Further to Keith's point, I've read it now takes an average of something like 15 years for the average car to end up decommissioned and that it's rising fairly rapidly. (ie. A car build today will be on the road even longer) In the 70s it was about 7 years, in no small part because the body had rusted away.
Plus with the RS you'll be making excuses to take the long way around.....even for a high priced coffee.
z31maniac said:mazdeuce - Seth said:I would only really worry if I were going to track it hard for the next 20 years. I wouldn't hesitate to buy one now if I wanted one. I'm just now coming up on finally owning a car I bought new for 10 years. Never happened before and I doubt it'll ever happen again. Holding cars for that long is rare.
It would really just be an occasional Auto-X or HPDE. It wouldn't be like 15-20 days per year or anything like that. I don't really dedicate the time/money to track stuff like I used to.
But a fun, capable car with a bit of utility makes a lot of sense, even if it's not as sexy as a GT PP2 or SS 1LE or Miata or such.
At real speeds, which is to say below 100mph, I think the Focus RS is every bit a super car. I've ridden in one at autocross and watched them at One Lap last year and talked to a half dozen owners. The only time they start to fall flat is well above any sort of legal speed. Below that you have all the power and all the grip you can reasonably use and the car itself is capable of more than 99% of drivers. If you haven't driven one, you really should.
z31maniac said:It would also be my only car.
I've never driven a Focus RS (let alone owned one), but I don't see why it couldn't be your only car and cover all the bases.
I'm going to mention my 2003 Lancer Evo VIII again. It was a modern AWD sedan: 4-doors, big trunk, comfy seats for 4 adults (5 in a pinch), enough room for 1-2 baby seats in the rear, couple of airbags, etc. Great AWD traction in the winter. Strong brakes. Stay off the boost and fuel economy wasn't too bad on the highway. In addition to all that, it was tons of fun and blazing fast around a racetrack. What's not to like?
I would think the Focus RS would be even more practical since you've got the rear hatch, folding rear seats, modern in-car entertainment/navigation system, and (I bet) even better crash-worthiness than my old Mitsubishi.
LanEvo said:z31maniac said:It would also be my only car.
I've never driven a Focus RS (let alone owned one), but I don't see why it couldn't be your only car and cover all the bases.
I'm going to mention my 2003 Lancer Evo VIII again. It was a modern AWD sedan: 4-doors, big trunk, comfy seats for 4 adults (5 in a pinch), enough room for 1-2 baby seats in the rear, couple of airbags, etc. Great AWD traction in the winter. Strong brakes. Stay off the boost and fuel economy wasn't too bad on the highway. In addition to all that, it was tons of fun and blazing fast around a racetrack. What's not to like?
I would think the Focus RS would be even more practical since you've got the rear hatch, folding rear seats, modern in-car entertainment/navigation system, and (I bet) even better crash-worthiness than my old Mitsubishi.
I can confirm that my FoRS has been very practical. It can carry my infant daughter and four adults just fine with room in the trunk for some groceries and the like.
After driving it on-track, I can definitely say that it is much, much more capable than I am on track. The traction control and electronic rear diff is pretty slick. The brakes are impressive, etc. Chasing S2000's and E36 M3's was a ton of fun. Even a modified CTS-V had to work a bit to get away from me in the twisties after I let it past on the straight (that thing was a missile in a straight line). With a bit of alignment work and a bit more tire under it, it would be one hell of a track day car.
In normal mode it feels quick, but not urgent and you can loaf about with it and still carve through traffic,etc. Put it Sport mode and it becomes a pit bull tugging at the leash. The stock tune favors midrange power, so it falls flat at higher RPM, but the 2.3L isn't exactly a high-revving motor anyway, so I get why they did that. It is a more useful power curve for the type of driving you would actually do with the RS. Plus Sport Mode opens the exhaust butterfly and you get some giggle-inducing pops and bangs from the exhaust.
The fact that it has all but been forgotten already by the press due to the release of the Honda, just adds to the underdog status, IMO which makes it a bit more cool. I don't know how much Honda has spent on press junkets and the like, but it appears to have worked since the Honda appears to be the only hot hatch being made anymore.
^Yeah I was looking at the stock dyno charts, and with the Mountune stuff. Big, fat meaty midrange and ALL the torques.
I know they are quick in stock form, but out of curiosity, did Ford ever make the Mountune available while still keeping the warranty?
Those of you that own the car, how much tire can you get under it? Is there a way to get some more front camber on the car? Crash bolts? Camber plates?
In reply to z31maniac :
I just lol'd imagining the looks you would get if you walked in to a Ford dealership, helmet in hand, and stated in clear confident voice, "I'm here to test drove that new Focus RS you have sitting out there."
z31maniac said:^Yeah I was looking at the stock dyno charts, and with the Mountune stuff. Big, fat meaty midrange and ALL the torques.
I know they are quick in stock form, but out of curiosity, did Ford ever make the Mountune available while still keeping the warranty?
Those of you that own the car, how much tire can you get under it? Is there a way to get some more front camber on the car? Crash bolts? Camber plates?
Yes, some dealers can install the Ford Racing and Mountune parts and keep the warranty. Basically look at the Ford catalog and if it says that it keeps the warranty, you're good to go.
I think Jstein mentioned people getting 315's (??) under the cars with some fender rolling and the proper width and offset wheels, I could be remembering that wrong though some research is needed. There are aftermarket flares available if you want to cut up a brand new car. That should allow 335's or more.
Camber is adjustable to some extent using the stock bolts, but crash bolts and camber plates (to really ruin any ride quality you might have) are available since the suspension hard parts are shared with the FoST for the most part.
Honestly, I haven't run out of tire with the car on the street or on the track, the stock tires are damned good. I could see if you were really serious about events, you'd pop for wider wheels and stickier tires, but I'm looking at picking up a set of FoST 18" wheels for Snow tires as that is more useful to me. The driver has to come to terms with the capabilities of the car, IMO before more tire is needed.
The low production run of the RS seems like a waste to me... all the media blitz about us finally getting something special, just for 3 model years' worth.
DocV said:The low production run of the RS seems like a waste to me... all the media blitz about us finally getting something special, just for 3 model years' worth.
IMHO, from what I've read, you can blame the Ford dealers. Even as recently as this summer, I was seeing them advertised at $10k+ over MSRP. Who the hell is going to spend north of $50k for a loaded RS? That's nearly GT350/M2, used 'Vette money, etc.
Locally they still seem to be at or just under MSRP, in bigger cities, like Dallas, I'm seeing some cars marked as much as $4k below MSRP. And that's just advertised. I suspect letting them handle the financing and a bit more negotiating would get it lower.
I would say another large issue for the majority of the public is that it's still a Focus.
In reply to FuzzWuzzy :
That's an issue for the majority of the public, but that's exactly why I own an ST. It's still just a Focus! My mom can drive it and not complain!
z31maniac said:You guys are making this difficult!
It would also be my only car. But since I work from home 2-3 days per week, and only live 6 miles from the office when I do go in, the car would see very little mileage. I think I've filled up the BRZ twice in the last two months and it still has more than 3/4 of tank at the moment.
Since you'll be keeping the mileage low, it may be like the evo/sti and retain high resale value. Could help if you're on the fence. Also, have you test driven an FoST? They can be pretty darn competent at daily driving and the occasional autox/hpde. The Ford Racing reflash clams to bump the ST up to 360 ft/lbs on 93 octane and keeps your warranty.
markwemple said:In reply to Adrian_Thompson :
No faith in Ford quality.
and especially design engineering (sorry Adrian, not your group)
fidelity101 said:markwemple said:In reply to Adrian_Thompson :
No faith in Ford quality.
and especially design engineering (sorry Adrian, not your group)
Who do you mean, then? And based on what?
For this car, I'd very much question the re-flash and it's reality to be covered under warrantee. To make more power than the OEM calibration, some compromise has to be lifted. Which one was lifted to make more power? Without that info, I'd VERY much question changing it.
alfadriver said:fidelity101 said:markwemple said:In reply to Adrian_Thompson :
No faith in Ford quality.
and especially design engineering (sorry Adrian, not your group)
Who do you mean, then? And based on what?
For this car, I'd very much question the re-flash and it's reality to be covered under warrantee. To make more power than the OEM calibration, some compromise has to be lifted. Which one was lifted to make more power? Without that info, I'd VERY much question changing it.
http://www.focusrs.org/forum/16-focus-rs-performance/3252-modifications-warranty-clarified-how-mountune-warranty-works.html
Armitage said:z31maniac said:You guys are making this difficult!
It would also be my only car. But since I work from home 2-3 days per week, and only live 6 miles from the office when I do go in, the car would see very little mileage. I think I've filled up the BRZ twice in the last two months and it still has more than 3/4 of tank at the moment.
Since you'll be keeping the mileage low, it may be like the evo/sti and retain high resale value. Could help if you're on the fence. Also, have you test driven an FoST? They can be pretty darn competent at daily driving and the occasional autox/hpde. The Ford Racing reflash clams to bump the ST up to 360 ft/lbs on 93 octane and keeps your warranty.
I owned a '10 Speed 3, and have no desire for a high powered FWD car. Just not fun after awhile.
The dealership around the corner from my house has a '17 Focus RS with the moonroof, going to swing by after work and see if I fit comfortably with my helmet on. It looks like it's on the showroom floor though, so I'm sure even if I show them my credit score and income they aren't going to let me test drive it.
Which was another problem I read about............you expect me to drop $40k on a car, but you won't let me test drive it?
To answer the fuel economy/thirstyness questions - my car is bone stock and I've averaged 20.0 mpg over just over 10k miles. On the highway cruising between 75 and 80, it creeps up to ~25 mpg. The tank is something like 12 gallons... the car doesn't have great range.
I have two cars - the Focus RS and a 318ti that has no radio, cruise control, or interior behind the B-pillar... so for all practical purposes, I have one car. It fits (with room to spare) my autocross wheels and tires, helmet, cooler, air tank, jack, and tool box in the hatch with the rear seats folded forward. I carried a 55" flatscreen tv home from the store in its box. There isn't a ton of room, but the hatch has more space than I thought it would.
z31maniac said:Armitage said:z31maniac said:You guys are making this difficult!
It would also be my only car. But since I work from home 2-3 days per week, and only live 6 miles from the office when I do go in, the car would see very little mileage. I think I've filled up the BRZ twice in the last two months and it still has more than 3/4 of tank at the moment.
Since you'll be keeping the mileage low, it may be like the evo/sti and retain high resale value. Could help if you're on the fence. Also, have you test driven an FoST? They can be pretty darn competent at daily driving and the occasional autox/hpde. The Ford Racing reflash clams to bump the ST up to 360 ft/lbs on 93 octane and keeps your warranty.
I owned a '10 Speed 3, and have no desire for a high powered FWD car. Just not fun after awhile.
The dealership around the corner from my house has a '17 Focus RS with the moonroof, going to swing by after work and see if I fit comfortably with my helmet on. It looks like it's on the showroom floor though, so I'm sure even if I show them my credit score and income they aren't going to let me test drive it.
Which was another problem I read about............you expect me to drop $40k on a car, but you won't let me test drive it?
Yep, the salespeople aren't even allowed to drive them. At least that's what the sales drone told me when I test drove mine before I signed for it. Luckily I liked it enough to sign for it.
Ford Corporate really screwed up a number of areas around the production and release of the Focus RS, including the advertising and how they treated the people who waited through the fog of production. Coupled with the rather disconnected reality between the dealers and Ford themselves, this equated to a lot of people walking away with bad tastes in their mouths.
So, I'd tell the dealership that you are serious about the car, but you need to test fit in it and test drive it, this is if they want to actually sell it. If they won't budge, then you can say thank you and I'll take my business to another dealer (BTW, any dealer can sell you a Focus RS, just pay the transfer fee to have it moved.), leave your contact info and hold the line on taking it for a test drive before you buy.
In reply to Stefan :
FWIW, this line would bug me, too-
WARNING:
This part has been designed and is intended for off-highway application only. Installation of this part on a vehicle that is driven on public roads may violate U.S. and Canadian laws and regulations relating to emission requirements and motor vehicle safety standards. Click Here for Emissions compliance information.
That, and the reduction to a 3-36 warranty tells me that what is being compromised is the exhaust temp control. So when the cat dies, you are on your own. There IS a warranty, but it's not nearly the same as the one you buy the car with.
The dealer I bought from let me take a fairly lengthy test drive (supervised) but wouldn't let me open the door on the GT350 they had in the showroom.
That kind of behavior seems to vary a lot by establishment.
z31maniac said:I wanted one of these when they were first announced, and I'm still intrigued by them.
However, the low production numbers and talk of blown head gaskets is making me nervous.
It seems with just a few tweaks it would be a great DD and occasional HPDE car (addressing rear diff cooling, for instance).
BTW, I did track my car on a warm day and I didn't have any rear diff cooling issues, so I think driving style (are you in drift mode? Are you a ham-fisted mouth breather? Are you trying to win the HPDE Championship?) can play a huge role in that situation.
DocV said:The low production run of the RS seems like a waste to me... all the media blitz about us finally getting something special, just for 3 model years' worth.
I don't get that. Media buzz is media buzz and it gets people talking. Any manufacturer of any product loves media and public interest. Also 'just for three years' Whats wrong with that? That's normally the way with RS products. They are limited production halo cars that aren't meant to suit everyone. They are intentionally hard core products, always have been always will be. Now. If you want to complain that the FoST isn't AWD as a WRX fighter that's a different topic, but the RS is supposed to be a hard core limited production car.
GM did next to nothing for buzz for the SS (the car) with an up front limited run. Still had issues moving them off the lot. Still do, I think. Honestly haven't checked as their appeal to me has died down a lot.
Then again, GM does love doing that (GTO and G8).
Isnt 3-36 Ford's standard warranty for new cars and you have to pay extra for anything longer, except for trucks?
You'll need to log in to post.
