So I joked about the element pitching a fit when coming to the cold weather. Well, It did this week.
So background information, It's a 2005 Honda Element with the 4 speed auto. It was never smooth shifting into first coming into a stop. from when I picked it up. It's got fresh Honda AT fluid with no noticeable clutch particles in it. It has 205K miles on it. It started to do the flashing D and threw 2 codes last night from the check engine, P0780 and P1736 (Honda Second Gear Switch Circuit Malfunction). I couldn't get the flashing D code as it comes and goes.
So the switch is nothing big. $67 for the Honda part and really easy to replace. Outside of that and inspecting the wiring harness, anything else I should look at? Basically, it's not engaging drive for a long time when cold (0-30 degrees F) . Once it does engage it there is no issues and drives actually decent. Then sometimes it's really clumsy to down shift to 1st coming to a stop. I did already check that the fluid is full and we are good there.
I'm not a auto transmission guy so any info would help.
Interesting. I have a Honda Accord in our Missoula property, showed 331K miles last year, no issues in cold.
Honda ATF DW-1 fluid doesn't perform as well in cold climates as the old discontinued Z1 ATF, but its the only stuff available now, that could be an issue.
In my experience, when you do a transmission fluid change on Hondas, its best to change three times in sequence. Change it once, go for a short drive and make sure the transmission goes through all the gears. Change it again and do the same thing, and then once more.
This would fix any issues on our Acura RDX. It took 12 qts of Honda fluid on that AWD transmission to do that.
In reply to Slippery :
Good to know there. I've seen that before too. So I'll look into that as well to make sure there is no garbage in it. It looks really clean overall though.
On my most recent Element I did the flush X 3 routine and it fixed a shudder problem I was experiencing. It wasn't exactly a cheap endeavor, but I got the genuine fluid from Amazon for reasonable money and the car is still doing great 20k miles later.
Thanks guys. I have a case in the trunk of the car for a flush this weekend. We will give it a shot.
So it's for sure not just a flush job. The check engine light is on non stop now and yeah so the new switch will be here next week. It's also making noise on the 1-2 shift as it went down the street.
Personally I think it saw the weather forecast for 4-6" of snow and said F this and broke something minor but enough to disable it.
I'm pretty well-versed in Honda automatics transmissions, although they've been the 5 and 6 speed autos connected to our Odysseys and our Pilot. The one in our '05 Odyssey went at 150k, the first transmission in our '17 Odyssey went out at 194k, and the used replacement was bad from the get-go. So our '17 Odyssey is on its third transmission. Knock on wood, I've never had transmission problems on another vehicle outside of these.
The first thing I'd recommend is a Foxwell Scanner with the Honda software. The flashing D transmission codes are stored in the computer, but a regular OBD2 scanner won't be able to pull them out. If you don't get the Foxwell scanner or an equivalent, I'd get those codes scanned (a dealer or regular shop could do it as well), and then see where those codes lead you.
The 3X drain and fill (with torque converter lockup in between) is a great way to eliminate old fluid as a potential cause or contributor to the issue. Honda ATs can tend to run hot (especially at idle), and I've seen anecdotal evidence that the (non-synthetic) Honda OEM fluid doesn't do as well once it's seen some heat. Idling is when I've seen the highest AT temps. I monitor those with a Bluetooth dongle and Torque+, but the Foxwell scanner will also show temp in real-time (in Celsius).
I now run Valvoline MaxLife ATF fluid in the transmission on our Odyssey and have been pleased with it. I typically do a single drain and fill every 10k after doing an initial 3x drain and fill. My wife's Pilot has 107k on that and I still use the OE Honda fluid (I did install the factory transmission cooler on that one). Same 10k interval there after the initial 3X drain and fill. The Odyssey has an aftermarket cooler that I installed.
Once you get everything sorted, an AT cooler can help lower temps, as well.
I'd also check out some of the model-specific forums for vehicles that use that transmission, just to see if they have any more specific information.
Honda ATs are different in that they shift down into every gear on their way back to first. It's a little weird if you've never owned one before. And bad motor mounts can make those shifts feel exaggerated.
In reply to dj06482 (Forum Supporter) :
Thanks. I got a guy I know coming over this weekend with a Foxwell like tool to see if it's salvageable. It went from not moving when cold to not moving at all so we will see. I am hoping it is. Tom replaced all of the motor mounts so it's good there.
I really don't want to have to drive up to ND to get a transmission for it. Luckily the Integra is purring like a kitten but I was hoping to spare it from the nebraska winters hence the purchase of the element.
In reply to bmw88rider :
Was the transmission torque converter locking up on top gear when you drove it from Florida?
I have a Foxwell, and I am pretty sure I have the Honda software loaded up. If your friend's doesnt work let me know and I can ship it to you to troubleshoot.
I thought it was. I don't remember it not locking up.
I totally appreciate the offer. The fluid is a little burnt so I'm hoping a clutch pack didn't get taken out. There is a good one up in Fargo area with 71K miles on it if worse comes to worse.
Flashing the D is typically concerning... 
I don't know about the honda transmissions specifically, but I've had some transmissions fail solenoids with some similar symptoms. They get worn and start blowing off pressure, and then the pressure compensation controls in the computer get all wacked out trying to correct it because now the system model in the computer doesn't match the reality of the hardware.
My first Honda AT issue, the symptoms were that the car wouldn't lock up on the highway, and the revs kept climbing to maintain speed. It was a pretty spectacular failure, and developed over the course of a mile or so. After letting everything cool down (and changing the fluid with the 3x drain and fill), it would drive fine in town and on secondary roads, but would slip when driving on the highway. The slipping would be accompanied by the flashing D light, but I didn't have the code reader to actually pull the code.
The second bad transmission I had the flashing D issue, and I could compare the speed on two shafts (I want to say input and output) in the Foxwell scanner. After some time, the difference between the two speeds would exceed the expected thresholds and a code would trip, along with the flashing D light. It would also bounce in/out of lockup at lower speeds, as well. I have a data log of that somewhere, the RPMs were constantly bouncing within a 200RPM range at a steady speed.
The third bad transmission ironically didn't have any codes, but was just slipping constantly. It would lock up 100% in OD, though.
If it would help, I can probably dig up some of the codes I faced.
Crossing my fingers that it's just a bad solenoid issue in your case.
You guys aren't making me too confident that I won't be doing a transmission change. The no motion now really has me concerned. My codes are P1736 and P0780. Well, I'll know sunday it looks like.
Are you going to change your avatar, when you put this thing for sale next week?
Well, Not looking good. The parts I thought that were potentially bad tested fine. So I am going to just put a different one in there. I wasn't looking forward to changing a transmission so I priced it at the local Honda "specialist" (More like a parts swapper) They wanted $5K for a used transmission installed. Umm No. So I have a transmission with 72K miles coming for $800 to the door.
So I'll have a project in a couple weeks.
Can't wait to see this POS leaving the nest.
