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ShadowSix
ShadowSix Dork
9/22/14 3:58 p.m.
OldGray320i wrote: Any of you people who oppose the safety regulations hate people, and by extension you hate clean air and clean water. And you're obviously far too stupid to make the correct choice in these matters, so laws will be passed to keep you neanderthals from trying to kill and poison the rest of us.

Looks like your compatriots are too thick to get your sarcasm.

racerdave600
racerdave600 Dork
9/22/14 4:56 p.m.

This degenerated quickly! While this may be an excuse, I think the real reason is the Evora isn't selling very well. The Elise was a much more attractive car to traditional Lotus buyers, where the Evora was trying to fit in a segment dominated by other makes, while still trying to be a "Lotus". The 4C was probably going to finish it off, assuming it ever makes it here in numbers.

And while I'm all for safety, I do believe the current setup is probably OK for smaller number manufacturers. Personally, if you get hit by anything remotely large in a Lotus, no amount of smart airbags are going to help you. If it has more than 5 lug nuts, you better be up-to-date on your prayers.

kanaric
kanaric Dork
9/22/14 5:18 p.m.

I hope a lot of Evora S's were imported so I can buy one in 10 years.

If not then I have no problem supercharging or turboing a Toyota V6.

irish44j
irish44j PowerDork
9/22/14 5:54 p.m.

If you really want safer cars, make them come with mandatory cellphone jammers and make it a $10k fine to disable it.

It's not cars that are unsafe, it's people who aren't paying attention who are unsafe.

oldeskewltoy
oldeskewltoy SuperDork
9/23/14 12:26 p.m.

the Evora was a mistake from the beginning... its a pudgy oversized.... Lotus

Don't panic, there is still a sports car available.... save your pennies and buy the 4C...

GameboyRMH
GameboyRMH GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
9/23/14 12:35 p.m.
oldeskewltoy wrote: Don't panic, there is still a sports car available.... save your pennies and buy the 4C...

Yes, save them and if you live to 100, sell them for the precious copper, and you'll be able to afford a 4C which will be the new Lotus Europa hell-project by then

Adrian_Thompson
Adrian_Thompson PowerDork
9/23/14 1:18 p.m.
oldeskewltoy wrote: the Evora was a mistake from the beginning... its a pudgy oversized.... Lotus Don't panic, there is still a sports car available.... save your pennies and buy the 4C...

Good point. Funny isn't it, Alfa has out Lotus'd Lotus

turboswede
turboswede UltimaDork
9/23/14 1:47 p.m.
oldeskewltoy wrote: the Evora was a mistake from the beginning... its a pudgy oversized.... Lotus Don't panic, there is still a sports car available.... save your pennies and buy the 4C...

That CEO that took the helm briefly and tried to move Lotus upmarket basically put another nail in their coffin.

If they had made the Evora with a removable roof option it might have actually sold better since people don't buy those types of cars for anything except buzzing around town or on a weekend drive, something the Elise did just as well especially with the addition of a removable top. The hardcore folks had the Exige, etc. for the track. So what exactly was the Evora trying to do?

Of course looking at the lotus model lineup over the decades, it never really made much sense:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotus_Cars

When the Esprit came out, it was sold along side the Elite, Eclat and then later the Excel all based around the same basic front engined, RWD chassis

Hopefully they can continue to offer cars in "kit" form to the US to allow limited use on the road (everywhere except Kalifornia of course).

JacktheRiffer
JacktheRiffer Reader
9/23/14 1:50 p.m.

Coming from daily driving a 280zx with no assists at all Ive noticed that it doesnt matter how many nannies are in place, some people just choose the use their car as a multi thousand pound couch that they think can drive itself. I just drive as defensively as possible and avoid all major traffic areas.

I agree with whoever made the comment about a cellphone jammer in cars. Would save a ton of people the trouble of deciding whether or not to check their phone to see how many likes they have now.

racerdave600
racerdave600 Dork
9/23/14 2:32 p.m.

If I drive my Dad's BMW, its a never ending sea of electronic inputs to preform simple tasks. There's far more than cellphone interruptions here, most newer cars have infotainment systems that require concentration to use. It's not like the old days when you could turn a dial or push a preset button. Now you have to navigate through multi-level screens to find what you want. We've made the task of driving a car about as distracting as we could, and then say we need more safety devices.

I'm all for safe cars, but we need to re-think the electronics that are going into the entertainment areas. Even my wife's new RAV4 is pretty in-depth in this area.

yamaha
yamaha UltimaDork
9/23/14 3:15 p.m.
PHeller wrote: I don't get it, I can go out and drive a huge RV without a CDL, that I could probably plow into a family in a 12 passenger van, killing everyone inside, and yet I can't own something that probably twice as a safe as most motorcycles on the road, which I may remind you, I can ride without a helmet. Dumb.

Ehhh, I wouldn't include old loti in that statement.......I think you're more likely to die in a europa/esprit s1 from fire than you are in a crash on a motorcycle.

OldGray320i
OldGray320i GRM+ Memberand Reader
9/23/14 6:38 p.m.
ShadowSix wrote:
OldGray320i wrote: Any of you people who oppose the safety regulations hate people, and by extension you hate clean air and clean water. And you're obviously far too stupid to make the correct choice in these matters, so laws will be passed to keep you neanderthals from trying to kill and poison the rest of us.
Looks like your compatriots are too thick to get your sarcasm.

Yeah, looks like some didn't pick up on that - they obviously haven't seen, or don't remember, some of my other posts, where I express my difficulty in wondering why, given a relatively healthy level of safety in modern cars, the consuming public isn't offered more choice.

Since in these types of discussions, it usually degenerates into "OldGray320i must hate clean air and water and cares not for the saftey of himself, his family, or others", I thought I'd just start out there.

mblommel
mblommel Reader
9/23/14 6:48 p.m.

Looks like it's just a 1 year hiatus: stupid jalopnik reports on evora

It'll be interesting to see what the new CEO cooks up for a return to profitability. A newer, U.S. compliant Elise would seem to be a must.

gjz30075
gjz30075 Reader
9/23/14 7:13 p.m.

I take offense to Lotus being called a boutique automaker. Chapman must be turning in his grave.

kanaric
kanaric Dork
9/23/14 7:29 p.m.
oldeskewltoy wrote: the Evora was a mistake from the beginning... its a pudgy oversized.... Lotus Don't panic, there is still a sports car available.... save your pennies and buy the 4C...

IDK, it was the same weight as a V8 Esprit and not much larger if not the same size.

GameboyRMH
GameboyRMH GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
9/24/14 12:08 p.m.

Good news (or bad news if you were hoping for your Lotus to appreciate), they'll be selling street-legal models again in 2016:

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2014/09/editorial-best-laid-plans-lotus-men/

Ian F
Ian F UltimaDork
9/24/14 1:06 p.m.
kanaric wrote: IDK, it was the same weight as a V8 Esprit and not much larger if not the same size.

The local dealer has had both on the lot side-by-side. The Esprit looks slightly smaller, but not much.

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
9/24/14 1:45 p.m.

Yeah, here's the release from Lotus:

Expansion within North America for Lotus

Lotus responds to the rumours that are circulating on Social Media and online

Lotus is fully committed to the North American market and will produce a 2016 Model Year Evora that will be fully compliant for Canada and the USA. Lotus will not be producing a 2015 model year Lotus Evora but there will be limited availability of 2014 model year Lotus Evora sports cars over the next few months. In addition, the Lotus Elise S Cup R and the Lotus Exige V6 Cup R are also sold in these markets for race and competition use only.

Jean-Marc Gales, Chief Executive Officer of Group Lotus plc said, “I know that this will be welcome news to our thousands of owners and fans in North America, but the reality is that there was never any intention to leave. The North American market is vitally important for us and we intend to expand our dealer network and grow our sales volumes in the future. In fact in the last twelve months, we have already appointed three new dealerships in the USA and are on course to appoint additional dealers in the next few months.”

Jean-Marc Gales continued, “Our customers, both current and future can rest easy, knowing that our car sales, aftersales and support services will continue and indeed improve in the future to support our growth in Canada and the USA. I would like to thank our fantastic Lotus following for their support over the years and remind them that we are working on many exciting products for the future. We will continue to explore our core vales on how to make a sports car better by making it faster, lighter and maintain the pure driving experience.”

Lotus currently has 45 dealers in North America and plans to open additional dealers in key market areas in Canada and the USA in the next few months.

ENDS

Rusnak_322
Rusnak_322 Dork
9/24/14 3:10 p.m.
Flyin Mikey J wrote:
GameboyRMH wrote: Lighter cars are safer overall if everyone has lighter cars. The SUV craze of the late '89s/early '90s started a safety arms race that's still going on.
This is why I feel there should be somewhat of a weight tax when registering a vehicle. Like truckers pay at the scales. Tax the fat SUVs into oblivion in the name of road wear and overall safety of society.

There is sort of a tax now. You get 15 miles per gallon in a big pig SUV at $3.50 per gal compared to 30+ in a smaller car you pay $700 a year extra just in fuel costs (if my maths are right).

Then again – some of us need a SUV with lots of kids. We haul their friends around, the in-laws on occasion. Trips to the Costco and we have to pull an enclosed trailer full of motorcycles.

I see just as many bad drivers in Kias and other crapy small cars as I do in SUVs.

On a side note – I hope this news causes those $48k evoras to drop in price so that my wife will be able to afford one next summer. Right now, the top three on her list are used Boxster, used Elise or a new Miata. We will be keeping the SUV for family stuff.

oldeskewltoy
oldeskewltoy SuperDork
9/24/14 3:58 p.m.
David S. Wallens wrote: Yeah, here's the release from Lotus: Expansion within North America for Lotus Lotus responds to the rumours that are circulating on Social Media and online Lotus is fully committed to the North American market and will produce a 2016 Model Year Evora that will be fully compliant for Canada and the USA. Lotus will not be producing a 2015 model year Lotus Evora but there will be limited availability of 2014 model year Lotus Evora sports cars over the next few months. In addition, the Lotus Elise S Cup R and the Lotus Exige V6 Cup R are also sold in these markets for race and competition use only. Jean-Marc Gales, Chief Executive Officer of Group Lotus plc said, “I know that this will be welcome news to our thousands of owners and fans in North America, but the reality is that there was never any intention to leave. The North American market is vitally important for us and we intend to expand our dealer network and grow our sales volumes in the future. In fact in the last twelve months, we have already appointed three new dealerships in the USA and are on course to appoint additional dealers in the next few months.” Jean-Marc Gales continued, “Our customers, both current and future can rest easy, knowing that our car sales, aftersales and support services will continue and indeed improve in the future to support our growth in Canada and the USA. I would like to thank our fantastic Lotus following for their support over the years and remind them that we are working on many exciting products for the future. We will continue to explore our core vales on how to make a sports car better by making it faster, lighter and maintain the pure driving experience.” Lotus currently has 45 dealers in North America and plans to open additional dealers in key market areas in Canada and the USA in the next few months. ENDS
gjz30075 wrote: Chapman must be turning in his grave.

Tom_Spangler
Tom_Spangler GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
9/24/14 4:20 p.m.
David S. Wallens wrote: Yeah, here's the release from Lotus:

Wow, all that fuss over nothing. Don't you all feel a bit silly now?

Wally
Wally MegaDork
9/24/14 4:37 p.m.

Why doesn't the argument that manual transmissions make you a better driver because you have to think about it carry over to needing to think about the radio and climate control?

Nick_Comstock
Nick_Comstock PowerDork
9/24/14 7:30 p.m.
Tom_Spangler wrote:
David S. Wallens wrote: Yeah, here's the release from Lotus:
Wow, all that fuss over nothing. Don't you all feel a bit silly now?

Meh, no more than usual.

Flyin Mikey J
Flyin Mikey J Reader
9/24/14 8:01 p.m.
Rusnak_322 wrote:
Flyin Mikey J wrote:
GameboyRMH wrote: Lighter cars are safer overall if everyone has lighter cars. The SUV craze of the late '89s/early '90s started a safety arms race that's still going on.
This is why I feel there should be somewhat of a weight tax when registering a vehicle. Like truckers pay at the scales. Tax the fat SUVs into oblivion in the name of road wear and overall safety of society.
There is sort of a tax now. You get 15 miles per gallon in a big pig SUV at $3.50 per gal compared to 30+ in a smaller car you pay $700 a year extra just in fuel costs (if my maths are right). Then again – some of us need a SUV with lots of kids. We haul their friends around, the in-laws on occasion. Trips to the Costco and we have to pull an enclosed trailer full of motorcycles. I see just as many bad drivers in Kias and other crapy small cars as I do in SUVs. On a side note – I hope this news causes those $48k evoras to drop in price so that my wife will be able to afford one next summer. Right now, the top three on her list are used Boxster, used Elise or a new Miata. We will be keeping the SUV for family stuff.

The fuel costs are somewhat offset by lower insurance rates, as if you are insuring yourself not what you hit.

Vigo
Vigo PowerDork
9/24/14 9:04 p.m.

I think the most interesting discussion in this thread is about why the Evora isn't working.

I think part of the reason the Evora isn't an enthusiast favorite is because it's viewed as a de-facto stand-in for a halo car that Lotus doesn't make, and in those terms it is an underachiever.

In the last days of the Esprit, the top-range Lotus had objective performance stats that were in the same ballpark as a Ferrari 360 Modena or F430. It may have been old, but it was still 'super'.

Now, even though the supercharged Evora S probably matches the last Esprit in quantifiable performance, the 'supercar' category has moved well beyond it. Lotus says the Evora is supposed to compete with the Cayman. I would rather have an Evora than a Cayman personally, but the thing is, who compares them? I feel like the Evora is viewed in this unfortunate way where we tend to compare it to things above its weight class and end up unexcited when if we were all locked in a room with an Evora we'd probably all come out liking it more than we expected to.

Not sure what Lotus should have done different. Could they have even pulled off a real halo car? Things like borrowing engines sort of undermine prestige even if the engines are great. I'm guessing they couldn't have pulled off a real halo car because of the same problems the Evora has: not being able to cultivate enough prestige to make it a 'gotta have' product even if it was great. Lotus sucks at marketing itself.

Having said that, they definitely should have built the 4C before Alfa did.

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