Controversy at the Porsche AutoX

It isn't national championships, so I wouldn't worry about it. I WOULD put in a request to make sure that the "cone out of place" procedure is known to everyone--announce it in the drivers meeting, every single time.

That course looks awesome btw. Course walks must be LONG though.

In reply to NOHOME and rotard:

Some people are competitive types and will take the rules defining any competition seriously, others are not and don't. But in my experience, more often than not, the former group is actually the most friendly, helpful, and enjoyable group to hang out with before, during, and after the event.

There is however a difference between taking the rules seriously and taking the event (too) seriously. The latter of which, in my humble opinion, seems to include more people who don't take the rules seriously than do. Like all of the people who say they just want to run what they brung for fun, but then complain about their 'unfair' (uncompetitive) classing.

Marjorie Suddard wrote: A corollary to the "don't take it too seriously" rule is "don't jump all over the new guy trying to figure out what does, and doesn't, fly in his chosen sport." Asked and answered. Let the poor guy up now. Margie

Richard Hammond wrote an article about this very thing recently: http://www.topgear.com/uk/richard-hammond/richard-hammond-car-geeks-2014-9-22

Nice car! looks fun.

Have another cup of coffee, you're way too relaxed . . .

Best bumper sticker I've ever seen was, "Autocross, just an excuse to wear a helmet." And in your case, driving gloves.

Let it go, it isn't racing. Just good practice for getting a parking space at the mall.

1. Face a direction of your choice and thank Autocross Jesus® that you have a site like that within reach.

2. Don't listen to the people here that say autocross is not to be taken seriously. It's a fine sport,and the great thing about it is you can compete on whatever level you choose, be it local events for fun or national level events to test yourself against the best of the best.

3. As soon as you didn't stop for the cone out of position, you accepted it as part of the course and waived your right to a rerun or correction. On a downed cone or cone out of position, it is the competitor's responsibility to stop and signal should he choose. I've been on both sides of the situation. I've ben on runs that I felt were good, recognized a downed cone that could have granted me a rerun, but chose to continue because I felt the run could stand. I also ran the risk of having that cone assess to me, but I saw that the workers had acknowledged it and chose not to stop.

Now armed with that knowledge, approach future events with that in mind.

Nice socks! Silly response. Enjoy your day, don't ruin it for others too.

"Agree to disagree."

I have never heard that rule before. Granted, I have to beg for riders/navigators at every event because no matter how many times I walk the course I still get lost.

I'm also a weird o. I like rules, and classes. Gives me something to guide me a bit, but could give a E36 M3 less how I stack up against the other guys. Just want to beat myself on each lap.

I like the concept of legal hoonage. Sums it up pretty good.

when I've instructed at a-x, the biggest thing I stress is learning the course … and the best way I've ever gotten folk to learn the course is to drive the first run as though your Granny was sitting beside you, holding your infant son, and not belted in …. in other words, drive VERY SLOWLY … no matter how many times you walk the course (at least as a novice) it won't look ANYTHING like what you remembered when you're behind the wheel and trying to go fast

if you try to go fast on your first run, you'll usually get lost, and it becomes a wasted run

the "drive SLOWLY" the first run is a "wasted run" … but not as frustrating as getting lost …

each run you can pick up the pace a little bit … if your event allows enough runs, you'll be near your best pace by the time your runs are through

anecdotal evidence …. I had a student at a very fast and long course (not as long as the OP's, but still 60sec + ) … he was mid-50's in a Mustang GT, had never been to any kind of driving event before.

we walked and walked and walked … he knew the course inside and out … and promised me that he would drive the 1st run slowly … of course that idea went out the window as the red mist of his first run took over … LOL …

after the 2nd gate, he nearly came to a stop .. found his way and then drove very slowly, by the end of the event (we got 6 runs) he had run fast enough to win the novice group

give it a try …it's a lot easier to have fun if you're not DNF'ing

Driven5 wrote: "Controversy" isn't exactly a word I would use to describe this, aside from the sensationalism used to attract additional hits/followers/revenue on a Youtube channel.

We are two pages in, and the OP hasn't been back to discuss.

I think we've been had. Very clever canoe.

In reply to alfadriver:

Damn canoes getting crafty...

Really though, I don't get get all serious business a our local events. I'm there to abuse some tires and have fun but I do want to have a good clean run. I would be more annoyed at the guy who's supposed to be watching those cones.

Nothing is more frustrating than people watching the cars and not paying attention to their station. The run/work concept is what makes these events possible and when people berkeley up their part of the course its frustrating and frankly insulting to the other people that put effort in while those slackers are doing their runs and not having the same courtesy returned to them.

Danny Shields wrote: In reply to True_Racer: If you think a cone is out of position you have to stop and point it out to the course workers to get a rerun; otherwise you have accepted it. Complaining after the run is too late.

This is correct. After the fact doesn't matter.

rotard wrote: Start doing track days so you don't have to worry about cones?

or rallycross. We have cones, but on every run they seem to move a foot or half out of where they were the run before, lol.

well this thread escalated quickly, I wasn't expecting such an uproar but let me try and catch up to the conversation as quickly as possible, starting from the newest comments

I AX for the comradery not the competition, but with the friendly comradery comes friendly competition and the guy I approached at the end was my friend and class rival who was signaling "1 cone" in an "i got you this time manner" Also that great venue is only 10 min from my house

I don't do track days/TT/DE because I race shifter karts and cannot afford to do both

yes I used a provocative but relevant title to attract interest in the matter(which has obviously worked) and as far as revenue generated from the video, yes i think i can now afford my next pair of valve stems. what is a "canoes" any way

the video: a couple cuts, some text, a voice over and insert an endcard. not much out of the norm for me

Richard hammonds article was a good read

I was also surprised to see people questioning my experience as obviously with a race built car and racing gloves it was not my first rodeo.

and everyone's interpretation of seriousness is comical in itself. I turned my mirror in for aero-dynamic efficiencies for crying out loud.

Stopping and pointing out the cone. Yes this is what we try and do but for my particular case I would not have been able to safely slow or stop to point out the cone. "but you should of been looking ahead" correct I was but in that particular spot the is a row of cones and I was unable to see one out of place until I was looking at it from straight ahead and at that point I was doing about 70 and already committed to the corner, any sharp deviation could have gone badly.

lastly you guys are not very nice to new people if I was in the Army I would've had to pull out my stress card

This thread was revealing in many ways, most of which are delightful.

Most people here don't view autocross as a life and death blood sport of seriousness. Wonderful, because it's cars driving around soft orange cones. I've encountered a few of the Real Serious Types and they suck the life right out of the sport.

It seems understood the rules take precedence over GoPro replays.

"yes I used a provocative but relevant title to attract interest in the matter(which has obviously worked) and as far as revenue generated from the video, yes i think i can now afford my next pair of valve stems." Comedy gold. Don't let the newbie hazing affect you; that kind of humor will fit in perfectly here. Until you learn the cast of characters things may seem a little rough around the edges but you'll like this place. The question was legit but with the thread title I think it came across as you were one of those Real Serious Types. It may have prodded the peanut gallery into being a bit more sarcastic than usual. Much like your errant cone, dismiss it and move on. The long term benefits will prove more than worthy of negating the slightly sour introduction.

I personally think we all need to stop and pray to the Autocross Jesus®© and understand he sacrificed his miata for all of us.

In cones we pray!

Man to have a site like that 10 minutes from home. I think you used up all your blessings right there and anything else is gravy.

I always tell my students to get your first cone in the morning and to absolutely murder it. That way they'll stay out of your way for the rest of the day. It works.

How would stopping have been too dangerous? Corner workers have red flags for this reason and the only thing to hit are cones. Its a completely fair rule.

Autocross is the flag football of motorsports - don't take it too seriously and have fun.

True_Racer wrote: I was also surprised to see people questioning my experience as obviously with a race built car and racing gloves it was not my first rodeo.

Maybe it was your racing line.

Could you wear a full fire suit next time so we know you are a hot shoe?

True_Racer wrote: lastly you guys are not very nice to new people if I was in the Army I would've had to pull out my stress card

I always thought that was a myth...

True_Racer wrote: lastly you guys are not very nice to new people if I was in the Army I would've had to pull out my stress card

We piled on like you were one of us.

Please forgive us!

Welcome to our forum.

TeamEvil wrote: Let it go, it isn't racing. Just good practice for getting a parking space at the mall.

While I am laughing as I'm typing this, I do disagree (unless you were just making a funny). It definitely is racing. It may not be set on a road course, but it's a lot of fun, it's a competition, and it's not easy.

OP, does your organization have a mechanism in place for filing grievances (is that the right word?). You know--for contesting the results of an event? If it does, maybe contact those folks and see what they say. It did look like it was out of place. On the other hand, what would it get you? Was there a national championship at stake, or would this just mean the difference between a first place beer mug and a second place beer mug for that specific event? If nothing is at stake but that event, I'd probably not worry about it.

Any of us who are willing to take a perfectly good road car, throw the nice leather interior in the trash, and install steel tubes that would kill us if we didn't wear a helmet take the sport seriously at the very least. That goes for autocrossers, drag racers, time trialers, and road racers. If nobody took it seriously, we wouldn't have much of a sport... it would be like a bunch of fat, old philosophers knocking a soccer ball about on a soccer field. There'd be great conversation, but it wouldn't be very exciting.

jsquared wrote:

True_Racer wrote: lastly you guys are not very nice to new people if I was in the Army I would've had to pull out my stress card

I always thought that was a myth...

It WAS a real thing. They tried it a few years ago. It wasn't anything that lasted for very long, but it was a thing. I know a few E5s and E6s that had to deal with lower ranking people who just didn't want to do their jobs, and this was actually sort of a mechanism that they could use to get out of work.

confuZion3 wrote:

jsquared wrote:

True_Racer wrote: lastly you guys are not very nice to new people if I was in the Army I would've had to pull out my stress card

I always thought that was a myth...

It WAS a real thing. They tried it a few years ago. It wasn't anything that lasted for very long, but it was a thing. I know a few E5s and E6s that had to deal with lower ranking people who just didn't want to do their jobs, and this was actually sort of a mechanism that they could use to get out of work.

wow … I knew the service had changed a bunch since I was in, but didn't realize it had fallen that far

"unless you were just making a funny"

Of course I was, just didn't want to interrupt the flow with one of those little yellow thingies.

We had a wonderful autocross here at the air base on Cape Cod that was shut down after Sept. 11th.

MAN ! That was just a perfect Sunday afternoon ! I learned almost everything that I currently know about cars/racing/set-up/suspension/etc. because of that autocross, and because of my buddy, Todd (who raced there quite often.)

Betcha more than half of the folks wouldn't be here were it not for autocross.

Still, the OP took it all way too seriously. Autocross (on a local level) is supposed to be fun and instructive most of all, not a means to that kind of stress. Not at all.