Talking with my friend today and he needs to start prepping the Renault Caravelle for Laguna Seca Historics.
It raced there a couple years ago and overheated pretty bad so he is looking for a new core motor to build
It has an R5 motor now so what motor do we need to look for to build ?
I know AMC / Jeep also used Renault motors so will they bolt up ? If so what model to look for ,
Cheap and available parts are a plus , the car is in the SF bay area
Thanks for your help , here is a photo at Sonoma raceway
I know the early Alliance used a variant of the 1.4 liter R5 engine (which began its life in the rear engine cars) but do not know if the bolt pattern was changed when the block was moved from longitudinally mounted to transverse.
Likewise I do not know if the 1.7 and 2.0 varieties of the later Alliance shared the same bolt pattern. It would please me if they did and the 2.0 would plug into the back of an R10.
Not that an Alliance GTI still exists as a donor car 
Having raced a Fiat 850 (SCCA H-Prod) I can sympathize. Then ask what has been done to address the cooling issue?
well, the Europa, used the Engine and Transaxle from the Renault 5. Anything that can be swapped into the Europa, like the 1.6 from the turbo Fuego, should fit
In reply to mad_machine (Forum Supporter) :
True, but you'd need the bellhousing from a Twin Cam to fit any Lima-pattern engines & those aren't that easy to find, though they are available.
The only "Renault" engines used in "Jeep/AMC" were the Peugeot-Renault-Volvo V6 used in the Eagle Medallion, which was a rebadged Renault sold through Jeep/Eagle dealerships. Eagle at that point was the well-beaten corpse of AMC so technically AMC?
Some Jeeps and AMCs came with a 2 liter Audi four cylinder in the 70s, this was a made in the USA sloppy-toleranced version of the old Audi pushrod engine that the 924 engine was based on. (I still want to know if they had the Big Round AMC bellhousing pattern, or the Audi pattern used by the 034/035 five cylinder engines)
Pete. (l33t FS) said:
The only "Renault" engines used in "Jeep/AMC" were the Peugeot-Renault-Volvo V6 used in the Eagle Medallion, which was a rebadged Renault sold through Jeep/Eagle dealerships. Eagle at that point was the well-beaten corpse of AMC so technically AMC?
Some Jeeps and AMCs came with a 2 liter Audi four cylinder in the 70s, this was a made in the USA sloppy-toleranced version of the old Audi pushrod engine that the 924 engine was based on. (I still want to know if they had the Big Round AMC bellhousing pattern, or the Audi pattern used by the 034/035 five cylinder engines)
Thanks , I thought AMC used more Renault stuff or rebadged Renaults with an AMC brand ,
It might be harder than I thought to find a cheap core motor :(
In reply to californiamilleghia :
Seriously your cheap option may be to see if the guy in FL still has his pair of Europas for sale(they were listed here a couple months ago). They were both S2's with Renault power, and I believe one had some go-fast parts. Then ask if he'd sell just the engines.
Pete. (l33t FS) said:
The only "Renault" engines used in "Jeep/AMC" were the Peugeot-Renault-Volvo V6 used in the Eagle Medallion, which was a rebadged Renault sold through Jeep/Eagle dealerships. Eagle at that point was the well-beaten corpse of AMC so technically AMC?
Some Jeeps and AMCs came with a 2 liter Audi four cylinder in the 70s, this was a made in the USA sloppy-toleranced version of the old Audi pushrod engine that the 924 engine was based on. (I still want to know if they had the Big Round AMC bellhousing pattern, or the Audi pattern used by the 034/035 five cylinder engines)
The 924 did not use a pushrod motor. It was a VW/Audi SOHC with solid lifters. The AMC version used the Audi bellhousing pattern as it was the same internally and externally except for a different main bearing diameter, the injector ports on the head weren't machined, and they used a 2-bbl carb. Porsche wanted nothing to do with VW selling those engines to Jeep/AMC and made sure there weren't any Porsche badging on the engine and is likely why they moved away from VW engines when the EA831 production ended instead of moving towards the natural progression of that motor's replacement (the I5/I6 based around its architecture). They didn't want that to happen again.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_AMC_engines#Audi/VW_121
RossD
MegaDork
4/27/20 8:23 p.m.
If he needs some 1108cc engine parts or transaxle parts, I have two of each. One engine is rough though.
Free in Wisconsin. An hour north of Road America.
mad_machine (Forum Supporter) said:
well, the Europa, used the Engine and Transaxle from the Renault 5. Anything that can be swapped into the Europa, like the 1.6 from the turbo Fuego, should fit
Actually the Europa used the engine and transaxle from the (larger) R16, which predates the R5. The engines in the R5 are derivatives of the R4's.
Stefan (Forum Supporter) said:
The 924 did not use a pushrod motor. It was a VW/Audi SOHC with solid lifters.
Sort of. The 924 used a Porsche OHC head on a block based on the Audi pushrod four.
Pete. (l33t FS) said:
Stefan (Forum Supporter) said:
The 924 did not use a pushrod motor. It was a VW/Audi SOHC with solid lifters.
Sort of. The 924 used a Porsche OHC head on a block based on the Audi pushrod four.
Uh, what? You know, you're pretty knowledgeable about a lot of things, but you suck at admitting then you're wrong.
I've been inside a 2.0L block and there's no place for a cam or pushrods on that block. It was developed by Mercedes for Audi.
the head is flat with no combustion chamber, so the combustion chamber is in the pistons, which is a little odd compared to its contemporaries, but there's no place for pushrods or a cam in the block. It's canted over quite a bit, but again not outlandishly compared to similar engines used in FWD vehicles.
A bunch of Renault models have been built in Bursa, Turkey. Take a look at this and see if anything on this list would be a good engine donor:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oyak-Renault
My family is from Istanbul and I'm pretty plugged-into the local car community. If you need anything, I can help you get it. The Turkish economy has totally tanked, so the exchange rate is in your favor.
In reply to Stefan (Forum Supporter) :
"Based on" doesn't mean they literally got bottom end castings from Audi. From what I have inferred, they leveraged their block heavily off of the pre-existing tooling, which is the expensive part. Sort of why VWAG settled on 88mm bore centers for SO MANY engines from 1975 to today.
