent mechanical issues aside from an idler pulley that was squeeky. The seller has had it for 8 years and put only 13k on it in that time.

I think I'm gonna do it...

A guy a work drives a 97 I believe and it is his baby. He has quite a bit of money into it. For me the interiors are small and cramped especially compared to my Charger or even a Challenger. Heck they are small compared to a 3rd gen. Most examples I see these days are not well cared for.

When I got the Charger he was all over my car checking it out. He really wants us to race lol.

I had a 95 Z28 6m and loved it. Sold because I was car poor at the time and it was going to need shocks and struts. It was comfortable, reliable, and fun to drive and I'd like to have another one someday, just for fun.

Don't slam the doors on a 4th gen, just a polite heads up.

And buy the 98+ if possible.

I had a 95 Z28 M6 for a while back in 2002.

Good: Nice power, nice noises. My bone-stock LT1 put down 256hp at the wheels on a Dynojet and ran low 14s on street tires all day. Good-looking car, IMO. I like the smaller headlights of the earlier version, though I'd put up with the bigger ones to get the LS1! Decent interior for the mid-90s, no worse than an E36, IMO. Fun autocrosser, though I never had much success with it. T-tops are cool, I don't care what anyone says.

Bad: A freaking nightmare to work on. Seriously, a plug change took me like a week of evenings. Did shocks, those weren't too bad except for rusty fasteners. At the time, I was used to Fox Mustangs, and I found the aftermarket both limited and very expensive in comparison (though, what isn't?). So I sold it and picked up an 89 LX 5.0. I hear bad things about the Optispark in the LT1 cars, too, though I never ran into any issues.

In reply to Tom_Spangler:

Those cars either have zero optispark issues or you're fixing it every couple of months.....no real inbetween in my experience.

Inspiration to help you buy:

One weird thing about these cars is that a lot of the owners are the last people on the planet who actually want T-tops, so the rarer hardtops aren't any more expensive.

With that said, the roof skin is just plastic--if you look at the structure, they're really built as T-tops to begin with, so hardtops aren't any lighter or stiffer.

I can only say this.. I used to drive my uncle's SS after he lost his license to multiple DUIs... I absolutely hated everything but the engine. The Drivetrain was great fun.. but I felt like I was laying down when driving and forget being able to see out of the car or even knowing where the ends of the car were.

After having owned multiple 2nd and 3rd Gen Pontiac f-bodies I feel a little bit remorseful that I haven't owned a 4th Gen yet. However I have driven a couple and for whatever reason I didn't like the driving experience even though they had good power. I likely will own one someday though.

I bought a new LS1 4th gen in 1998 after autocrossing a friend's LT1 Esp car. I had it for only 3 years and 70,000 miles. It ran 13.6 at 104mph the first time me or the car had been at a 1/4 mile track. It handled well with a shock/spring/sway bar change. Like others have said, they can handle massive wheel and tire packages without much modification (11"/12" wide wheels and 315 tires). Only sold the car because I had a kid and bought a house in the same year, looking back I should have kept it.

Get it, put some real shocks on it, maybe a 1le front sway bar, get a rear diff on it and enjoy.

The main thing I dislike about those cars is the turn signal stalk. I can still hear that cracking sound

Well its official, I'm buying the one I looked at yesterday! 98 with the LS1 and t-56, t tops, in black. I'm picking it up mid next week. Its gonna be a long few days...

GTO; you wont regret it.

If you want to make it handle, talk to Sam Strano. Some of his springs & sway bars, Koni yellows, new torque arm/watts link and it'll surprise you. Oh, and big tires, of course.

Enjoy the car, and post some pics.

I had a 275 hp Z-28, I think it was a 96 or 97, I can't remember...when I sold it some guy called me and asked how high the speedometer went up to, when I told him he said, "Im driving up from Louisville, promise me you won't sell it before I get there." I don't know what that was all about but he bought it.

The people who make redneck jokes are a bunch of idiots. It was a fun car, basically a corvette without an independent suspension. I remember a friend with a cobra mustang ended up learning he wasn't as fast as he thought he was with his silly car.

All fourth generation camaros, every single one of them, have front fenders that just don't fit. Seriously, look at the bottom of the fender behind the wheel, they all stick out for some reason. After awhile, I got tired of the rattling coming from the 6 speed. I can't remember why I sold it but that was probably one of the reasons.

The fender issue comes from people not using the correct jacking points. They just find a flat spot under the car and start lifting. I've seen it happen at dealers too.