Alright, so what's never the GRM answer?

We all know what "the answer" is, supposedly. Miata, E30, P71. (I'm ambivalent to one car and hate another on that list, but alas.) In recent weeks, I seem to have discovered a few vehicles that are definitely not the answer, namely SN95 Mustangs and the Audi TT, despite the price to performance ratio. So I guess my question is, what other cars won't tick the boxes? What else sucks enough to not be worth the effort? Disco I is a great example. What else?

Gotta be something like a mid 90's Chevy Lumina

Nissan 300ZX TT (Z32)
Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4/Dodge Stealth AWD Twin Turbo

Both fast, twin turbo GT cars. Both are also very heavy both in weight and maintenance needs and are monumental PITAs to work on.

Beretta?

The only thing I can really dismiss is

Maserati Bi Turbo

RexSeven wrote: Nissan 300ZX TT (Z32) Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4/Dodge Stealth AWD Twin Turbo Both fast, twin turbo GT cars. Both are also very heavy both in weight and maintenance needs and are monumental PITAs to work on.

I've said to myself a couple times that I'd like to own both of those.

Something I've never said is "I'd like to own a 95 - 2000 Dodge Avenger someday."

"One man's trash is another's treasure."

That being said, I believe it depends on who you ask. One may say Chrysler K-cars, but another absolutely loves them.

The0retical wrote:

RexSeven wrote: Nissan 300ZX TT (Z32) Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4/Dodge Stealth AWD Twin Turbo Both fast, twin turbo GT cars. Both are also very heavy both in weight and maintenance needs and are monumental PITAs to work on.

I've said to myself a couple times that I'd like to own both of those. Something I've never said is "I'd like to own a 95 - 2000 Dodge Avenger someday."

I think a car like that is a true GRM non-answer. No pluses whatsoever, just a pile of crap. The Z32 actually has an argument, the 3K/Stealth, much less so, but the were at least interesting for the time.

The0retical wrote:

RexSeven wrote: Nissan 300ZX TT (Z32) Mitsubishi 3000GT VR-4/Dodge Stealth AWD Twin Turbo Both fast, twin turbo GT cars. Both are also very heavy both in weight and maintenance needs and are monumental PITAs to work on.

I've said to myself a couple times that I'd like to own both of those. Something I've never said is "I'd like to own a 95 - 2000 Dodge Avenger someday."

I like both the 3KGT and Z32, but every time I look at the engine bay of one of them I go cross-eyed. They're very cramped and just getting to, say, the timing belt of a 3000GT takes hours.

mtn wrote: Gotta be something like a mid 90's Chevy Lumina

Trust me. Don't piss off the Lumina fans.

And for me, miata is never the answer. I can't get not claustrophobic in them. My big head being 8" from the window at all times, and my size 13 feet hitting all three pedals at once is a problem.

poopshovel wrote:

mtn wrote: Gotta be something like a mid 90's Chevy Lumina

Trust me. Don't piss off the Lumina fans. And for me, miata is never the answer. I can't get not claustrophobic in them. My big head being 8" from the window at all times, and my size 13 feet hitting all three pedals at once is a problem.

i've had 2 Luminas- a 93 2 door with a 3.1, and a 94 4 door with the DOHC 3.4.. both were Euros and were good cars, and the 94 was a real sleeper that surprised a few people..

beige camry - then again, one with rwd and box flares would make me smile.

no box flares and not beige, but rwd.. capable of 200mph..

oldtin wrote: beige camry - then again, one with rwd and box flares would make me smile.

There was a factory RWD Camry. I think I see some stubby little flares, too.

Those aren't rwd, they aren't that bad looking though.

RexSeven wrote: I like both the 3KGT and Z32, but every time I look at the engine bay of one of them I go cross-eyed. They're very cramped and just getting to, say, the timing belt of a 3000GT takes hours.

I have to admit a bit of bias. My father bought a 1993 Dodge Stealth ES (non turbo, dual overhead cam like the R/Ts more powerful motor just without all the stupid looking cladding, last year they made them too) new so much of my interest in cars stems from growing up around that particular car. I actually almost bought it with 260k miles on the original engine from him, but being across the country from a car which needed its motor replaced wasn't exactly the best decision I could make.

That said yes parts are very very expensive for that particular group of cars because there isn't a huge aftermarket for them like the Miata, Z breed cars, or Civics. Overall though I learned many of my mechanical skills working on the Stealth because the engine had such a cruddy layout.

I'd actually go so far as to argue it's the reason I'm "grassroots" it taught me to be ingenuitive because the "factory" answer (or in my current job the engineers "solution") to doing things on the car isn't necessarily the best, quickest or most plausible answer. As a side note that car is an electrical nightmare so it probably also contributes to why I've never been scared of electrical problems.

Travis_K wrote: Those aren't rwd, they aren't that bad looking though.

The first Camry, the Celica Camry, was most certainly rear-wheel-drive. It was a version of the Carina (A40/A50 Chassis).

In reply to Travis_K:

There were the celica camry (rwd) and the all trac camrys AWD)

Chevy Celebrity?

I finally drove a P71 a few months ago. What an epic pile of fail. I completely am perplexed why a vocal minority feel this car is the answer. I dont doubt that it can be made ok but out of the box it sucks. At least the miata is a pretty great car stock. The E30 is great except the steering rack. I have literally driven trucks with quicker steering ratios than E30s

nocones wrote: I completely am perplexed why a vocal minority feel this car is the answer. I dont doubt that it can be made ok but out of the box it sucks.

That's true of anything that is going to be on this list....and is irrelevant. For GRMers, cars are like legos....you take something out of the "car body" tub of bricks, something out of the "engine" tub of bricks, and generous helpings from the "Well, that doesn't belong....."

You will have succeeded when the average lego/car building looks at your project and says, "WHAT?!?!?! How? I mean, it works, but....just HUH?"

(bonus points if "that doesn't belong" includes things of a non-automotive origins)

Early new beetle. It's the anti answer.

88-9? Grand Prix

Pontiac Sunfire

Ford Tempo

The Plymouth Prowler. It wants too rape your wife and children and isn't afraid to admit it.

M030 wrote: Ford Tempo

I've had 5 Tempos. You can't kill them. Its the Toyota Hilux of Ford.