alfadriver wrote: In reply to Keith: And the Healey has seen it's share of the race track. Perhaps make a copy of a very desireable, but rare, healey?? Healey Sebring? Or something like that- rare enough to be hard to come by or see, but one that has won it's fair share of races.
Someone earlier mentioned copyright issues, which is not to be dismissed lightly. Any idea if A-H designs are officially "owned" by anyone?
nderwater wrote: Good call on the Toyota 2000GT, Ian
Two years ago I went to the Tokyo Auto Salon and there was a guy that was building replica's of the 2000GT. He would build you a coupe of a roadster. The coupe was a perfect copy outside and ran on late model Nissan running gear. The roadster was Miata based. The windshield frame and doors were recognizable as such.
Keith wrote: It's interesting to see the number of calls for Japanese classics, even if some of them are still fairly recent. You just don't see Japanese replicas.
Alpine/Tiger seems a good bet. Open body work, probably easier on mold costs, and options for the small bore fans (Alpine) and v8 fans (Tiger).
You used to be able to come by Alpines 20 years back, but I rarely see them anymore.
The "marketing" down side is only older types like me (44) are likely to know about it, and you might miss the 30-something crowd. But, it's usually the older types that have enough income to consider the purchase, so maybe not that bad?
And, if you can get the Tigers classed in with the Cobra spec series, it'll make for interesting fields/competition, and visuals too if you flare the fenders of the Tiger.
dyintorace wrote:alfadriver wrote: In reply to Keith: And the Healey has seen it's share of the race track. Perhaps make a copy of a very desireable, but rare, healey?? Healey Sebring? Or something like that- rare enough to be hard to come by or see, but one that has won it's fair share of races.Someone earlier mentioned copyright issues, which is not to be dismissed lightly. Any idea if A-H designs are officially "owned" by anyone?
I would think BMW. From what I recall, they own the A-H "marque" and I'm assuming the copyright for the designs. There used to be a replica called a Sebring for a long time, I don't know why it went away - or even if it did.
Some car companies aren't aggressive at chasing replica makers. Others, particularly Ferrari, are very protective. Given that you can still buy the kit to make your Miata look like a Z3 (!) after more than a decade, I'm guessing BMW doesn't pay much attention.
As for the demographics, I spoke with the Caterham importers a few years back. They said their customers were splitting into two very distinct groups - the guys building the "Super Seven" they always wanted, going for options like the full wings. The others were the hard-core performance types who were after the Superlight. Based on what I see of Caterhams (and my own biases), I think the latter is taking over.
But when's the last time you saw someone under 50 driving a Cobra kit?
Looks like the Sebring kit is still available.
http://www.classicroadsters.ca/html/sebring_mx.html
BMW 507?
the windshield and top (if a vert) will be the biggest costs. The windshield will probably limit the choice of the replicar car you make. I would guess that if the car was so hard to come by that someone would make a kit of it, then buying a windshield would not be an option.
I would go with a design taking the best of your favorite cars, or come up with something to repicate a cool show car that never made production.
personaly, I love this -
or make a cheap copy of this (with better tail lights)
Keith wrote: Given that you can still buy the kit to make your Miata look like a Z3 (!) after more than a decade, I'm guessing BMW doesn't pay much attention.
Or BMW just decided the Miata/Z3 isn't worth the effort to squash.
They are VERY protective of the MINI brand... and since the 507 is still an icon within the company, something tells me they would not take a replica lightly.
Unfortunately, Toyota would probably view a 2000GT replica in the same way.
nderwater wrote: Good call on the Toyota 2000GT, Ian
I like the 2000GT idea, use a Taco for a donor, since Toyota decided to put frames on them you can knock a hammer through! (Any one else here seen them do the recall test on the Tacos?)
nderwater wrote: Good call on the Toyota 2000GT, Ian
I like the 2000GT idea, use a Taco for a donor, since Toyota decided to put frames on them you can knock a hammer through! (Any one else here seen them do the recall test on the Tacos?)
Couple of months ago I posted a poll in Classic to see if an MGA kit using Miata mechanicals would be of interest.
http://classicmotorsports.net/forum/classic-cars/poll-mga-kitcar/26102/page1/
Someone has made molds of the MGA before. http://www.mgaguru.com/mgtech/variants/vt106h2.htm
From the responses doesn't seem to be interest though.
Randy
On a couple of occasions I have thought about a Speedway Motors Track-T kit using the Miata backbone.
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Speedway-1927-Track-T-Roadster-Kit,4010.html
http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Track-T-Instruction-Manual,4009.html
Ian F wrote: They are VERY protective of the MINI brand... and since the 507 is still an icon within the company, something tells me they would not take a replica lightly.
That's because the most valuable asset MINI has is the brand! But there's no AUSTIN HEALEY, so they might not be quite so excited about it. The fact that the Sebring is still in existence would indicate that. In fact, I'd take that as a "it's probably going to be okay" indication.
Here's a fun exercise. The Sebring is obviously a kit car. Sit down and figure out just what cues make you come to that realization - the fender flares, the incorrect wheel/tire sizing, the modern steering wheel, etc - and use that to figure out how to avoid it.
It's another car that was originally powered by an inline six, but how about this?
I just ran across a thread on another forum about questionable kit cars intended to make a modern Corvette look like an earlier one. A kit to make a Miata look like a '53 Corvette almost seems like it would turn out better than most of the ones in that thread. I'm guessing most of the people who build such a thing would opt for an LSx swap...
Rusnak_322 wrote: the windshield and top (if a vert) will be the biggest costs. The windshield will probably limit the choice of the replicar car you make. I would guess that if the car was so hard to come by that someone would make a kit of it, then buying a windshield would not be an option. I would go with a design taking the best of your favorite cars, or come up with something to repicate a cool show car that never made production. personaly, I love this -
The notion of a cool looking two seater, like the design sketch above is interesting. I think that particular design is actually quite striking. Best case scenario might be a design that lends itself to both coupe and convertible options. Someone pointed out in this thread earlier that a Miata already is a convertible so a coupe might have more broad appeal.
perhaps a kit to make a Miata look like an old shoebox Chevy, or the big sleds of the pre/post war era? stuff that commonly got turned into a lead sled, but less radical body mods and much better handling. those who are into the big V8 barges can drop in a LSX, those who want a tossable Tri-year Chevy could keep the factory 1.8
I think that the idea of making a Miata into something lovely and classic is fundamentally flawed in that despite it's abundance of inherent goodness, the Miata just doesn't cary that much cachet. Given that you can buy ones as cheaply as you can, that association will linger. It's kinda like a VW-based kit - no matter how good you make it, it's still at heart a veedub. (I'm talking about associations here, as an owner of two Miatas I certainly know their virtues)
So where does that leave one? I think that you need to market to the enthusiast who doesn't give a damn about cachet. Either build an inexpensive setup like a better looking version of the Exocet, or go balls out and go sports racer. But if you go through all the trouble of making a Sebring-type replica for the Miata, I don't think that drivetrain will be so well recieved.
As for the demographics, I spoke with the Caterham importers a few years back. They said their customers were splitting into two very distinct groups - the guys building the "Super Seven" they always wanted, going for options like the full wings. The others were the hard-core performance types who were after the Superlight. Based on what I see of Caterhams (and my own biases), I think the latter is taking over. But when's the last time you saw someone under 50 driving a Cobra kit?
Demographics would play a huge role. Unless you're looking at a low quality kit, these things usually get pretty expensive in the build out. In the FFR world, almost nobody ever stayed within budget on their build. So you have to cater to the people who would have the money and time to build the car. Would they want to build one using Miata parts? The Cobra had huge appeal because besides replicating one of the most famous cars ever built, it used big HP/TQ engines that could really be made to scream. Not so much for the Miata. Might be a hard sell to have someone drop a lot of money and be left with a kit car putting out horsepower roughly in the low 100's.
As for the Cobra demographics, it actually was all over the map. I'd say that more around 50% of our club was over 50 years old. But there was also a large number who were late 20's through 40's. But again, I think a lot of that has to do with the sheer attraction of the Cobra.
FFR polls their customers occasionally to get legitimate "what it cost to build" numbers. It's pretty interesting. They're currently quoting "average customers spend between $22K and $24K dollars building their base Mk4 roadsters". I don't know if this includes the kit or not.
I'm basing my impression of Cobra demographics based on where I see the cars - car shows on Main St, cruise nights, etc. I can see how this would give me a skewed viewpoint of who owns them, as those events also only pull a certain demographic. It makes sense that the younger builders would be out driving the cars instead of polishing them and listening to Roy Orbison covers. Although they don't come out to our local track days...
I don't think anyone would want to build a Cobra with Miata parts. That's just not going to work.
An Austin Healey, I can see. A Jaguar C or D is a less compelling option, but if it performed I think it would work. Of course, the people I hang around with don't see a Miata as a bad platform to use as a base for a kit, but I don't hang around with a representative cross-section of the automotive community. Comparing it to VW kit is a little harsh, as the VW never really handled (unlike the Miata), the engine note would automatically give it away as a kit (unlike the Miata) and unless you were building Porsche replicas, it was just plain wrong from a layout standpoint.
In terms of demographics- a theory to consider?
For an average Cobra buyer, I would fully expect that a Mustang was always part of their life. Moreso- for an average V8 Mustang owner, a Cobra is a status car.
Now, I'll fully accept that there are no classics where owners also own Miatas- there's either too much variety who have both, or a lack of acceptance. OTOH, for Miata owners, what car appeals to them? Watching the Miata board, it seems as if more like light/simple over most other- even though many classics are quite popular. But my theory is that most would love to try or own a 7, Elan, or Elise someday. Since the elise if out of the question, that leaves Elan or 7, and by far, the 7 is a lot eaiser to adapt to Miata parts than the diminutuve Elan.
Powertrain + full rear subframe, and front a arms, upright, and with clever parts making- the shock/spring combo- replace the top mount hardware with a custom piece that bolts to the chassis.
(BTW, I have considered a GTV or Ti drop over, since the Alfa layout is really close to the Miata WRT engine over front wheels, wheelbase, etc.)
Eric
I like the idea of the 53 corvette, there had been a body in production for several years at lonestar
http://www.lonestarclassics.com/lsc-kit-cars-replicas/lone-star-classics-route-66-roadster-kit-car.cfm
One small hurdle is the wheelbase, the '53 is 102 and the Miata is a tick under 90 so the PPF, driveshaft, brake lines will all need to be lengthened.
As long as we're dreaming...
1952 ALFA ROMEO 1900 DISCO VOLANTE SPIDER
More pics/info on the car linked: http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/carsforsale/alfa_romeo/1900/1155935.html
(It's even a inline 4... 
)
Perhaps we're overthinking this. What 4 cylinder car is an icon, has a huge following, a long racing history, is getting harder to find in nice shape and has a habit of rusting when exposed to salt?
Start working on a fiberglass copy of a Miata. In another 20 years you'll be golden 
Junkyard_Dog wrote: Perhaps we're overthinking this. What 4 cylinder car is an icon, has a huge following, a long racing history, is getting harder to find in nice shape and has a habit of rusting when exposed to salt? Start working on a fiberglass copy of a Miata. In another 20 years you'll be golden
You forgot "and is rare".
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