Underground Wind Tunnel?

I had not seen this before Tunnel Wind Tunnel

That is pretty awesome. I wonder how difficult it is to reach?

I imagine it sounds wonderful in there.

I always wondered why these things have to be "secret". Who cares if other people know you have an abandoned 1 mile tunnel. I also wonder what the advantage (other than controled wind conditions) this would have to a exposed 1 mile long road (like an abandoned runway). It seems if you are actually going to run the car at speed and improve it's shape for use in the real world, it would just be better to insturment it and do everything you are doing in the tunnel outside of it...

In reply to nocones:

I was thinking the same thing. seems like it would be a huge pain compared to just renting the time, strapping it down, and turning on the fan.

A 4000' tunnel under a mountain... how on earth do you buy something like that?

Reasons for tunnel testing:

• consistent air
• 100% private
• no weather
• makes for great press

Simple, a few decades ago the government had no idea what to do with such a space, but knew it didn't want responsibility of it.

Today the neighbor tunnels are being planned as parts of a longer rail trail.

Some friends and I visited the two other abandoned Turnpike tunnels of Breezewood, PA last winter. It was cold. It was a long hike. It was a cool experience.

hmmm...abandoned tunnel... oh the possibilities.

Where's that GRM homebuilding thread. I has idea's ;)

ansonivan wrote: Reasons for tunnel testing: - consistent air - 100% private - no weather - makes for great press

Those all apply for a conventional wind tunnel, too, but I can only imagine it's more difficult to collect data using this setup.

[full disclosure, I used to design wind tunnels for a living.]

ansonivan wrote: Reasons for tunnel testing: - consistent air - 100% private - no weather - makes for great press

The air isn't consistant, it's whatever it is outside the intake end - they have to have ventilation. No weather... no other wind tunnel has weather either. As far as privacy goes, how's it any different than an 18-wheeler backing up to a loading dock, then a day later, leaving? No one can see what came out or back on. The irony is even that doesn't matter, since the article above said, "Some claimed to have seen Ganassi's IndyCar and NASCAR haulers, equipment and supplies" in the area. So much for secrets."

And as far as the press goes, eh, anyone who cares about results will quickly look past that and ask what technical and logistical advantages there are to using that facility. It's an interesting idea, but it's not clear that it's superiour to traditional setups. I have no idea how they can extract all the same information on drag and airflow like they do now. How do you do the streaming smoke probe to check airflow, duct-tape the technician to the hood of the car?

The theory is that they're actually driving inside the tunnel, not simply using it as a wind tunnel.

That's a whole lot more exciting than strapping a car down and watching a smoke trace.

Neat story. the google link is pretty neat as well, as it shows other ambandoned roads: http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msa=0&msid=101725782249727078118.00043ff65d80475ac3aad&ie=UTF8&ll=40.096265,-79.218512&spn=0.001139,0.002315&t=h&z=19

Pretty cool and close by me for a visit. A few minutes on the web turned up this:

http://nascar.speedtv.com/article/cup_the_mystery_of_the_secret_laurel_hill_tunnel

Tom Heath wrote: That is pretty awesome. I wonder how difficult it is to reach?

Not hard at all, just get on the PA turnpike heading east from New Stanton. When you get to the mountain the west end of the tunnel is about 1/4 mile from the edge of the road. Before all the trees grew up you could see the end of the tunnel from the new road. The east end is close to a mile off the turnpike but you can see where the road back to it is.

Other than the weather protection I'm not sure how much better this would be than using some abandoned airport runway. I recall it as being dark, dingy, and somewhat narrow.

I have driven thru this tunnel literally hundreds of times before they closed it and was happy when they put the bypass in.

I would not want to be in the tunnel with an F1 engine echoing at full song, without ear protection. Why use it? Cost. It had to be much cheaper than renting wind tunnel time. However, the team would have to bring all the test gear to measure anything on the car. I wonder who actually owns it?

There is a similar tunnel southeast of Charleston, WV that I guess was the original location of the WV turnpike.

would running a car at speed better show the aero impact of spinning tires? I'm not sure if static wind tunnels have the ability to actually run the vehicles.- exhaust may even play some role that couldn't really be determined in a static tunnel.

Pretty neat anyway.

Teh E36 M3 wrote: would running a car at speed better show the aero impact of spinning tires? I'm not sure if static wind tunnels have the ability to actually run the vehicles.- exhaust may even play some role that couldn't really be determined in a static tunnel. Pretty neat anyway.

And that's why some wind tunnels, and almost ALL wind tunnels for auto research have rolling decks (picture the car on a treadmill) to examine the effects of the tires rolling.

triumph5 wrote:

Teh E36 M3 wrote: would running a car at speed better show the aero impact of spinning tires? I'm not sure if static wind tunnels have the ability to actually run the vehicles.- exhaust may even play some role that couldn't really be determined in a static tunnel. Pretty neat anyway.

And that's why some wind tunnels, and almost ALL wind tunnels for auto research have rolling decks (picture the car on a treadmill) to examine the effects of the tires rolling.

but i bet not even the fanciest wind tunnels in the world have bumps, dips, and small potholes to upset the cars in various ways.

Racecar Engineering magazine had a couple pieces about the tunnels that Ganassi has been using. They may have them on their web site.

Chris H.

I know, it's so they can finally see if F1 cars really can stick to the ceiling...

triumph5 wrote: I wonder who actually owns it?

The PA Turnpike apparently still owns it and leases it to an "unnamed racing team". I am planning on doing a bike ride through the other abandoned tunnels in the area in the spring and despite the warnings that I could be arrested for trespassing, I am going to visit this one too.

novaderrik wrote:

triumph5 wrote:

Teh E36 M3 wrote: would running a car at speed better show the aero impact of spinning tires? I'm not sure if static wind tunnels have the ability to actually run the vehicles.- exhaust may even play some role that couldn't really be determined in a static tunnel. Pretty neat anyway.

And that's why some wind tunnels, and almost ALL wind tunnels for auto research have rolling decks (picture the car on a treadmill) to examine the effects of the tires rolling.

but i bet not even the fanciest wind tunnels in the world have bumps, dips, and small potholes to upset the cars in various ways.

And I'd imagine that even with the treadmill it would be next to imposable to study the interaction between two or more cars as they pass and change position.

Here is the article mentioned in the OP's link:

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/articles/technology/168820/the-mystery-of-the-laurel-hill-tunnel.html