1 2
Carl Heideman
Carl Heideman
12/12/22 9:52 a.m.

So we fix a lot of aircooled and transaxle Porsches at Eclectic Motorworks and I went for a long time without owning a Porsche. A few years ago, I decided I probably should own one, so I bought a pristine, low mileage 1999 996 when they were at the bottom of the depreciation curve. I don't really love it, mainly because it's black and the interior is as cheap as everyone says, and I'm thinking it might be time to move it on and maybe get a less pristine and higher mileage 997 that I can enjoy more. 

The car is a base model with literally no options (see below), but it only has 28K miles and the IMS has been done.

Since the car has such low mileage, I'm hoping to get a decent price for it. But it has aftermarket wheels. I've put some feelers out and that seems to be an issue with the purists. I'm a bit of a Porsche trivia poseur, but agree a low mileage car should have the original wheels.

Some quick searching leads me to believe it had 17" wheels when new. There is a decent set of Twist 17x7.5 and 17x9 wheels on FB near me with 52 and 47 mm offsets. Are these the correct wheels for this car?  If not, what would be correct?

Also, any advice on where to try to sell it?  I don't think I want the hassle of an online auction so I'm thinking about just putting it up for sale locally on FB or maybe even sending it to a consignment place that will put too high a price on it but probably get me a decent amount after their commission. 

Thanks!

AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter)
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand UberDork
12/12/22 9:57 a.m.

In reply to Carl Heideman :

Yes those are the correct 17s.

docwyte
docwyte PowerDork
12/12/22 10:10 a.m.

Those are the correct offsets.  I suggest joining the proper porsche FB groups and listing it there.  However for top dollar I'd suggest either Cars and Bids or BaT.

Carl Heideman
Carl Heideman
12/12/22 11:00 a.m.

Anthony and docwyte, thanks for the fast response. I'm going to get those wheels tonight if possible.

docwyte, thanks for the suggestions. I don't necessary want top dollar, but close. The FB groups ideas makes sense.

CAinCA
CAinCA GRM+ Memberand HalfDork
12/12/22 11:48 a.m.

In reply to Carl Heideman :

I'd post it on Rennlist, Planet-9, and PCA if you're a member.

mainlandboy
mainlandboy Reader
12/12/22 12:04 p.m.

To really upset the purists, how about some twists with a spoke missing? cheeky

docwyte
docwyte PowerDork
12/12/22 3:38 p.m.

In reply to Carl Heideman :

If you want close to top dollar, you're not gonna get it from a FB group or Rennlist.  It needs to go on an auction site like BaT or Cars and Bids.

AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter)
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand UberDork
12/12/22 5:01 p.m.
docwyte said:

In reply to Carl Heideman :

If you want close to top dollar, you're not gonna get it from a FB group or Rennlist.  It needs to go on an auction site like BaT or Cars and Bids.

This is true.  The sad part is that since it's a 99 the original IMS bearing was probably fine.  

Carl Heideman
Carl Heideman
12/14/22 10:20 a.m.

Thanks again everyone for the advice and the wheel confirmation. The FB wheel seller went from "I'll be home after 5" to being increasingly vague, so I don't think that set of wheels for real.

To cut to the chase, I would like to get around $30K for it. I see higher mileage cars with asking prices in that range and BAT auctions show low mileage cars like mine higher than that. I see some low mileage cars with asking prices closer to 40 and even higher from dealers and consignors.

As mentioned, mine has 28K miles, the previous owner had the IMS done, zero options. The PO had a independent shops work on it, some that specialized in Porsches, some that did not. I've done the maintenance at Eclectic since I've owned it. There is a ding in the sunroof--PO said a walnut hit it. The frunk lid was repainted very well at some point, so I can't call it an original paint car (I could lie like everyone else who thinks they have original paint, but won't). And the wheels are not correct.

So, should I just stop overthinking it and list it as is, or should I get the correct wheels and get the ding in the sunroof fixed? That'll cost me the price of the wheels plus a few hundred bucks at the bodyshop (I talked to two PDR guys who didn't think they could fix it)--will these fixes make the car more valuable or easier to sell? I'm thinking that the purists may not love the car anyway since it doesn't have dealer service records, etc..

It's funny, if this were just about any of my other cars, I'd know the market, know how to best sell it, etc.. But since I'm a Porsche poseur I sure appreciate the advice.

 

Caprigrip
Caprigrip Reader
12/14/22 10:29 a.m.

In reply to Carl Heideman :

Those wheels aren't my favorite but they don't detract from the car.   BAT has a long lead time and while I haven't sold on Cars and Bids, I did reach out to them for a car in the past and they were quick to respond.   That will bring you the most money and be easier than showing local people if you list on FB.  I say list it as it is, you seem honest with your writing so disclose the dent and the repainted tail.  Someone is going to love this car.  

Opti
Opti SuperDork
12/14/22 10:54 a.m.

Disclaimer: I'm not a porsche guy

On other sports car I've seen that a certain group prefers a stripper model. Less stuff to fail, less weight, more in line with the manufacturers original vision. I'd lean into that in the marketing and present it as clean as possible.

 

Super good detail, engine bay, undercarriage, wheel wells etc, find every piece of documentation you have on the car, pdr the dent, put the stock wheels on, and have it serviced. Then lots of pictures of everything.The buyer should feel confident that when they pick this up all they have to do is enjoy it.

 

Go for the cleanest, best condition, low mileage 996 on the market, and I think you'll get top dollar for it.

 

Currently there are an 8, 20k and 36k mile 996 for sale on BaT. The 20K car the dealers been driving and hasn't been serviced in over a year. The 8K is clean and the 36K convertible has a couple problems listed. So there aren't many alternative for sale if you can legitimately say zero problems or concerns, low mileage and good documentation.

 

 

dps214
dps214 Dork
12/14/22 11:21 a.m.

I'd at least list it as is while you look for stock wheels. I don't think the wheels are a make it/break it item, but it would be nice to at lest be able to say you have stock wheels to go with it. You're right that it's not fully pristine anyway, so it's more about buyer taste of which wheels they prefer than the car needing to come with the stock wheels for originality.

With porsche the option level is kind of a crapshoot for desirability. Everything is optioned a la carte, so super high option cars are generally desirable, but a lot of times it's "take what you can get" or there's a few specific options that the buyer is looking for. Zero option cars are usually somewhat uncommon though, at least in the modern ones, not really sure for the 996.

Olemiss540
Olemiss540 HalfDork
12/14/22 12:35 p.m.

Carl, 

Just post this same information over on Rennlist and see if it moves quickly. That's probably a better bet than dealing with Facebook idiots (no offense to those active FB users) with "is this still available" and "Do you accept Western Union as a form of payment so my cousin came buy it tomorrow if you ship it using a tow company to my place in Saudi Arabia".

Rennlist you will atleast have people that know what they are looking at and have a verifiable pretense/history posting on the forum. Should be easy to get close to what you are asking I would think given the mileage.

docwyte
docwyte PowerDork
12/15/22 8:49 a.m.

Stripper 996 base trim isn't a really desirable car, sadly.  Low mileage is great, but again, it's not that desirable of a car.  I'm not sure $30k is the right number for it but I've got to admit I don't watch the "regular" 996 market that carefully and I still remember when these were $10-15k cars, so my perspective is colored.

I wouldn't get the sunroof ding fixed, original paint is worth more than fixing a small ding there.  Original wheels would be nice given the low mileage of the car.

It doesn't hurt to throw it out there for sale, but given the spec, mileage and time of year, you're much better off getting it as nice/stock as possible and listing it on Cars and Bids or BaT.

AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter)
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand UberDork
12/15/22 9:40 a.m.

Someone WILL want this car.  I disagree with docwyte, while not special a low option 99 is desired by quite a few people.  I would post it on BaT if it were mine.  I'd also wait until it I had the right wheels and new tires on them.  
 

For me the only 996s I'm really interested in are 99 aero kit cars or the 40th annicersary cars.  I missed the twin turbo boat long ago.  If I ever go Porsche shopping again, it'll probably be for a 997 S with sport seats and sport chrono in an interesting color.  

dps214
dps214 Dork
12/15/22 9:46 a.m.
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) said:

Someone WILL want this car.  I disagree with docwyte, while not special a low option 99 is desired by quite a few people.  I would post it on BaT if it were mine.  I'd also wait until it I had the right wheels and new tires on them.  
 

For me the only 996s I'm really interested in are 99 aero kit cars or the 40th annicersary cars.  I missed the twin turbo boat long ago.  If I ever go Porsche shopping again, it'll probably be for a 997 S with sport seats and sport chrono in an interesting color.  

But are they desirable in the way that someone would pay top dollar for one? (honest question, in my mind they'd be 'desirable' because you'd expect to get a decent deal on it, but porsche people always find ways to surprise me)

Given the current state of the market, time of year, etc, I think I'd either take whatever I can get for it now as is or hold onto it, get it perfect, hope the market doesn't fully crash over winter, and try to get it on BaT in the spring.

AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter)
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand UberDork
12/15/22 10:37 a.m.

In reply to dps214 :

Yes someone will pay top dollar for a low option low mile 99.  With great photos, and lots of replies by the seller on BaT this car will bring good money which will surprise non P car people.  A big name Porsche engine builder tells people all the time the best 996s are base 99s.  They are very different from a 2004 car to day the least.  If you took an air cooled 911 and upgraded it to water cooled, you get a base model 99.  After that lots of refinements and electronics and options got tacked on fast.  

STM317
STM317 PowerDork
12/15/22 11:07 a.m.

Factory original wheels and new tires will probably cost a couple grand right? Will they add that much in value to the selling price of the car? If they can't at least pay for themselves, I'd just list it as-is and let the potential buyer put the wheels of their choice on it. The current wheels seem fine to me, and don't detract from the looks (but I'm no Porsche man).

docwyte
docwyte PowerDork
12/15/22 1:51 p.m.

I just don't think a low option base 996 = more money, more desirability.  Aero kit?  Yes.  No sunroof?  Yes.  40th anniversary or some special edition?  Yes.  My 996 turbo is a pretty low option car, I don't think that makes it worth more or be any more desirable than one with more options.

I'm happy to be proven wrong tho!

Olemiss540
Olemiss540 HalfDork
12/15/22 3:51 p.m.
docwyte said:

I just don't think a low option base 996 = more money, more desirability.  Aero kit?  Yes.  No sunroof?  Yes.  40th anniversary or some special edition?  Yes.  My 996 turbo is a pretty low option car, I don't think that's make it worth more or be any more desirable than one with more options.

I'm happy to be proven wrong tho!

I think it's more likely what folks are saying is that they feel like the low mileage outweighs the option package in terms of value drivers. I have to agree a 996 option list is probably not a big deal to someone looking at a rare (due to low mileage) Pcar. Even higher mileage 996s have went up to the upper teens/low 20s, so getting high 20s for a car like this seems very likely.

Carl Heideman
Carl Heideman
12/15/22 4:42 p.m.

Thanks again for the additional comments and thoughts. Here is just a little more of the story. I have a friend who brokers cars and last year after sending about 50 pictures of every detail he had my car sold to a well-known national dealer who offered me $31K plus his commission.  I was amazed to get that offer/price and of course took it. Just before the deal closed, they changed their minds and felt that the wheels, the ding, and the lack of dealer service records didn't quite meet their standards. So the questions I've been asking took away the easy button, and I'm back to looking for the easy button...

I like to flowchart things, and I see two marketplaces for this car in my flow chart: 

  1. People who really know Porsches and may or  may not think this is a good car
  2. The rest of the world, who just want a Porsche but don't know much about them

For Market #1, I've been trying to figure out what its worth and what to upgrade/change and that's why I asked you. For Market #2, it seems pretty easy: Its a Porsche, it's low mileage, it's in great shape. I'm more and more thinking I'll go for Market #2 at my price and stop overthinking it. Or send it to a consignment dealer and let them do their work, most likely with Market #2. I've sold hundreds of cars and for some reason I'm not quite getting how to sell this one. 

Thanks again for all of the thoughts and ideas. I'll let you know what happens.  I may wait until Spring as I'm in the snowbelt.

By the way, the wheels were only $500 and I figured I could sell the fifth one, sell the current wheels, and not have much difference in the spend. But it looks like those wheels don't really exist as the guy is no longer responding.

AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter)
AnthonyGS (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand UberDork
12/15/22 8:36 p.m.

You can find some 17 twists on Rennlist and sell the current wheels.  99s are more desirable to many 996 buyers than later years for a few reasons.  New tires, detail, good photos, BaT and viola.  That's what I'd do.  

grover
grover GRM+ Memberand Dork
12/15/22 9:04 p.m.

I'm looking at 911's currently as I expect to buy one in the next 18 months or less. I'd like one similar to yours, although I'll probably go convertible because south Florida. 
 

I generally pass on looking at 911's with aftermarket wheels. To me they speak to a certain owner- and not one who takes care of their car- which is obviously not true in this case. There are some weird owners of sports cars and wheels to me are a trigger. 
 

I'm probably wrong, but I'm also likely in your group of buyers  

 

Opti
Opti SuperDork
12/15/22 10:00 p.m.

I n reply to docwyte :

lightest version, only year with throttle cable, no PSM, less stuff to break. Purists version.

It will not appeal to the people that want it as a status symbol, which is a large amount of porsche buyers (not a shot at porsche, it also applies to any performance/luxury marque), but if you find the right guy, I think he'd pay top dollar for it if its presented and marketed correctly.

Some people want base miatas, base minis, prefer lt1s over ls1s etc etc etc. People tastes differ, and you might not have the standard sought after 996 911 but I do think you have something special enough to take a shot after marketing to the guys that are hunting for one.

PS: this is not my normal recommendation. The standard recommendation is clean it real well, fix easy cheap stuff, and sell what you got, because most cars have plenty of alternatives, so you dont get your money back on repairs. I dont think there are a ton of cars on the market like yours, so you have a chance at fetching top dollar to the right buyer and actually seeing some return on a little investment.

Just my .02

 

Opti
Opti SuperDork
12/15/22 10:44 p.m.

Here is a similar low spec 99 with more miles. No mention of IMS being done and its not a special color.

Sold for 35 3 days ago on BAT

1 2

You'll need to log in to post.

Our Preferred Partners
ZjnDlBbZfdRP60D2dz64hWAJ7ebBySqbS9cFKxpFF2VC28Xk1rkmxGhhlRKC3IUh