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Warren v
Warren v Reader
7/13/13 6:32 a.m.

Also, cue the brass hit from Inception:

This actually isn't all of it, some is on other tables.

Part of me is worried about posting all this awesomeness publicly on the internet. I'll just say Exomotive is carry-friendly.

Jaynen
Jaynen Dork
7/13/13 10:28 a.m.

So if I buy XIDA's should I go 700/400 like is usual and swap spring rates later or get lower spring rates to begin with

Warren v
Warren v Reader
7/13/13 2:05 p.m.
Jaynen wrote: So if I buy XIDA's should I go 700/400 like is usual and swap spring rates later or get lower spring rates to begin with

That would be almost undrivable. Go lower.

z31maniac
z31maniac PowerDork
7/13/13 2:10 p.m.
Warren v wrote:
Jaynen wrote: So if I buy XIDA's should I go 700/400 like is usual and swap spring rates later or get lower spring rates to begin with
That would be almost undrivable. Go lower.

I think he means for his current Miata, then swap springs when he builds an Exocet.

Jaynen, talk to Emilio, but I believe the spring rates being used here are within the range the XIDA can effectively damp.

Warren v
Warren v Reader
7/20/13 7:34 p.m.

For those only watching this thread, check XP-3's build thread! We sucessfully ran all three sessions at UTCC, and despite being seriously down on power (bad coil packs), we definitely were in the top half of the field.

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/build-projects-and-project-cars/exocet-xp-3/66618/page10/#post1253087

Glad to meet a lot of you guys, sorry I was such a zombie by the end. These past few days took a lot out of me.

Oh, and 500/325 was way too stiff. The adjustable AFCOs helped a ton, but Bob Thorton wants to try 425/250, even with the aero.

On the calibrated scale with wings and ~8 gallons: 1515. The front wing with hardware and mounts is around 15 lbs. 50lbs lighter than expected!!!

Bob was raving about the car, it was an amazing validation. He kept saying it was the most fun he's had driving in years, and he wants to come out of racing retirement to back an Exocet endurance effort at the 13 hour Change of the Headlight Brigade. I wish I had his comments on video. He drove for us as a favor to one of our Racing Analytics friends, showed up skeptical, and left an Exocet lunatic. The Exo-Kool-Aid is strong!

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/20/13 8:06 p.m.

Let me see what I can do with those spring rates on the AFCOs.

Warren v
Warren v Reader
7/20/13 8:08 p.m.

In reply to Keith Tanner:

We definitely need longer springs! We had the front perches at the top of the bodies and were running dangerously low with the tophats we had to run.

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/20/13 8:11 p.m.

Tophats wouldn't have affected that as the spring still mounts to the same place - but it's good to know. 500 is a bit aggressive for such a light car. I'll see if I have anything in my garage that will help.

Warren v
Warren v Reader
7/20/13 8:40 p.m.

The tophats dictate the limit of our droop, and with shorter tophats, the helper spring perch would have come off the shock body at full droop.

With the sleep deprivation, "droop" has become an exceedingly silly word...

ApacheXMD
ApacheXMD New Reader
7/26/13 6:29 p.m.

Will the kits come with a manual of any kind? Pictures would help me a lot with a project like this.

Are there any considerations when building an exocet with an NA vs an NB? I've got a 94 M edition that's just screaming to be converted.

v8exocet
v8exocet New Reader
7/27/13 4:15 a.m.

honestly. there isnt really a need at this point. its literally remove, reinstall reverse that you took it off the miata.

i think the only thing that may have clearance issues (if it isnt changed already) is the rear brake tee block. gotta cock it.

ApacheXMD
ApacheXMD New Reader
7/27/13 4:38 a.m.

I understand the basic idea, it's just easy to underestimate my technical ineptitude.

I was thinking more along the lines of "Put together A before you bolt on B or else you'll be fighting with C all day long", torque specs, removal of subsystems like AC, replumbing of brakes/coolant/vacuum lines, things like that.

I might be wrong, but I would think that much of the appeal of a kit like the Exocet is because it's a lot more plug and play than, say, something like a Locost, and therefore it would draw customers who may not have a full working knowledge of every bolt in a miata.

It's fine if there isn't a build manual, and if there isn't, it would be nice to know what skills a potential buyer should study up on before writing the check.

For example, having never dropped a fuel tank, it might be nice to know where it's going and how it's gonna get there before I set myself on fire.

ddavidv
ddavidv PowerDork
7/27/13 5:40 a.m.

Well, when GRM does their multi-part series on building one, they can point out these things to you.

Too bad they're doing the 818 first.

v8exocet
v8exocet Reader
7/27/13 5:41 a.m.

use a FSM for removal, and use a FSM for isntallation

its still a miata

i dont mean to sound mean or anything. But if you are able to make a list, look at something and see what holds it on, you can do it. I think the conservative estimate for a non mechanically inclined person is like 60 hours?

i did my v8 version in about 30-40 id say.

id venture to say anyone on this forum, who can at least remove an engine, or do a clutch, would have NO problems doing it. And if you Dont and have a friend that is decently inclined, youd be even better. Its seriously like a big lego machine.

ApacheXMD wrote: I understand the basic idea, it's just easy to underestimate my technical ineptitude. I was thinking more along the lines of "Put together A before you bolt on B or else you'll be fighting with C all day long", torque specs, removal of subsystems like AC, replumbing of brakes/coolant/vacuum lines, things like that. I might be wrong, but I would think that much of the appeal of a kit like the Exocet is because it's a lot more plug and play than, say, something like a Locost, and therefore it would draw customers who may not have a full working knowledge of every bolt in a miata. It's fine if there isn't a build manual, and if there isn't, it would be nice to know what skills a potential buyer should study up on before writing the check. For example, having never dropped a fuel tank, it might be nice to know where it's going and how it's gonna get there before I set myself on fire.
Warren v
Warren v Reader
7/27/13 2:51 p.m.

GRANT, YOU'RE KILLING ME. Not everyone is an intuitive mechanical person that works on jet engines.

There is tons of documentation on building an Exocet. We have a build guide, there is a forum with hundreds of build threads with every possible issue, heck, there's even a third-party guide: http://www.completekitcar.co.uk/mevexocetbuild.html .

Honestly, the problem is that there's too much documentation and not enough organization. Also, all the documentation is for the UK version, which required a lot of stuff for their MOT. It still works for the US version, but you get to skip a good 30-40% of the steps, as the aluminum panels bulkheads come ready to mount. Soon enough there will be a video guide for every step, as well as a centralized set of instructions in the style of Flyin' Miata's excellent instructions.

v8exocet
v8exocet Reader
7/27/13 8:23 p.m.

ALSO, Warren, dont forget that now almost all of the UK issues they had are non existant now. such as fuel tank mounting issues, the pedal issues, and a bunch of other stuff that are revised in the new chassis.

Warren v
Warren v Reader
7/28/13 12:21 a.m.

In reply to v8exocet:

Yeah, you probably would have been dribbling out of your mouth if you had been there for XP-3's build. The actual Exocet stuff took like no time. If we had been building it from a straight Miata (no turbo, no brake system overhaul, stock suspension), it would have taken a day. Zero trimming or filing on the aluminum panels (am I repeating this a lot? if so, good), the pedals went in with zero modification to the frame or pedals, the steering rack hooked up perfectly, and there was a surprising amount of adjustability for the steering wheel position. Check out the time lapse and note how fast the panels, pedals, and steering column went it. Blink and you'll miss it. That was 20% of the UK build right there.

We had one of the Racing Analytics guys set the seat and steering column position to his preferences. When he first got into the car, he started complaining that the wheel was too high and to the left. The steering mount bracket has new slots on it, and the range of adjustability available when we loosened the bolts made him start laughing. That was coming from a guy is building one of the three US prototype cars.

For those playing at home without an Exocet, the steering column mount plate (we call it the "drop plate" for short) has been through a few revisions. There was the original UK version, where you had to drill your own holes and file the appropriate hole to shape in the firewall for the steering column. Then the Prototye US version, which had limited range and a bunch of "speed holes" in it that slowed manufacturing, and then the Production US version, which had a bunch more movable range due to different slots on both the drop plate and its mount on the chassis.

It's the green guy here (yellow tubes are the "Sport" upgrade):

Just use the included M8 bolts and washers, assemble everything loosely, adjust it where you want, then crank everything down with some blue Loctite. The Miata column itself has slots itself for even more wiggle room.

singleslammer
singleslammer Dork
7/28/13 12:38 a.m.

You guys are really making me wonder if I shouldn't save my posts Miata for Exocet duty. This thing is so cool! It really helps that I think even my lazy ass could finish this build.

v8exocet
v8exocet Reader
7/28/13 7:39 a.m.

yeah, it took me easilly two days to do the pedals with welding in all the supports, mounting, the steering column modifications, fitting the clutch and brake masters. I had to modify everything!

Im so glad this new chassis fixes everything and makes it VERY normal person friendly. If i didnt have a welder and other choices tools i wouldnt have been able to do the UK kit correctly. The engineering and research on behalf of Exomotive is no less than top notch. I cant wait to build a second one.

sobe_death
sobe_death HalfDork
7/28/13 8:25 a.m.
Keith Tanner wrote:

Whaaaat is this magical caliper and where can I get them?

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/28/13 9:38 a.m.

Part of the Flyin' Miata rear brake upgrade. It's a Powerlite with a special cantilever parking brake modification. Not part of the normal Wilwood catalog You can get them through Flyin' Miata as part of our kits.

ApacheXMD
ApacheXMD New Reader
7/28/13 12:58 p.m.

I had forgotten that the exocet existed for a while across the pond. And it makes sense that most of the issues have been ironed out by now.

For a long time I have wanted a Locost for autocross and for general tomfoolery. But with an 18month old kid at home it makes for very little time left over for a project. A real locost build probably would have taken a decade to complete. This exocet kit is so tempting because it looks like it would be a bolt on affair. And although i consider myself mechanically inclined, you can never have too many instructions and help.

Warren, you are doing a great job with the Exocet and in doing so, are probably exocets best salesman. I'm already working on the opening arguments to present to the wife.

sobe_death
sobe_death HalfDork
7/28/13 1:02 p.m.

Argh! Can I get them through Flyin Miata without being part of a brake kit? It's for a custom application, as I don't own a Miata (yet).

Warren v
Warren v Reader
7/28/13 4:07 p.m.

Another option for handbrake only:

http://www.wilwood.com/calipers/CaliperList.aspx?subname=MC4%20Mechanical

Keith Tanner
Keith Tanner GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
7/28/13 4:42 p.m.
sobe_death wrote: Argh! Can I get them through Flyin Miata without being part of a brake kit? It's for a custom application, as I don't own a Miata (yet).

Probably - contact me at keith@flyinmiata.com.

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