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David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
1/2/20 1:45 p.m.
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Those who bought a Tesla Model 3 Performance with hopes of dominating SCCA autocross might want to chill for a few: Effective January 1, that car has been moved from B Street all the way to Super Street.

David Marcus drove a Model 3 to last year's Solo title, holding off Mark Daddio’s 20…

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Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/2/20 1:49 p.m.

Wow!

NickD
NickD PowerDork
1/2/20 1:54 p.m.

Ooooooooof.

RedBarchetta
RedBarchetta New Reader
1/2/20 2:01 p.m.

This is the SEB's way of shaking their fist at a cloud and telling electric car owners to GET OFF MY LAWN.

1988RedT2
1988RedT2 MegaDork
1/2/20 2:03 p.m.

NickD
NickD PowerDork
1/2/20 2:05 p.m.

Can't wait for the Elon Musk angry tweets about this. Maybe he'll call the SEB a bunch of pedophiles too.

 

mtn
mtn MegaDork
1/2/20 2:06 p.m.
RedBarchetta said:

This is the SEB's way of telling electric car owners to GET OFF MY LAWN.

I kind of feel the same way. Wasn't the driver already a National Champion in a different class a few years ago? So it isn't like some random jabroni jumped in and embarrassed everyone, and he won by not even a 1/10th of a second... Seems like it was in the right class already?

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/2/20 2:07 p.m.

Or he'll look at it as a compliment. The M3P has received a power bump via an OTA upgrade since the end of the season. I suspect the regular Model 3 (currently in DS) will get a revisit as well, as it's up about 15% with the optional "Acceleration Boost". That car has different suspension and skinnier tires, but in terms of performance it's a lot closer to the Performance than it used to be.

NickD
NickD PowerDork
1/2/20 2:09 p.m.
mtn said:
RedBarchetta said:

This is the SEB's way of telling electric car owners to GET OFF MY LAWN.

I kind of feel the same way. Wasn't the driver already a National Champion in a different class a few years ago? So it isn't like some random jabroni jumped in and embarrassed everyone, and he won by not even a 1/10th of a second... Seems like it was in the right class already?

It's new and different, of course it rubs the SCCA the wrong way. A win by 0.070 seconds hardly seems worth going to S/Street. I could see if they even tested it in A/Street for a season.

Justjim75
Justjim75 Dork
1/2/20 2:10 p.m.

"The key to winning is finding the unfair advantage "

spacecadet
spacecadet GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
1/2/20 2:10 p.m.
mtn said:
RedBarchetta said:

This is the SEB's way of telling electric car owners to GET OFF MY LAWN.

I kind of feel the same way. Wasn't the driver already a National Champion in a different class a few years ago? So it isn't like some random jabroni jumped in and embarrassed everyone, and he won by not even a 1/10th of a second... Seems like it was in the right class already?

the issue isn't the driver or the hardware of the car itself. it's the fact that the car is getting over the air updates to increase the performance through software. Thus taking a car that started the year competitive in BS and now on the way to possibly being a class killer.

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/2/20 2:13 p.m.

It's an interesting problem to have to face, that's for sure. And it's going to start happening with more cars.

RadBarchetta
RadBarchetta New Reader
1/2/20 2:15 p.m.

In reply to mtn :

This is a great example of the SEB classing cars based on politics rather than performance. Not the first time, either.

captdownshift
captdownshift GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
1/2/20 2:17 p.m.

It should only be B stock if utilizing autopilot. 

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/2/20 2:19 p.m.

I want to see someone stand at the finish line and summon the car. That could be pretty interesting.

Also, the center screen now shows traffic cones. Could make for a pretty fun watch. Maybe we cover the windshield and make the driver navigate by the screen...

 

NickD
NickD PowerDork
1/2/20 2:26 p.m.
Keith Tanner said:

Also, the center screen now shows traffic cones. Could make for a pretty fun watch. Maybe we cover the windshield and make the driver navigate by the screen...

 

I feel like a safety steward might have something to say about that.

mtn
mtn MegaDork
1/2/20 2:29 p.m.

I did not even think about OTA updates!! Yeah, that could make for a big deal. 

NickD
NickD PowerDork
1/2/20 3:16 p.m.

I'm also curious if, maybe, he'll just say "Berk it" and make some crazy autocross software, or make a ridiculous autocross version. It's Elon Musk, one can never predict.

Confession: I bummed my friend's phone and twitter account (I'm not a Twitter user) and shot him a tweet asking his feelings on the subject. If nothing else, might get a weird, uninformed rant.

_
_ Dork
1/2/20 3:47 p.m.

We should all remember that this is the first time that a Tesla has been used to win national championship. That means the more they dial it in, the greater margin that win will be next year and the coming years

dps214
dps214 Reader
1/2/20 4:22 p.m.

Yes, he won by less than a tenth of a second. In a car with completely unmodified suspension that has since gotten a substantial power bump. There's a fair amount more left in the car than what he showed. AS was two people short of being the largest single class at nationals this year and is probably the most consistently attended class across the full national event season, there's absolutely no reason the SCCA should be risking the success of that class to appease the handful of people who want to autocross their teslas. THe right solution is a street EV class, which it sounds like will happen eventually but "now isn't the time". I'm not exactly sure I agree with that, but then again think about how many people will be whining about "too many classes" if they did make that new class only to never have more than three people show up all year. Which is about the current level of tesla participation at the national level as far as I can tell.

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/2/20 4:36 p.m.

I don't think "street EV" makes any sense, because the choice of propulsion is a small aspect of what makes a car good at autox. It makes more sense to keep them mixed together. EVs might punch above their weight (so to speak) but they're not all going to be as fast as an M3P. Show up with an electric Fiat and you'll get your butt handed to you if you're up against nothing but other EVs.

pinchvalve
pinchvalve MegaDork
1/2/20 4:38 p.m.

Is anyone working on allowed EV modifications? What is the equivalent of a cold air intake...running a larger gauge wire? What happens if you swap the magnets in the motors? Would anyone even know if a car was running a larger motor? Or half a battery pack? (to save weight)  I don't envy the SEB.

jharry3
jharry3 GRM+ Memberand HalfDork
1/2/20 4:52 p.m.

Kind of reminds me of  how the turbine engine was effectively outlawed from Indy cars by cutting the  allowed intake area.  

Not to mention Jim Hall's 2D with moveable wing being outlawed and the  Chaparral 2J sucker car the same.   

I thoroughly dislike people who outlaw innovation that changes the game.     

Though I guess the trebuchet builders were pissed at the cannon builders for good reason. Not to mention the longbow union fighting against firearms being introduced.  

Come to think of it I haven't seen anyone using a horse for transportation since last year's Houston Rodeo ride.  The saddle makers need to stop that internal combustion engine before it takes away from their business.

Fueled by Caffeine
Fueled by Caffeine MegaDork
1/2/20 4:53 p.m.

Just saw a post on Comment from David Marcus on Facebook..

 

"I didn't love autocrossing the Telsa, and mine got retired from autocross right after Nationals.  It accelerates like nothing I've ever felt, but corners like E36M3.  Its the polar opposite of a miata and I'd rather autocross a Miata"...

 

Interesting words coming from a National Champion.

Was on the National Autocross news  post about this rule change..  Can't link on this computer..

 

Linky to facebook

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
1/2/20 5:15 p.m.
pinchvalve said:

Is anyone working on allowed EV modifications? What is the equivalent of a cold air intake...running a larger gauge wire? What happens if you swap the magnets in the motors? Would anyone even know if a car was running a larger motor? Or half a battery pack? (to save weight)  I don't envy the SEB.

I don't know of any Tesla power upgrades other than those coming from Tesla itself. I suppose you could bolt the stronger RWD/M3P rear motor into a Long Range if you wanted a cheater, but then you'd have the same running gear as a M3P without the suspension. Running a partial battery pack to save weight is an interesting idea!

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