Ecutek is not actively working on the ND2 at this point. OFT does not have full control over the ECU as far as I know, just a couple of tables.
Ecutek is not actively working on the ND2 at this point. OFT does not have full control over the ECU as far as I know, just a couple of tables.
Reduce the weight of the car. Start at the wheels/tires as already suggested. Carbon fiber body panels? All newer cars doors are really heavy to meet crash tests.
Reduce the car's rotating inertia and shorten the gearing. A lighter flywheel, lighter wheels, and the aforementioned 3.54:1 diff would do what you're looking for, and if you want a smaller change go to wheels and tires with a smaller diameter and don't change the diff.
It's worth noting that the effects of decreasing rotating inertia is greatest at low speed. In higher gears, it's a lot less noticeable because the rate of acceleration of the components involved is a lot slower.
I can dig up stock wheel weights if anyone's interested.
Yes, but by the time you're up to speed the engine's turning at enough RPM to be into the power even in the higher gears. Something that helps a lot in 1st or 2nd gear will get the thing away from lights and out of city street corners effectively.
Now, if he's looking at how to get the thing to go at 1800 RPM in 6th - not much other than a nitrous oxide system, turbocharger, or four extra cylinders would help.
In reply to chaparral :
I'd love to see the aftereffects of hitting nitrous at 1800 in 6th 
In reply to Knurled. :
Slightly banana'd rods, probably.
How big a nitrous kit ad how's it controlled? Just enough flow to immediately reach the existing peak torque but at those speeds shouldn't do much harm...
chaparral said:Yes, but by the time you're up to speed the engine's turning at enough RPM to be into the power even in the higher gears. Something that helps a lot in 1st or 2nd gear will get the thing away from lights and out of city street corners effectively.
Now, if he's looking at how to get the thing to go at 1800 RPM in 6th - not much other than a nitrous oxide system, turbocharger, or four extra cylinders would help.
In my experience, when someone's asking for a little more midrange, it's not so they can get through first gear faster and clear an intersection. It's for more casual driving when you can't be bothered to downshift, and in those speed ranges inertial losses are relatively small.
Keith Tanner said:I can dig up stock wheel weights if anyone's interested.
I'm curious. The ND wheels already look pretty light to me, and might be nice choices for other vehicles.
How is air metered for the ND2? I'm reminded of the (actually functional) electric supercharger that the one gentleman here is running on his hillclimb/AX first gen in the Pacific NW. Thoughts on that, Keith?
Let's see...
On our scales, the stock GT wheel is 18 lbs. The BBS from the Club Brembo/BBS package is 16.15. Both 17x7s, I believe although I might be mistaken there. The whole car is pretty relentlessly weight-optimized, the engine block looks as it was shrinkwrapped around the coolant passages. The full engine (all accessories, flywheel/clutch, oil and wiring harness) is 290 lbs. Stock flywheel weight is 15.15 lbs.
Air is metered via MAF and I think there might be a MAP in there as well. Using a little fan to push a bit more air into the intake seems like it could work, kind of a hybrid system that uses a fan instead of a motor.
That's really solid. As we all know the ND is without moden comparison by weighing the same as it's 30 years old equivalent.
By comparison, the FiST 17x7 wheel are 22.5lbs. The Oz Ultralaggas 16x7 on my car are 14.7. I think the BRZ/FRS 17x7 are 20.5lbs.
Keith Tanner said:chaparral said:Yes, but by the time you're up to speed the engine's turning at enough RPM to be into the power even in the higher gears. Something that helps a lot in 1st or 2nd gear will get the thing away from lights and out of city street corners effectively.
Now, if he's looking at how to get the thing to go at 1800 RPM in 6th - not much other than a nitrous oxide system, turbocharger, or four extra cylinders would help.
In my experience, when someone's asking for a little more midrange, it's not so they can get through first gear faster and clear an intersection. It's for more casual driving when you can't be bothered to downshift, and in those speed ranges inertial losses are relatively small.
In other words, people want the hipstersnobbery of a manual transmission but are annoyed by the fact that they have to actually SHIFT to accelerate, like some sort of peasant?
BoxheadTim said:In reply to frenchyd :
As Keith mentioned above there, nobody's really been able to get into the ND2 ECU yet, so remapping it for E85 and potentially integrating a sensor into the existing electronics simply isn't possible right now.
The 'vette has a rather hackable ECU and less complicated electronics than a 2019 Miata.
Apparently you need to talk to Edelbrock. Seems they have hacked the Miata including making it work with a supercharger and E85.
Frenchy, not the ND2 (2019+) model under discussion here. Maybe you should check with Edelbrock :)
Keith Tanner said:Let's see...
On our scales, the stock GT wheel is 18 lbs. The BBS from the Club Brembo/BBS package is 16.15. Both 17x7s, I believe although I might be mistaken there. The whole car is pretty relentlessly weight-optimized, the engine block looks as it was shrinkwrapped around the coolant passages. The full engine (all accessories, flywheel/clutch, oil and wiring harness) is 290 lbs. Stock flywheel weight is 15.15 lbs.
Air is metered via MAF and I think there might be a MAP in there as well. Using a little fan to push a bit more air into the intake seems like it could work, kind of a hybrid system that uses a fan instead of a motor.
I know I'm a bit off topic here, but bear with me.
In 198x, every car magazine was taking whatever wheezing 200 hp V8 they could get their hands on, throwing on headers, intake, carb, maybe some heads, and basically doubling the output.
It's a few years later, sure, but what amazing time are we living in when the premier model-specific modification house is basically saying: "The exhaust it comes with is pretty great. The intake it comes with is pretty great. The fuel injection is pretty great. It's actually nearly optimized for weight and durability, there's not much to be gained here..."
I know I am oversimplifying (and not trying to tell you not to spend money at FM!), and that forced induction exists, but wow. What a time to be a car enthusiast. Can you imagine the drudgery that was the 80's and 90's OEM offerings if they continued on that trajectory? There are little things you can do to make it sharper, a bit more aggressive, and the suspension can get more track focused, but golly, what a time.
frenchyd said:In reply to SVreX :
Try E85, yes you'll need to add the sensor to read what percentage of alcohol you actually get but my flex fuel pickup feels like it got a lot more power.
Modern vehicles haven't "needed" a Flex Fuel sensor to run E85 tunes for years.
I purchased my BRZ in Oct 2015..............it was running an E85 tune with less than 500 miles on the clock. There is a bit of extra procedure to not use a Flex Fuel sensor, but it's easily done.
frenchyd said:BoxheadTim said:In reply to frenchyd :
As Keith mentioned above there, nobody's really been able to get into the ND2 ECU yet, so remapping it for E85 and potentially integrating a sensor into the existing electronics simply isn't possible right now.
The 'vette has a rather hackable ECU and less complicated electronics than a 2019 Miata.
Apparently you need to talk to Edelbrock. Seems they have hacked the Miata including making it work with a supercharger and E85.
I have already emailed Edelbrock and EcuTEK regarding this (19+ ND).
Edelbrock has said they aren't going to bother developing a new kit until EcuTek has cracked the ECU. EcuTek has said it's no even on their product development roadmap in 2020 because of how little demand there is. I've even started threads and shared their exact responses on this forum.
tuna55 said:
I know I'm a bit off topic here, but bear with me.
In 198x, every car magazine was taking whatever wheezing 200 hp V8 they could get their hands on, throwing on headers, intake, carb, maybe some heads, and basically doubling the output.
It's a few years later, sure, but what amazing time are we living in when the premier model-specific modification house is basically saying: "The exhaust it comes with is pretty great. The intake it comes with is pretty great. The fuel injection is pretty great. It's actually nearly optimized for weight and durability, there's not much to be gained here..."
I know I am oversimplifying (and not trying to tell you not to spend money at FM!), and that forced induction exists, but wow. What a time to be a car enthusiast. Can you imagine the drudgery that was the 80's and 90's OEM offerings if they continued on that trajectory? There are little things you can do to make it sharper, a bit more aggressive, and the suspension can get more track focused, but golly, what a time.
Wheezy v8s aside, in the sport compact-ish world bolt-on modifications have produced very consistent gains over the years as far as I'm aware. Almost every ST* prepped car (intake, header, full exhaust, tune - but no more boost) has produced slightly more than the factory crank rated output, but at the wheels. This ranges from late 80s Civic Si to the ND1 Miata, a whole bunch of stuff in between. The possible exception here is the NA Miatas which don't seem respond well to ST breathing mods.
Knurled. said:Hm... does the ND's new engine share the bellhousing pattern of the old MZR engines?
No they are not but BBR makes and adaptor kit for it. Dropping an earlier transmission is being discussed (Miata.net) as a stronger option for those that have issues with the ND transmission. This adaptor makes it much more realistic. BUT, you do also have to change the rear gear.
https://bbrgti.com/collections/mazda-mx-5-nd/products/bbr-mx-5-nd-nc-gearbox-conversion-set
Note that I never said that the stock exhaust was "pretty great" and shouldn't be changed :) We've got dyno proof that it can be quite effective on this platform, and we're backing up those tests with another car right now. Intakes we've tested have not been worthwhile. It really is a good little engine. As for suspension - Mazda did a great job of building a suspension for their planned audience. But there's always room to change your chosen attributes. It's just difficult to do that without really screwing some of the existing attributes. I'm going to say that cheap and/or poorly done suspension on the ND is going to be much more poorly done because the baseline is high. When you start with a car with a less competent suspension (I'm looking at you, 2006-12 Miatas) even a poorly done aftermarket setup can be an improvement.
As for wheel hp vs rated crank hp - either Mazda is underrating these cars or that is one really efficient drivetrain. They're showing very little drivetrain loss.
z31maniac said:frenchyd said:In reply to SVreX :
Try E85, yes you'll need to add the sensor to read what percentage of alcohol you actually get but my flex fuel pickup feels like it got a lot more power.
Modern vehicles haven't "needed" a Flex Fuel sensor to run E85 tunes for years.
I purchased my BRZ in Oct 2015..............it was running an E85 tune with less than 500 miles on the clock. There is a bit of extra procedure to not use a Flex Fuel sensor, but it's easily done.
Thank you.
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