California smog testing. Say what?

So I've noticed that when we bring our trucks to the smog station for their recertification, they no longer stick the sniffer in the pipe. They just see if it's throwing codes and do a superficial visual inspection. If it passes, they run the cert and off you go.

?!!

So what's to keep one from installing stuff that doesn't throw codes? For instance, the CA specific catalytic converters that cost three times the price of a generic one. I understand that legit shops won't install an non-CA cat, but what about us shadetrees?  

Interesting.

My Cayman is regged CA but I live in NH so I am in a kind of loop hole. I don't ever get asked to smog and I do not need a NH inspection.

I just put an exhaust on that did away with 2/4 of the stock cats but put 2 much bigger/better ones on. I do not throw codes.

This seems to be telling me that if CA ever did want me smogged I'd pass?

Forgiving the lack of 1/2 the cats I would pass NH insp with zero issues. And the inspection place would have to know Porsches to see they are missing.

In reply to Kreb (Forum Supporter) :

Uh, the light check has been going on for many years now.  So you know.

And, in theory, if you change the part, and the MIL light does not come on, it's an ok part.  Most likely, a non CA cat would be noticed within a couple of thousands of miles of break in.  However, finding someone to sell a nonCA part in CA should be pretty tough. 

In reply to alfadriver :

Good points. It just pains me to drop 2 large for a lousy (pair of) cats.

In reply to Kreb (Forum Supporter) :

This has been the rule in TX for many years. Many people do modifications and turn off certain monitors or codes in the tune, so even cars that definitely shouldnt pass, do pass.

The visual inspection is to make sure that your cats (or other modifications) have an EO. 

The onboard monitoring system is far more thorough than any test you can do in a few minutes.  It'll even wake up in the middle of the night to run tests. That's the whole purpose of it, to make sure that all the emissions components are working properly at all times and under all conditions. If the Onboard Diagnostic system is happy, you should be good.

Which is why messing with the diagnostic system is a really good way to get both the ARB and the EPA quite excited. 

Those CA legal cats are a lot more effective than non-CA cats. That's why they're so much more expensive, they've got a lot more catalyst in them. 

The visual inspection generally includes looking at the catalytic converters.  If you're smogging something that's relatively common then the tech has seen it before and knows what stock components look like -- if it's not stock then he's supposed to look for the EO plate on the cat that identifies it as an approved replacement.

If you bring something exotic then the tech might not know what stock looks like, OTOH he might well be checking more carefully just because it's a Ferrari or whatever.

Kreb (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to alfadriver :

Good points. It just pains me to drop 2 large for a lousy (pair of) cats.

Well, society gets what you pay for....  

In reply to Keith Tanner :

In most cases. I have a good friend in the cat industry, and he says they load their cats heavy to prevent comebacks, and the ones they have sent for certification in CA pass and get a number. Outside of the certification they are no different than the same fitment cats they sell in the other states, BUT they are more expensive to recoup the cost of certification.

In reply to Opti :

If he's in the aftermarket, "heavy" is still not what OEMs put on them.  And when I checked the EO process (once), the requirement that non OEM parts have to meet isn't as hard as what the OEM process is.  IIRC, they just have to meet the standard, whereas we have to meet it at full useful life (and everyone also bakes in a significant safety margin to prevent recalls).

I know hes on the aftermarket side. I think his company also does OEMs not sure though. I wasnt talking about OE vs aftermarket though, just aftermarket federal vs aftermarket california, and only in some cases. In most cases, the aftermarket cats especially from smaller brands are made as cheaply as possible due to price pressure.

In reply to Opti :

That is not the case with our suppliers. There is a real difference in what's inside a federal vs CA legal cat from what I've been led to believe, and the price difference is a lot bigger than just certification costs.

This is also why metal recyclers aren't interested in aftermarket cats, only OE. The aftermarket ones don't have enough metals in them. 

I had the same no rolling dyno on my 2000 Chevy express van a few years ago , 

is it  only the OBD2 cars that are plug in only ? 

my 1987 Nissan pick-up needed to be put on a dyno a few months ago .

In reply to californiamilleghia :

I think so. I remember being suprised when I got my first OBD2 car smogged for the first time and they just plugged in the reader. 

In reply to thatsnowinnebago :

I would love to know if the official  state "reader" is the same as an OBD2 reader ?

if the check engine light is off  you pass ?

I need to put a O2 sensor in my van in the next few days that thru a O2 code , 

Hopefully all I have to do is replace the sensor and I will  pass :)

thatsnowinnebago said:

In reply to californiamilleghia :

I think so. I remember being suprised when I got my first OBD2 car smogged for the first time and they just plugged in the reader. 

Model year 2000 and later skip the "functional" (dyno) test, OBD2 cars from 1995 to 1999 still do it.  So my 1999 Miata needs a dyno run, where an identical 2000 Miata does not.

MY2000+ still gets the other tests too (visual, gas cap, and I think there's one more)

californiamilleghia said:

I would love to know if the official  state "reader" is the same as an OBD2 reader ?

if the check engine light is off  you pass ?

There need to be no active codes and it also needs to have passed all of the monitors.  It's the same OBD test that they've always done on OBD2 cars, the only change was to skip spinning the dyno rollers.

Kreb (Forum Supporter) said:

So I've noticed that when we bring our trucks to the smog station for their recertification, they no longer stick the sniffer in the pipe. They just see if it's throwing codes and do a superficial visual inspection. If it passes, they run the cert and off you go.

?!!

So what's to keep one from installing stuff that doesn't throw codes? For instance, the CA specific catalytic converters that cost three times the price of a generic one. I understand that legit shops won't install an non-CA cat, but what about us shadetrees?  

The point of OBD-II is that the sniffer is irrelevant.  Nice to see California getting with the times 

In reply to californiamilleghia :

You'll have to drive it long enough to pass all the self-test procedures. A few days of normal use should do it, but there is a proscribed drive cycle that should go through them all quickly. If you show up with freshly cleared codes, the car will report "not ready" and you shall not pass.

The fact that OBD-II is a standard is the almost the whole point of OBD-II. So the reader shouldn't matter.

Kreb (Forum Supporter) said:

So I've noticed that when we bring our trucks to the smog station for their recertification, they no longer stick the sniffer in the pipe. They just see if it's throwing codes and do a superficial visual inspection. If it passes, they run the cert and off you go.

?!!

So what's to keep one from installing stuff that doesn't throw codes? For instance, the CA specific catalytic converters that cost three times the price of a generic one. I understand that legit shops won't install an non-CA cat, but what about us shadetrees?  

What's stopping them from gaming the system?  The threat of a more extensive test, essentially. 

The quick tests are sufficient for most rides, that doesn't stop places from setting up checkpoints to stop cars to test/inspect them more thoroughly.  Many don't do this, but we know that Cali has done it to help deal with some of the street racers.

So as long as you're legal, you got little to worry about.  Those that want to live in the "gray area" live with the knowledge that things can go bad for them without notice and they have to be ok with that.

Here in PDX, my 1979 924 blew cleaner than it ever did from the factory after the EFI and modern cat installation.  The 951S on the other hand was pig rich at idle with its aftermarket EFI conversion, but I was able to adjust this in the parking lot and get retested to pass.  I'm just glad they ditched the dyno tests because the 924 was so poorly tuned that the drive there and back was a white knuckle experience.

As a car enthusiast and a member of the populace at large, I strive to keep my cars in good shape/well tuned and avoid driving like a complete ass in residential areas.  I don't delete emissions equipment because it makes so little difference on the street that it isn't worth the effort.  I avoid driving loudly in residential areas, especially late at night/early morning.  I wish more of us did this because it makes people dislike us less and that's a good thing.

California has a new draft emissions regulation that is being circulated for comment right now. Not sure what all it covers but I am sure they will not go backwards.

bearmtnmartin (Forum Supporter) said:

California has a new draft emissions regulation that is being circulated for comment right now. Not sure what all it covers but I am sure they will not go backwards.

Covers everything new.  I've seen the proposed updates, or at least some form of them- they are not close to final.  One big thing is that the drive cycle changes just a little bit- the cold idle gets a little more realistic.   Other than that, the overall emissions just get lower across the board.

For the most part, it's both very expected and somewhat unexpected (and not in a bad way).

But wait there's more (in CA anyway). According to Autoblog smog in CA will now check ECU to see if it includes non OEM software. If modified you fail unless the code is CARB approved. 
 

https://www.autoblog.com/2021/07/14/modified-engine-ecu-software-fail-california-smog-check/

if this is true many folks are hosed. I have a handheld SCT to set mine back to stock. But for folks who sent out ECUs or had a shop load, what then?

In reply to GTwannaB :

That's been covered a lot in the Hondadata's thread in Off Topic.  Technically, what people are doing is tampering, which is illegal.  Unless it's an approved calibration.  It sounds like they are allowing people to reset back to the factory calibration.

I was shocked when I didn't get sniffed either. when I was shopping around for availability, the first question everyone asked was- "what year is the car? " I've never lived in a dyno county, so that's been nice. 

I thought the original intent was that the smog exempt date would continue to update, so 20 year old cars were exempt. Can you imagine!?