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mattmacklind
mattmacklind UltimaDork
12/4/12 2:59 p.m.

Any thoughts on the Walther PK380 as a CCW choice?

Bobzilla
Bobzilla UltraDork
12/4/12 3:04 p.m.

picking a weapon to defend your life with is an extremely personal choice. Some like and are comfortable with Glocks. Some prefer 1911's. Some like revolvers, some don't.

My suggestion is to get your hands on any and everything to see what fits you best, then practice, practice, practice. When you're done, practice some more. Get to where operation of that gun happens instinctively.

Dr. Hess
Dr. Hess UltimaDork
12/4/12 3:39 p.m.
Will wrote:
RossD wrote: There's a reason why the Berreta M9 (or 92) replaced the 1911. You can get it in .40 S&W but then its called a 96.
Yup, politics. Reagan wanted to base US aircraft in Italy. Italy wanted a US contract in return. NATO was pressuring the US to adopt 9mm to standardize pistol ammo. You do the math, but it had nothing to do with the performance of the two pistols.

I know the guy that ran the gun range at Annapolis. He said they were sent the 92 for testing and told to approve it because the Italians were going to buy some missiles from us (US) and we were going to buy their handgun in return.

yamaha
yamaha Dork
12/4/12 3:48 p.m.
Dr. Hess wrote:
Will wrote:
RossD wrote: There's a reason why the Berreta M9 (or 92) replaced the 1911. You can get it in .40 S&W but then its called a 96.
Yup, politics. Reagan wanted to base US aircraft in Italy. Italy wanted a US contract in return. NATO was pressuring the US to adopt 9mm to standardize pistol ammo. You do the math, but it had nothing to do with the performance of the two pistols.
I know the guy that ran the gun range at Annapolis. He said they were sent the 92 for testing and told to approve it because the Italians were going to buy some missiles from us (US) and we were going to buy their handgun in return.

Both were fantastic sidearms anyways......

spitfirebill
spitfirebill UltraDork
12/4/12 3:52 p.m.
Dr. Hess wrote:
Will wrote:
RossD wrote: There's a reason why the Berreta M9 (or 92) replaced the 1911. You can get it in .40 S&W but then its called a 96.
Yup, politics. Reagan wanted to base US aircraft in Italy. Italy wanted a US contract in return. NATO was pressuring the US to adopt 9mm to standardize pistol ammo. You do the math, but it had nothing to do with the performance of the two pistols.
I know the guy that ran the gun range at Annapolis. He said they were sent the 92 for testing and told to approve it because the Italians were going to buy some missiles from us (US) and we were going to buy their handgun in return.

The Beretta fires the same round as other NATO countries submachine gun. The 1911 didn't. The Beretta holds more rounds and would be considered easier to shoot (less recoil). I've known quite a few people who said you stood a better chance of hitting an enemy if you through the gun at them than firing at them. And these were guys who carried it in combat. One even carried a grease gun too. A couple of years ago I got fire a friends 1911 (Kimber or Springfield I forget) and absolutely loved it. And I'm not a big guy.

I found it quite ironic that we bought a handgun from another country.

rebelgtp
rebelgtp UltraDork
12/4/12 3:53 p.m.

In reply to m4ff3w:

Take a look at the SIG Pro 2022. Stainless slide coated with a black Nitron finish with a polymer frame, available in 9mm, and .40SW. It is DA/SA with a decocker and can be converted to DA only. They can be had for under $400 if you search around and that is new. I have carried one for awhile IWB and it has done well by me. You can also change out the back straps and it is just as accurate as my SIG P220.

I also have the P6, P230, P220 and P228...

N Sperlo
N Sperlo UltimaDork
12/4/12 4:41 p.m.

There are many 1911 style firearms that would fit your bill. I'd go for a Kimber or Para .45. No worries on concealing. I conceal a full frame .45 every day.

m4ff3w
m4ff3w GRM+ Memberand UltraDork
12/4/12 4:51 p.m.

Thanks. I guess because I haven't tried to carry yet, I don't really understand how to comfortably conceal a 1911. Do you typically wear outerwear? I'm usually just in khakis/polo or jeans/tshirt. It's way to hot to wear a jacket/sweater most of the year - heck, it's mid/upper 70s this week.

slantvaliant
slantvaliant SuperDork
12/4/12 5:07 p.m.

A lot of folks use a tuckable inside-the-waistband (IWB) holster, such as the Crossbreed Supertuck.

Go a size larger on shirts, an inch or two larger on pants. Shirts with irregular patterns break up the shape better.

Get a good stiff belt made for concealed holster use.

The 1911 is slim for its caliber, and hides well. Aluminum frames help with the weight. A Commander-length slide will have a little less tendency to ride up when sitting. An Officer's ACP butt sticks out less. Putting those together makes a CCO:

rebelgtp
rebelgtp UltraDork
12/4/12 5:12 p.m.

In reply to m4ff3w:

I wear khakis and a polo to work everyday and no one ever notices me carrying the SIG. I have also carried the P220 in the same fashion and again no issues.

I like the hybrid holsters like the Crossbreed for IWB as they make it very easy to return your weapon to its holster when needed.

4g63t
4g63t HalfDork
12/4/12 5:18 p.m.
81gtv6 wrote:

Browning Hi Power

N Sperlo
N Sperlo UltimaDork
12/4/12 5:45 p.m.

In reply to m4ff3w:

Its pretty warm here, but I wore a jacket today, so I grabbed two holsters before leaving home. I prefer to carry on the outside of my pants on my hip because thats how I carry at work. Today I'm holstered on the outside of my pants with a nylon paddle holster and have a flat in-the-pants holster in case I want to take my jacket off. My shirt is loose enough to where the grip will not cause a bulge.

bearmtnmartin
bearmtnmartin GRM+ Memberand Reader
12/4/12 5:54 p.m.

Just wouldn't get a thread like this on a Canadian website.

donalson
donalson GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
12/4/12 6:17 p.m.
spitfirebill wrote:
Dr. Hess wrote:
Will wrote:
RossD wrote: There's a reason why the Berreta M9 (or 92) replaced the 1911. You can get it in .40 S&W but then its called a 96.
Yup, politics. Reagan wanted to base US aircraft in Italy. Italy wanted a US contract in return. NATO was pressuring the US to adopt 9mm to standardize pistol ammo. You do the math, but it had nothing to do with the performance of the two pistols.
I know the guy that ran the gun range at Annapolis. He said they were sent the 92 for testing and told to approve it because the Italians were going to buy some missiles from us (US) and we were going to buy their handgun in return.
I found it quite ironic that we bought a handgun from another country.

as I understand it... part of the deal was that Beretta would manufacture in the USA... Beretta sold the tooling to Taurus and Beretta retooled in the USA...

i've shot a few Beretta 92 type knock offs... including my brother-in-laws Deawoo (yes THAT Daewoo) and like em...

that being said this is a good thread... i'm wanting to get a pistol to go with my 10-5 s&w... but I don't know that I care about CC so we'll see what I end up with.

Dr. Hess
Dr. Hess UltimaDork
12/4/12 7:17 p.m.

I thought the Taurus 92 was a clone of the Beretta 92. It's not. It's an evolution of the design. SGN had an interesting article on the Taurus 92 a few issues ago. They also had an interesting article on single stack handguns specifically like the OP was interested in and for the reasons of being easier to conceal, etc.

A bit hard to locate these days, but a Helwan is a nice full size single stack 9 based on the Beretta 52, I think. They used to sell for a bill even, brand new.

rebelgtp
rebelgtp UltraDork
12/4/12 7:24 p.m.

In reply to Dr. Hess:

Yeah kinda scarce they days aren't they? There is one Helwan that keeps ending up in the various gun shops here in town. It has been to three of them so far in 2 years and it is the same exact gun. I think it has about $350 on it right now at the shop it is at.

I would go SIG P6 before the Helwan though. More accurate, smaller, SIG reliability and you can still pick them up for under $400 with 2 mags and a leather holster.

Helwan

SIG P6

Sidenote: If I could find a Helwan still for $100 and get mags for it I would have one just to play with. Same with a Makarov, though I may buy a Mak still even at their escalated prices from what they use to be.

93EXCivic
93EXCivic MegaDork
12/4/12 7:38 p.m.
JohnInKansas wrote: I have a hard-on for the Walter P380. Quite possibly the best-feeling gun I've ever held, bar none. Nice and small too. Never got to shoot it, but holy berkeley did it feel good in the palm.

I have a hard on for the Walther P22 for that exact reason. I mean not good for conceal carry because it is a 22 but damn I want one.

Dr. Hess
Dr. Hess UltimaDork
12/4/12 7:42 p.m.

There ain't no way a Helwan is worth $350. Every one I've seen (or heard of) has had something wrong with it from the factory (in Egypt, probably BFEgypt). However, once that is fixed, they are a fine weapon. Well worth a bill, but not three and a half. For that, there's a whole lot of good choices.

1988RedT2
1988RedT2 UltraDork
12/4/12 7:58 p.m.

A friend of mine recently picked up a Springfield XD-S compact .45 ACP. He really likes it.

http://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/springfield-armory-xds/

http://xdspistol.com/

I have no idea what it cost.

rebelgtp
rebelgtp UltraDork
12/4/12 8:08 p.m.

In reply to Dr. Hess:

Exactly why I havn't picked one up. I have heard of lousy triggers and temperamental ejection issues with them.

Dr. Hess
Dr. Hess UltimaDork
12/4/12 8:36 p.m.

I've had 2 of them. One had a slide stop that was not made properly. A bit of brazing fixed it. The other needed a retainer clip on the take down lever, which was missing. After fixing those issues, neither has EVER jammed. Every single time I pulled the trigger (which isn't bad at all) with a round in the mag, it has fired and loaded the next round. I get a few occasional failure to hold open after last round issues, but I don't really consider those a malfunction for a carry gun. 100% reliable boom and load the next round is what I'm after in an auto. And I've put several thousand through one of them, and hundreds through the other, of all kinds of stuff, reloads with 92gr 380 boolits 'cause that's all I had around at the time, FMJ, whatever was handy. Other people I've corresponded with on teh intrawebz, y0, have had other similar minor issues to correct, and they were fine after that. $100, hell yeah. $350, get a Glock.

93EXCivic
93EXCivic MegaDork
12/4/12 9:17 p.m.
rebelgtp wrote: Same with a Makarov, though I may buy a Mak still even at their escalated prices from what they use to be.

Are Makaroves any good? The local gun store had a couple at around $150.

rebelgtp
rebelgtp UltraDork
12/4/12 11:47 p.m.

In reply to 93EXCivic:

One of the biggest issues with the Mak is most of them are chambered in the 9x18 Makarov round which is not available locally in some areas. Which model Mak do they have available? At $150 I would buy one. They are a pistol that is generally as reliable as an AK they are just not the most powerful.

Rusted_Busted_Spit
Rusted_Busted_Spit UltraDork
12/5/12 9:01 a.m.

The only Mak I would consider would be a CZ. Of all the reviews I have read I have not read a bad one for a CZ.

rebelgtp
rebelgtp UltraDork
12/5/12 9:36 a.m.

In reply to Rusted_Busted_Spit:

Original Russians can be quite reliable as well, but yeah CZs are quite nice.

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