Formula 1 coming to Austin, TX!!!

I am so psyched that Formula 1 is coming back to the States but this whole idea of Austin hosting it is just ridiculous in my opinion. I've heard that Austin is quite different from the rest of Texas, but Bernie Ecclestone has been barking and barking about hosting a race in New York and yet at the last minute signs off on a $250M dollar deal that is going to produce a track that the drivers will hate and will become a parade like Bahrain was this year.

I'm on the fence about this though. I love it but hate the idea as well. I wonder how much money Bernie pocketed from this deal?

I am not at all surprised either that Herman Tilke is going to be responsible for designing another utter-horseE36 M3 track.

Here is a great article about Herman Tilke's stranglehold on F1 track design. I have yet to hear a driver or drivers agree that these newer circuits are better than the old ones.

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2009/02/05/how-hermann-tilke-conquered-the-f1-calendar-1996-2009-video/

Well, I have friends that live in Austin, and have been begging me to visit. I have the ability to get to the track, if it is built. She can likely get tickets through her company, assuming that the deal goes through. Yes, I will be there.

Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:

billy3esq wrote: ^ Not only that, but Austin is the center of Texas much like a hole is the center of a donut. It may be in the middle, but it's fundamentally different from what it's in the middle of.

Are you saying that Austin is the jelly? Thats pretty much my favorite donut filling.

No, I'm saying Austin is a hole.

(Note: I like Austin well enough, but I wouldn't want to live there. However, I like Houston, so take my evaluation with a grain of salt.)

Well anyone who likes Houston, well it's highway system, is crazy so your vote doesn't count.

http://www.statesman.com/news/local/formula-one-promoter-promises-austin-track-will-be-715886.html?srcTrk=RTR_504016

m4ff3w wrote: http://www.statesman.com/news/local/formula-one-promoter-promises-austin-track-will-be-715886.html?srcTrk=RTR_504016

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that this "mission statement" sounded a lot like the one Anderson/Windsor gave on the idea of USF1....

And how did that turn out?

carguy123 wrote: Well anyone who likes Houston, well it's highway system, is crazy so your vote doesn't count.

1. I never said anything about the highway system.

2. I can see where our freeway system would be confusing to someone who likes Austin, since we have highways that go East-West, not just North-South.

3. I'm pretty sure only crazy peoples' votes count. Have you seen the state of our country?

Austin Statesman wrote: Hellmund flew to Belgium to catch Ecclestone at a Grand Prix race. He pitched Austin as a venue, stressing its proximity to Dallas, Houston and San Antonio, a population triangle with close to 20 million people.

Um, yeah, we see how well that strategy worked out for TWS (which is a pretty decent road course in addition to having a super speedway). It ended up being too far from any of the big cities to attract the fan base. Hopefully this time will be different.

billy3esq wrote:

carguy123 wrote: Well anyone who likes Houston, well it's highway system, is crazy so your vote doesn't count.

3. I'm pretty sure only crazy peoples' votes count. Have you seen the state of our country?

OK, ya got me there!

But it's not just the east & west, it's the way they don't go anywhere you want to go, the amount of toll roads, the COST of said toll roads and the fact you can go for days and still not be there.

billy3esq wrote:

Austin Statesman wrote: Hellmund flew to Belgium to catch Ecclestone at a Grand Prix race. He pitched Austin as a venue, stressing its proximity to Dallas, Houston and San Antonio, a population triangle with close to 20 million people.

Um, yeah, we see how well that strategy worked out for TWS (which is a pretty decent road course in addition to having a super speedway). It ended up being too far from any of the big cities to attract the fan base. Hopefully this time will be different.

Austin might be a bit more desirable to visit than College Station.

College Station isn't really on any major highways and doesn't have easy access to anywhere so you can't really compare it to Austin nor can you compare TWS to an F1 quality track.

I can see ALMS or Daytona Prototypes in the tracks future as well.

carguy123 wrote: But it's not just the east & west, it's the way they don't go anywhere you want to go, the amount of toll roads, the COST of said toll roads and the fact you can go for days and still not be there.

I'm going to have to call BS on that. There are very few places in Houston that aren't within a few miles of a freeway. As for toll roads, there are a few, but what's wrong with having the users pay for the road rather than the taxpayers? Besides, the new wunder-track in your Austin paradise is apparently going to be on a toll road in the middle of nowhere, so your comparison rings a little hollow.

Having to "go for days and still not be there" is a function of the size of Houston, not the highway system. In Austin you can sit for days and still not be there because the traffic is so bad and there are no alternate routes.

I travel to Houston and Austin a lot and Houston is a beating no matter where you want to go, the toll prices are double to triple the prices of DFW for the same distance, Going for days is to get anywhere in Houston is a matter of the poor design of the roads not the distance although distance is a factor.

Austin's rush hour traffic is a breeze compared Houston's mid day traffic, never mind Houston's rush hours.

I haven't been on the Austin Toll road, but I will bet the pricing structure is more in line with the pricing of DFW than Houston and Austin has the one toll road while Houston thrives on toll roads. I've never understood it. The cities are under the same toll authority but when I'm pulling a little 10' landscapers trailer I get charged the same price as a huge dump truck in Houston but I only get charged twenty cents more in DFW.

BUT we still don't know that the track is off the toll road in Austin. We don't really know for sure where it will be. The conjecture is that it's off the toll road but no one knows for sure yet.

carguy123 wrote: College Station isn't really on any major highways and doesn't have easy access to anywhere...

First, I hope I'm wrong about Austin being too far to draw a crowd, but I'm still going to have to do more BS-calling. College Station is easier/quicker to get to from Houston. It's about a wash from Dallas. Fort Worth to Austin and San Antonio to Austin are easier than going to College Station. Austin has a slight edge in geographic proximity/access, but not by much.

Besides, my point was more about attracting local spectators. A huge advantage TWS had was that it was hosting Indy Cars and NASCAR, which the natives so thoroughly love. If you can't get Joe Redneck so schlep down to College Station to watch NASCAR, I doubt you'll get him to schlep down to Austin to watch that furrin' racin'.

As for the three dozen "sophisticated" race fans, yeah, they might like Austin better, but half of them would fly to Indy or wherever else to watch the race. My point is that it isn't going to draw that big from the Houston/DFW, etc.--other than the race fans that would make the trek anywhere. Being in Austin isn't going to be a big draw to anyone not otherwise predisposed to attend an F1 race.

carguy123 wrote: ... so you can't really compare it to Austin....

I just did.

carguy123 wrote: ...nor can you compare TWS to an F1 quality track.

That's true. You can pass at TWS, unlike the snooze-fest that is a modern Tilke-designed parade ground. Back in its day TWS was quite the facility. It's dated now, but it failed as a top-level circuit 30 years ago, when it was much closer to being state-of-the-art. The reason it failed wasn't so much the track as all the rest of the facilities, and that in trying not to be too far from anywhere they wound up being too far from everywhere.

carguy123 wrote: I can see ALMS or Daytona Prototypes in the tracks future as well.

Maybe, but Houston couldn't generate sufficient interest to keep an ALMS race in the absence of the CART race it supported. DFW also couldn't keep an ALMS race, although having it in August was probably not the most clever thing they could have done. Personally, I'd rather watch paint dry than Daytona Prototypes, but they may have some draw with the NASCAR crowd. In either case, history suggests that neither Houston nor Dallas can support such a race. I don't see a race that is 150 miles from either succeeding.

Don't get me wrong, though. I'm excited and hope it succeeds. But all the smug Austin-lovers need to get over themselves and realize this location is all about where the money flowed to Bernie from and has nothing whatsoever to do with Austin being somehow a superior venue for an F1 race. That's all just sunshine being blown up the skirt of the locals so they won't riot about the construction, environmental impact, and all the infrastructure the city and county are going to have to build despite the promises of "no taxpayer money."

The best part will be in another 10 years when more people start moving out of the city,closer and closer to the track and complain about the noise.

That's TWS's ace in the hole. It's "grandfathered" into the City of College Station, so as long as it's primary function doesn't change (road course and oval) no one can ever file a noise complaint, etc.

Personally I view F1 as the pinnacle of racing. Yeah, not everybody gets to be an F1 driver, but not everyone gets to be an astronaut either.

Since I am stationed here in Korea, I am stoked that they are scheduled to race here in October for the first time, although they still have not released the tickets yet. While I'm sure there were reasons, I don't understand why instead of building the new track near Seoul with a population of 35 million people, they have built the track at the furthest point away from everything on the southern end of the peninsula. I doubt the city that is hosting it has the infrastructure to support the influx of people that will flock there over that race weekend. My wife and I are prepared to camp under a tree outside the track if all the hotels are booked.

Living abroad, I have seen how many Americans think the world revolves around them. While the U.S. is all about NASCAR and NFL, the rest of the world is watching F1 and soccer.

In reply to carguy123:

IIRC, the austin toll road (loop 1 toll) became the most expensive per mile in the country when it was completed. not sure about 130 toll, but it was sold to the same company so its likely that its similar

A friend just drove that toll road this weekend. Toll from start to finish is $6.

Billy3esq I don't know how you're driving but TWS from DFW is nowhere nearly as short a drive as Austin and then you're stuck near College Station so if you're be all and end all isn't the track you're in the most boring piece of real estate in all of Texas.

Neither Houston or Dallas had a track hence the reason they chose not to support further races. Did you see what they were asking the drivers to run on in Dallas? It was horrible and little to no effort was made to improve the city streets for the race other than some barriers.

For those who've never been or who haven't been in many a year, Austin is a destination city and has quite a visitor infrastructure. Now on the east side of town on the new toll road there's basically nothing, but that's about to change. Any number of hotels have announced their plans to build near the track.

carguy123 wrote: you're in the most boring piece of real estate in all of Texas.

Clearly you've never been to Lubbock. At least we're not a dry county.

carguy123 wrote: Billy3esq I don't know how you're driving but TWS from DFW is nowhere nearly as short a drive as Austin

I said Dallas is about a wash, which it is, depending on what part of Dallas. I mean basically the eastern half. Ft. Worth is a bit closer to Austin, as I conceded.

carguy123 wrote: Neither Houston or Dallas had a track hence the reason they chose not to support further races. Did you see what they were asking the drivers to run on in Dallas? It was horrible and little to no effort was made to improve the city streets for the race other than some barriers.

Not only have I seen it, I've driven the ALMS roval at TMS (at night, no less). I'm pretty sure its a track. I think it's a bit boring if you don't have a bazillion horsepower.

Houston was always a street circuit, first downtown then at the Astrodome complex. The race was successful as a CART race with Trans-Am (mid/late-90s) or ALMS (mid-00s) support. The reason there's no ALMS race in Houston is that the promoter bailed when CART pulled out 'cause he couldn't make it profitable with just the draw of ALMS.

carguy123 wrote: For those who've never been or who haven't been in many a year, Austin is a destination city and has quite a visitor infrastructure.

They can certainly handle 100k+ for a UT home football game, but I'm not sure I'd go so far as to call it a "destination city." There's some stuff there, but not much there that you can't find equal or better somewhere else. It's fine if you're already within 150 miles, but for the 280 million Americans who don't live within a three hour drive there's lots better places to be.

As I noted above, the selection of Austin had to do with who bought Bernie. He essentially said as much himself during the pre-race coverage for Turkey. When asked why Austin he said "Because they were willing to do what we wanted."

billy3esq wrote: As I noted above, the selection of Austin had to do with who bought Bernie. He essentially said as much himself during the pre-race coverage for Turkey. When asked why Austin he said "Because they were willing to do what we wanted."

Nailed it, right there.

For a lawyer, you're pretty smart.

unevolved wrote:

carguy123 wrote: you're in the most boring piece of real estate in all of Texas.

Clearly you've never been to Lubbock. At least we're not a dry county.

Lubbock? Dry? Keep up, man. Package stores, and beer/wine aisles in the grocery stores in town since September. And there have always been bars.

For those of you going TEXAS? REALLY?

Watch this little video Texaplex

It's a year old so some of the numbers need updating but it does give you an idea of what Texas has other than an F1 track

Austin has a lot of things to do and is why so many people visit it. They do/had(?) the powerboat racing on the river in downtown every year (yeah, they've got river that runs thru downtown), they have the bats that roost right in the middle of the city inside the bridges downtown and leave in a big cloud every evening. Well, OK that's fun only once. A tip for bat watching don't view it from underneath the swarm, watch them going away from you not coming towards you. When you first get up in the morning what do you need to do real bad? Well so do the bats. They will pee all over you as they fly over. And let me tell you bat pee doesn't smell or taste good.

While I can't even begin to name off all the area attractions there's alway 6th street, the Capitol, UT, lots of restaurants, hotels, music festivals (here's one, etc. but there's also a lot to do in the surrounding area. San Antone is a short drive plus there's Barton Springs, river rafting down several rivers , Schlitterbahn in New Braunfels, Gruene, San Marcos (with a Aquarena springs and their swimming pig and rafting down a crystal clear spring fed river) and plus the nearby hill country has some really cool roads and quaint German towns. And then there are things like Enchanted Rock, Natural Bridge Caverns, Wonder World, and Longhorn Caverns

Houston is only good for one thing, they supposedly have the largest number of non-chain restaurants of anywhere in America. And many of the chains were born there. The Dessert Gallery is a must visit. You can get literally any kind of food you want someplace in Houston.

And I didn't even try to put on the list any cultural type events or locations. I was just talking fun.

slantvaliant wrote:

unevolved wrote:

carguy123 wrote: you're in the most boring piece of real estate in all of Texas.

Clearly you've never been to Lubbock. At least we're not a dry county.

Lubbock? Dry? Keep up, man. Package stores, and beer/wine aisles in the grocery stores in town since September. And there have always been bars.

My bad.

Sadly, the student residents have a reputation to break windows out of cars bearing A&M window stickers, and throw full cans of beer at opposing fans at sporting events, etc, etc, so most Aggies try to limit our time in Lubbock. Those people just aren't very nice.