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NickD
NickD UltimaDork
1/22/21 4:30 p.m.

Toyota has released this link saying that they are aware of the outcry over the US not getting the Yaris GR. (Knurled and I were literally just kvetching about it) Its kind of cryptic in that they say it won't be a Yaris GR specifically but a US equivalent. I submitted my info but haven't checked the e-mail yet. 

 

https://www.toyota.com/upcoming-vehicles/gr-hot-hatch/

turtl631
turtl631 HalfDork
1/22/21 4:40 p.m.

I submitted info.  They explicitly say it isn't coming here.  I'll be so mad when we get a FWD Corolla with that engine.  We want AWD, small and light.  I can't see how a GR Corolla would do anything a CTR or Veloster N doesn't already.  

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
1/22/21 4:51 p.m.

In reply to turtl631 :

I'm assuming its the Corolla Turbo. But at the rumored 268hp and $30k, it would undercut the CTR on price heavily while being considerably less hideous. It'd also punch harder than a GTI for the same price but with Toyota reliabilty.

Honestly, I'd be okay with a 220hp FWD Yaris, it'd be the second coming of the FiST. But that seems unlikely, with us not getting any Yarises (Yarii?) In the US.

MrChaos
MrChaos UltraDork
1/22/21 5:10 p.m.
NickD said:

In reply to turtl631 :

I'm assuming its the Corolla Turbo. But at the rumored 268hp and $30k, it would undercut the CTR on price heavily while being considerably less hideous. It'd also punch harder than a GTI for the same price but with Toyota reliabilty.

Honestly, I'd be okay with a 220hp FWD Yaris, it'd be the second coming of the FiST. But that seems unlikely, with us not getting any Yarises (Yarii?) In the US.

it would put it toe to toe with the wrx, that is the only manual turbo awd car sold new at that price point.

MrChaos
MrChaos UltraDork
1/22/21 5:15 p.m.

same power similar weight

Gearheadotaku (Forum Supporter)
Gearheadotaku (Forum Supporter) UltimaDork
1/22/21 5:24 p.m.

 

 While it has a proper 2 door body, that has got to be one of the ugliest cars I've seen in a long time.

 Great idea, now Toyota need to go stare at an 80's hatchback for awhile and try again with the styling.

NickD
NickD UltimaDork
1/22/21 5:56 p.m.

In reply to Gearheadotaku (Forum Supporter) :

I like it in white. Its not conventionally attractive but it doesn't repulse me like the CTR.

nderwater
nderwater UltimaDork
1/22/21 6:56 p.m.

Did I hear wrong, or is the Yaris GR a Gazoo tuned Mazda?

MrChaos
MrChaos UltraDork
1/22/21 7:21 p.m.
nderwater said:

Did I hear wrong, or is the Yaris GR a Gazoo tuned Mazda?

no, the current yaris the rest of the world gets is all toyota, the yaris the US gets is a rebranded mazda 2.    The next gen mazda 2/demio will be a rebranded version of the row yaris.

matthewmcl (Forum Supporter)
matthewmcl (Forum Supporter) HalfDork
1/22/21 7:23 p.m.

Nothing beats early hatchback styling, but I am still in.

Pete. (l33t FS)
Pete. (l33t FS) MegaDork
1/22/21 8:18 p.m.
NickD said:

Honestly, I'd be okay with a 220hp FWD Yaris, it'd be the second coming of the FiST. But that seems unlikely, with us not getting any Yarises (Yarii?) In the US.

Me too.  Which is funny because they sell a rebadged Mazda 2.

 

Our service advisor was a Toyota tech for years, and he said that the guys who only wanted to work on Toyotas had a mental breakdown when they opened the hood on that model and saw a Ford(1) engine staring back at them.

 

At this point, I'm (grumble, grind, grumble) okay with (heavy sigh) front wheel drive, as long as it's a genuine Toyota product and not a rebadged anything.   At least if it's not AWD it should be really light, and relatively inexpensive.  If they price whatever into the $30k range plus the "exclusive model tax" that Toyota dealers like to apply, there are other ways I'd prefer to spend money.  Part of the joy of subcompact cars is that they are not very expensive.  If it's going to be $40k to get in the door, I want a certain level of refinement.  (One of the reasons I loved my first generation S40.  It was a "compact executive car": high quality interior fit-out, drivetrain, and chassis tuning, in a small package.  I'm one of those weirdos who would want a Lexus version of a Yaris, now that the Corolla is a huge car)

 

(1) It's my understanding that the engine in question is a Ford product with lineage dating back to the 90s, not a Mazda.  If I'm wrong, let me know

MrChaos
MrChaos UltraDork
1/22/21 8:36 p.m.

Also we wont get a yaris, it will be the GR Drivetrain in the Corolla Hatchback at best.

Appleseed
Appleseed MegaDork
1/23/21 1:25 a.m.

People will balk at the price.

Dealers will gouge the berk out of those still interested.

GRM will lament in 10 years that there are no cheap GR Yaris' on the market.

Toyota will stop making cool things again because of lack of sales.

Sound familiar?

 

AaronT
AaronT Reader
1/23/21 7:18 a.m.

I signed up. I have my doubts about the end product but my fingers are crossed.

Nitroracer (Forum Supporter)
Nitroracer (Forum Supporter) UltraDork
1/23/21 2:06 p.m.

It could be worse, since the US Yaris is dead it might be an awesome 1.6L 3-Cylinder packaged into a CH-R.  I believe the rear suspension in the GR Yaris is taken from that.

captdownshift (Forum Supporter)
captdownshift (Forum Supporter) UltimaDork
1/23/21 2:14 p.m.

Toyota North America, we won't give you the Yaris GR, but here's a TRD Avalon you've all been asking for. 

 

Then they'll proclaim that nobody buys cars, drop the yaris and increase production of the Highlander, Sequoia and add the CHR

 

Do any auto executives actually berkeleying know anybody who enjoys driving? I seriously question how some of them end up as executives for automotive companies. 

MrChaos
MrChaos UltraDork
1/23/21 2:17 p.m.

In reply to captdownshift (Forum Supporter) :

toyota is also one of the most conservative car companies as well. the gr yaris is the only sports car that is solely there's and that is because it was the presidents pet project. the 86 is mostly subaru, the supra is a reskined bmw. 

Datsun310Guy
Datsun310Guy MegaDork
1/23/21 2:26 p.m.
captdownshift (Forum Supporter) said:

Do any auto executives actually berkeleying know anybody who enjoys driving? I seriously question how some of them end up as executives for automotive companies. 

The old joke was the executives at GM were driven in limousines to work for improved productivity and had never driven their cars as a daily driver.  There are a few enthusiasts at those companies but most are good with managing people and changes.  I have also found that car salemen are not car guys but just good business people.     

Vigo (Forum Supporter)
Vigo (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
1/23/21 7:35 p.m.

 I loved my first generation S40.  It was a "compact executive car": high quality interior fit-out, drivetrain, and chassis tuning, in a small package.  I'm one of those weirdos who would want a Lexus version of a Yaris, now that the Corolla is a huge car)

FIrstly, i hereby register vague interest in trying a small Mitsubishi with a Volvo whiteblock in it. Secondly, I get the Lexus point and im sort of permanently disappointed by the coulda-beens of the HS250h which was a small car (Scion TC sedan, ish) with a Camry hybrid powertrain and an excellent Lexus interior. The main problem is that it had the wrong Camry hybrid powertrain, as the first gen of that powertrain was pretty underwhelming in both power and mpg. The 2nd gen Camry hybrid powertrain in the HS would have been a high 14 second car AND got 45mpg. The CT200h was even slower, but it used the Prius powertrain and there still has yet to be a Prius that was any kind of quick, sadly. 

The current Corolla is actually smaller than the previous several generations! From sitting in it (havent driven one) i basically consider it subcompact. It's no roomier than my brother's 09 Accent. 

 

It could be worse, since the US Yaris is dead it might be an awesome 1.6L 3-Cylinder packaged into a CH-R.  I believe the rear suspension in the GR Yaris is taken from that.

I don't think that would be ALL terrible. I think the CH-R is better looking by a mile than any Yaris ever has been (unless you want to include my unpopular opinion about certain Echo sedans looking good and technically being a Yaris). The thing about the CH-R is that it's already 3200+ lbs. That would take the edge off the GR powertrain and make it more similar to a Juke Nismo RS in performance than to a Veloster N, CTR,  or WRX, and nobody cares about those. 

 

the gr yaris is the only sports car that is solely there's and that is because it was the presidents pet project. the 86 is mostly subaru, the supra is a reskined bmw. 

 If it weren't for having the president they have, they probably wouldnt have ANY sports cars. Sports cars were one of his stated goals for the company. I still think it's sad that people don't consider the LC500 when they think about Toyota's 'failure' to deliver homebrewed sporty cars. That thing gets a LOT right and even before that, people glowed about the last GS-F as well.  Those are expensive and heavy, but in my mind they prove that Toyota knows how to make sporty cars enthusiasts would love. Anecdotally it just looks like Toyota doesn't think they can make money developing 'cheap' sports cars, and the Yaris GR being a money loser to sell sure doesn't disprove that notion. In my mind they could have altered the body less than they did to make it cheaper since it's still ugly as hell anyway, but I guess it was designed around some kind of race series and that may have played some part in making a Yaris unnecessarily more expensive while largely looking the same.

irish44j (Forum Supporter)
irish44j (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
1/23/21 7:46 p.m.

Corolla hatch is better looking than the GR Yaris anyhow. 

I'd have no interest in the GR Yaris. I would have interest in a Corolla hatch with that drivetrain and/or powerplant (FWD acceptable if it has a real LSD like the GTI). 

YMMV, of course.

Side note: I was driving near a CTR today for about 20 minutes. It sounds glorious. But its looks are definitely not growing on me. I still think its hideous and would never, ever consider it.

Me:  someone who bought his last two daily-drivers in this general car category (GTI and WRX) brand new from a dealer, so I put my money where my mouth is ;)

Pete. (l33t FS)
Pete. (l33t FS) MegaDork
1/24/21 6:58 a.m.

In reply to irish44j (Forum Supporter) :

ABS-controlled diff action is better than LSDs when done right, especially in a front driver where an LSD destroys turn-in.

 

The difference is, LSDs act all the time, while "e-diffs" only act when necessary.  BUT, they can also act proactively, helping turn-in.  Thus the "when done right" part.

 

I once thought as you did.  Then I joined the dark side.  (We have cheeseburgers!)

 

mdshaw
mdshaw Reader
1/24/21 7:44 a.m.

In reply to MrChaos :

The GR Yaris is actually a Mazda. Toyota quit making their own Yaris in 2019 I think. Toyota invested in Mazda a few years ago because they were impressed with the SkyActive tech & the mileage Mazda was achieving. This from a friend who is a service manager for the area Mazda dealer.

Pete. (l33t FS)
Pete. (l33t FS) MegaDork
1/24/21 7:45 a.m.

In reply to mdshaw :

North America Yaris is not Japan Yaris.

Vigo (Forum Supporter)
Vigo (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
1/24/21 8:55 a.m.

Im a BIG fan of current Corolla hatch styling. It's kind of wild that a 'normal' corolla hatch looks more aggressive than a widened, homologation special Yaris GR. 

I don't think 260hp in FWD would necessarily be as bad as it sounds. The displacement and peak power taken together suggest they'd be unable to make the turbo spool rapidly enough to accidentally blow off the tires all the time like, say, a mazdaspeed3 or SRT4.  A quick google of a dyno chart seems to back that up. It's making ~150lb ft at 2000rpm (so clearly has some boost already but not a tire-challenging amount) and builds very linearly to ~275 at 4000 rpm. Clearly it could spin tires but it probably wouldn't be that bad at all if going mostly straight.  I'm tempted to say it would be a bigger problem on track, but all the glowing praise for the CTR or Veloster N for that matter makes me wonder if it wouldn't still be really good. 

 

 

rslifkin
rslifkin UberDork
1/24/21 9:02 a.m.
Pete. (l33t FS) said:

In reply to irish44j (Forum Supporter) :

ABS-controlled diff action is better than LSDs when done right, especially in a front driver where an LSD destroys turn-in.

The difference is, LSDs act all the time, while "e-diffs" only act when necessary.  BUT, they can also act proactively, helping turn-in.  Thus the "when done right" part.

I once thought as you did.  Then I joined the dark side.  (We have cheeseburgers!)

I'm gonna disagree.  E-diffs are a lot better than nothing, but they can be very hard on brakes, and on very slippery surfaces, a real LSD works better.  The constant brake grabbing hurts the ability to produce effective forward motion at that point. 

As far as turn-in, you can have an LSD with no preload, so it acts open during decel and won't hurt turn in.  But it'll start to tighten up as you apply throttle. 

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