Help Me Figure Out Where to Put My Garage

I agree with doing a "Grosh" on number 3.

I'm a zoning hearing officer in my Township in Western Pennsylvania and I hear variance requests. It would depend on the facts, but if you were taking out a couple dilapidated buildings and proposing a new, even larger building that fits with the neighborhood and otherwise improves the property and no one complains, I would expect to grant a setback variance if necessary because of the unique dimensions or layout of or access to the lot. I'd first find out if you have zoning and what the requirements are for construction, setback etc. Then decide if you want to try to do things under the radar or comply. If the latter and if your municipality has a land use administrator, use them as a resource to see what's possible.

There's a lot of good ideas here.

Let me suggest something completely different...

Your lot is ridiculously cluttered on the right with buildings that are past their usefulness. I would consider a 2nd long driveway coming off the other road behind Mrs VCH's garden plot, with a brand new large shop to the left of the "pin". Set it back far enough to preserve your view. A metal building would keep the costs down, give you the height you want, etc. Then you can tear down 1 or 2 of the less useful buildings to de-clutter the lot.

Or, You could make the lot really nice by putting a new home site behind the garden plot facing the other street, and return the barn to shop duties, but this would cost a lot more, and you are probably too far into your renovation for this to make sense.

The other thing this aerial views don't show is the slope of the land. Our land isn't flat, so building sites (especially for a garage) are somewhat dictated by topography. The area behind the garden slopes away from the house area and down into the woods.

Also, that road towards the bottom of the map isn't a public road- it's a private access drive for the 4 houses on it. I use it occasionally, pulling out of the grassy areas on my property, but I think if I were to add an actual driveway onto it they might balk.

In reply to SVreX:

Yes, we do have a lot of buildings. There used to be an old corn crib just above the 2nd house, squeezed between it and the neighbors' driveway above. I tore it down a couple of years ago- it was leaning badly and useless other than as a nesting place for rats and groundhogs and poison ivy.

The tiny little shed tot he left of B3 now is being used as a henhouse. We have 11 chickens that reside there, and a fenced-in area between that small shed and B3. One thing I proposed to Mrs VCH, that she likes, was tearing down B5 and building a new, larger chicken complex there, with more fenced-in area for them to graze. We sell organic eggs from our chickens, and I think she'd like to have more.

Lots of these old farms around here have a bunch of buildings all clustered in a small area. It makes sense- as has been pointed out, do you want to trudge hundreds of feet from your house in all kinds of weather to get to your shop? Not to mention, the cost of running electricity- it would be over $1000 in wire and digging work to lay a run to the back of the property.

Here's some pictures taken yesterday (sans white E36 M3):

The 18 x 18 current garage:

Inside:

The 40 x 16 portion, as viewed from the right side (chicken area visible off to the left):

Inside:

The "parking lot" / graveyard below the B3 complex:

I'd just like to see you take advantage of all that land you pay taxes on. You have nearly 2 acres unused, and everything else squished together.

The slope wouldn't kill the usability for a shop. It's just a matter of grading. OR, use the slope to your advantage (think PA stye 2 story bank barn).

The natural place for a driveway is unfortunately right through Building 2. Any chance of joining the group so the private road could serve 5 houses instead of 4?

+1 for the "bank barn" shop.

I know a guy in PA who built something like this. Drive in lower floor where he has a frame rack and a paint booth (also where his waste-oil heater is located along with an underground tunnel to his house basement). Drive in middle floor where body work happens. Stairs in a silo to a 3rd floor for storage. From the outside, it just looks like any other barn (the fake silo really makes it), but in reality the building is a purpose-built body shop that he does restoration work in.

It's an amazing shop and some day I hope to do a proper interview and profile of him for an article.

Just one little tip, when you're running power also run some cat6 cables. They're cheap and can carry 10Gbps Ethernet. Run more than one and you can have a bonded connection or just redundancy...if one breaks, you have another and don't need to run fresh wires.

In reply to GameboyRMH:

Conduit would be even smarter

Some more thoughts from "here on the ground":

Razing B5 and putting the shop there would be perfect...EXCEPT: a shop tall enough to allow the use of a lift wold obstruct the wonderful view we've got going on from the deck on B2 over the valley. B2 is going to be the "guest house" for friends and family who visit; I know my dad in particular loves that view over the valley. So, that's a non-starter.

B3...I checked and the long, skinny, horizontal part (16 x 40) is not really attached to the 18 x 18 "garage" part. It looks to pre-date the garage, as the cinder blocks on the bottom are larger than the ones on top...looks like someone tore down an even older barn and built this run-in on the old foundation. I'd have to tear off block basically down to the original (older, larger) foundation, and then go up from there. And construct a whole load-bearing wall on the right side.

The 18 x 18 space would not be bad if bumped out to 18 x 28, though it would be a strictly one-car with the lift deal. I still have the workshop under B2 (which, conveniently, is large enough to hold exactly (1) Volvo 122) and the garage above B2 (which currently houses the wife's Camaro) and I could build a small carport -ish thing off the right of B3 to store 1 or 2 more cars.

The other thing- As you can see in the pictures, the long, skinny part of B3 currently has 6 (six!) cars in it, all of which would need to find new homes before renovating that building.

Also- thank you for all the diverse and interesting thoughts. I appreciate the good, constructive input. One thing that's great about this group- you're a bunch of do-ers, not a bunch of "you can't do that"-ers.

What's at the bottom of the picture? Looks like a white vehicle tucked behind a tree line.

I realize you would have setback challenges, but that would be a pretty good location. It would make your "compound" more open, especially if you raised something.

The larger building would be tucked behind the tree line from the street. Is that downhill from the rest? That would help diminish the perceived size of it.

In reply to volvoclearinghouse:

Your yard looks like mine.

Guys like you and me sometimes forget that the easy button is sometimes to get rid of stuff.

SVreX wrote: What's at the bottom of the picture? Looks like a white vehicle tucked behind a tree line. I realize you would have setback challenges, but that would be a pretty good location. It would make your "compound" more open, especially if you raised something. The larger building would be tucked behind the tree line from the street. Is that downhill from the rest? That would help diminish the perceived size of it.

Towards the bottom center of the first picture on page 1? That car is no longer there...but there is a 55 Chevy pickup parked in the trees there as "yard art". I put a fire pit there, so...that spot's out.

We like all the open space in back, despite the buildings being somewhat clustered in front. You can sort of make-out tracks through the grass and forest- I use it as a rally-cross track. And our daughter runs and plays in the fields. I'm in the process of planting a tree-line at the very back (far right) of the property, and eventually removing that tree line that splits the property vertically about 2/3 of the way to the right.

SVreX wrote: In reply to volvoclearinghouse: Your yard looks like mine. Guys like you and me sometimes forget that the easy button is sometimes to get rid of stuff.

I hear ya. I've been trying to keep to a "must sell 2 vehicles to buy 1" strategy this year. I have one vehicle I'm slowly dismantling for junk now, and another one or two I need to get rid off soon. Trying to focus. It's hard.

In reply to volvoclearinghouse:

I feel your pain.

There's also the wild child 3 year old (who loves to hang out in the garage with Daddy, as evidenced by the picture above) and the 6 month old whose teeth are just coming in and who's learning to crawl just now.

I had another thought about it after you mentioned that the 16x40 and 18x18 parts aren't truly one building.

How about razing #5 and build a bigger/longer but low height building for the car/garden/etc. storage that is being handled by both the 16x40 part of #3 and #5. That way, you're not looking to make #5 big enough for a lift. Then, you tear down the 16x40 part of #3 and renovate/widen the 18x18 portion to be the lift/dirty work space near the house.

Bit more involved, but it might get you where you want to be. Do #5 first, then that allows you to move out of #3.

One more suggestion. Any issue with the space in red?

If you do a common roof over both parts of #3 you would be load bearing on the door wall and the back wall, so you wouldn't need a load bearing on on the end butted up to the 18x18 part.

Start with an in person chat with your permitting office. Take in the overhead picture and start with the "I want to put a new roof on 3, and am thinking about expanding it a bit while I am at it" angle and ask what your options are.

Wxdude10 wrote: I had another thought about it after you mentioned that the 16x40 and 18x18 parts aren't truly one building. How about razing #5 and build a bigger/longer but low height building for the car/garden/etc. storage that is being handled by both the 16x40 part of #3 and #5. That way, you're not looking to make #5 big enough for a lift. Then, you tear down the 16x40 part of #3 and renovate/widen the 18x18 portion to be the lift/dirty work space near the house. Bit more involved, but it might get you where you want to be. Do #5 first, then that allows you to move out of #3. One more suggestion. Any issue with the space in red?

Area in red is what I asked about earlier. Fire pit- no dice.

But the rest of your idea is pretty good. Getting rid of #5 makes the site a lot more useable.

volvoclearinghouse said:

We have a...unique property:

So...where is volvoclearinghouse's garage going to be?

All right.  So some time has passed, and Mrs VCH and I have discussed it and come to some ideas...

The chickens (we have 11 grown, and 6 babies inside the house for now) are going to outgrow their little coop area- just to the left of Building 3.  So, Building 5 (currently a dilapidated run-in) will be razed and a 16' x 32' chicken habitat constructed there.  It will be a low building- peak of the roof about 8' tall- and mostly just a wooden frame with chicken wire over it, with two smaller enclosed areas at the bottom end for a garden shed and the enclosed chicken house.  

The 16 x 40 part of B3 (the left-most portion) will have the roof removed.  Centered in that space will be a 16 wide x 28 deep new building that juts downward (in the above picture) and has a roofline tall enough for a lift.  This will be a pole building, with a pad poured afterwards.  On each side of the 16' wide part will be a roughly 12' wide single car parking space, lengthened out to 20 or 24 feet, and likely concreted as well.  Or maybe just one concreted.  

The 18 x 18 part of B3 (the right portion) will be re-roofed and otherwise unmodified and just be a 2 car garage.  

The current chicken coop area will allow for outside but fenced-in parking of 2 parts cars.  

I think this will work.  It preserves the big open field, gives me enough room for one lift space and keeps the rest of the garage with a lower roof so it doesn't turn into a huge monolithic thing blocking our view to the west.  She gets a bigger, nicer chicken area out of it too.  There will be some juggling of cars and stuff to clear out of buildings while they're being reno'd, but hopefully we'll use this opportunity to cull some of it, too.  

Sounds like a plan!  My garage is only 200 ft. from the house, but in the winter or rain it's a PITA, especially herding little kids & groceries.

BTW, what is this?  Chrysler wagon?

In reply to 914Driver :

Yep- '66 Town and Country.  I had it roadworthy not long after this picture was taken, and then it started spitting out freeze plugs and it's been parked for a year or so now.  :-(  Need to remove the engine to get at some of the plugs.