News outlets like Auto Motor und Sport reported that in testing today, a modified version of the Tesla Model S ran an unofficial time of 7:23 at the Nürburgring Nordschleife, a full 20 seconds faster than Porsche's newly unveiled Taycan Turbo S. We're unsure just how modified the Model S was, but it's still not quite an apples to apples comparison regardless. Still, it may …
This is an excellent example of racing improving the breed. In order to pull this off, Tesla is having to address all sorts of cooling concerns that were problematic in earlier versions of the Model S. They're also updating the previous-gen motors. I'm pretty sure this is a three-motor version of the car which isn't currently available, but it certainly could be in the future. It's highly unlikely Tesla is doing this with a car you can buy today, but that's okay in my books. They're pushing the limits.
It's hard to have a Tesla conversation without getting all tied up with personal opinions about Elon Musk, but if you can manage to ignore that it's pretty darn exciting. A good 'Ring time is a lot more applicable to most of us than a run up Pike's Peak, and it's great to see the EVs finally getting to this point.
In reply to Keith Tanner :
Not only that, but 20+ seconds is a healthy bit of time, even at the lengthy Nordschleife. And some outlets are reporting that the time may have been set in traffic. Should make for an interesting official time.
A good news month for Teslas on the performance front, as a gutted Tesla also completed Drag Week, making it the first electric vehicle entered and it also knocked the Tesla quarter mile record back a few hundredths.
Jordan Rimpela said:In reply to Keith Tanner :
Not only that, but 20+ seconds is a healthy bit of time, even at the lengthy Nordschleife. And some outlets are reporting that the time may have been set in traffic. Should make for an interesting official time.
20 seconds is a freaking eternity. Imagine the Tesla whooshing past the start/finish line and then start counting down a Twenty-Mississippi. Taycan wouldn't even be in sight when the Tesla finished, and without the engine noise you may even be able to hear actual crickets.
Your move, lotus evija.
As much as the power of electrics is impressive, I'd still rather have a new or old, (insert just about any screaming fuel powered vehicle).
Up to and including this.
Wouldn’t be surprised if it’s revealed tomorrow it was a stripped out interior, on super soft tires. By then, the ‘damage’ is already done, and everybody will have moved on.
I will believe it when they post the lap and the modifications but there is no freaking way it did that on the tires they ship the car with, and at factory weight. They beat the XE Jag by what 0.7 seconds at LS (unofficial) and that did a 7:18 on cup 2's with a fully stripped interior at the ring with a pro driver and multiple attempts over weeks.
To put it in context that is 12 seconds slower then a Nissan GT-R Nismo which ran a 7:08.68 in litteral perfect conditions. The time difference is the same between the Porsche and the Tesla as the Tesla is to a Radical SR8. WE are talking orders of magnitude.
It's not going to be a car that's right off the showroom floor.
The tires are off-the-shelf street tires, they're just not currently on the option sheet. That's easy enough to fix if you want to pick that particular nit. The likelihood of the powertrain being a prototype for the next generation is very likely, and that's a much bigger deal. That doesn't mean they didn't do the time, though, and in doing so they're pushing the boundaries.
The Chiron that set the "production" car record at 300+ mph was heavily modified. Maybe they are going to release a version that matches that spec, but to call it a production car record at this point is laughable.
The Civic Type R that set the FWD 'Ring record had a cage for safety (though the weight was offset by removing a few things) and stickier tires. That's about as close to truly production as I have seen.
This Tesla was no doubt modified, but if Elon is responding to Porsche's whining about heat management issues by fixing said issues on newer models, I am all for it!
pinchvalve said:The Chiron that set the "production" car record at 300+ mph was heavily modified. Maybe they are going to release a version that matches that spec, but to call it a production car record at this point is laughable.
They are, the Super Sport 300+ model:
https://www.motor1.com/news/369478/bugatti-chiron-super-sport-300/
Keith Tanner said:The tires are off-the-shelf street tires, they're just not currently on the option sheet.
Correct - same as the Laguna lap. Goodyear Eagle F1 Supercar 3R in an already existing fitment.
I must admit I was skeptical, but they appear to have pulled it off. Impressive!
So modifying a car to significantly increase both the grip and the power to weight ratio significantly lowers lap times...Who knew?
While it's very impressive for what it is, and represents some real progress from Tesla, from a manufacturer standpoint I still have to give more credit to the cars that do it as delivered off the showroom floor. Thus the Taycan is still the more impressive 'production' car time to me. Adding better (typically R-comp) tires is the same as flashing a tune that cranks the boost in my opinion. Either way it's 'just' something off-the-shelf available from somebody or another, but if your car needs that to 'beat' the competition, it should have been spec'd that way in the first place.
Road & Track’s article states:
I don’t care, I think its awesome.
.....really? A highly modified and stripped out Tesla with an extra motor and flared with big tires beat a stock Porsche EV? ...No way! More interesting to me are production car capabilities on ring.
Just call it the GT3 and put it on sale next week.
I like that they care, doesn't matter why. EV's that make good track cars are good for all of us.
Not exactly a production car, having 50% more motors than anything they sell off the shelf and all, but if they make a production version of it all will be forgiven.
Individual wheel motors at the rear would be a nice improvement over a diff. I'm guessing they made a new unit to replace the diff housing/powertrain coolant manifold piece to run individual wheel motors and fix the cooling system design flaws at once.
Why all the complaining? This is great for the world of Motorsport just as Keith stated. Innovation and competition moves things forward.
Someday these will eclipse ICE cars and I will be sad.
Error404 said:Someday these will eclipse ICE cars and I will be sad.
I think that day is here in many more ways than not.
Slippery said:Error404 said:Someday these will eclipse ICE cars and I will be sad.
I think that day is here in many more ways than not.
From a driving perspective, EV's are (or can be) freaking great. Bring prices down and range up and I'm sold.
Slippery said:Error404 said:Someday these will eclipse ICE cars and I will be sad.
I think that day is here in many more ways than not.
You're not wrong. I drove my gf's '13 Focus and it is very modern (for it's time) and they had already managed to suck the driving experience out of it with gratuitous features and styling.
There are people that love all the features, people that love them because they think they have to have them, and there's luddites. I fall firmly and happily in the luddite category. Turning a key, hearing the character of an engine, driving instead of stabbing at touchscreens or yelling at your digital assistant.... I'm gonna miss it.
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