No sooner do I decide to list my Saab 900S for sale than I come across a tempting ad for the winter beater I've been mulling, a cheap 2005 Volvo XC70. It's closing in on a quarter of a million miles, but that doesn't seem unusual for these. Information is a bit sketchy, but it looks to be in good shape, supposedly well maintained, but has a misfire on one cylinder; the owner doesn't know more than that. I'm guessing he just decided it was time to move on rather than spend more money on it.
Obviously I would hope it's just a coil or a plug, and I can test those. I've got a generic OBD2 scanner, but that's probably not going to tell me more than I already know. Anything else on the 2.5T that's a known culprit for misfires? Worth doing a compression test as well?
I've reviewed the multiple forum threads on these cars, so I have some sense of the general issues. Anything specific I should inspect or look for on a test drive?
I've been feeling the same way about Saabs...fml, I don't need anymore cars.
Saab 900s or 5cyl newer Volvo.
Dammit.
fanfoy
SuperDork
9/3/22 12:06 p.m.
Misfire is probably just a coil, but ask if the PVC system was changed.
There is a good chance the AWD doesn't work. The P2 don't have the sleeve problems of the P1, but it's still not fun to fix. Usually the Haldex pump is fried or the connector to it is corroded.
Check that the different modules all work properly and communicate with each other (ABS, CEM, TCM). 2005 should be passed the major problems, but it can get annoying tracking down the issues. That's what made me get rid of my 2004.
For the rest, very solid cars that wear like iron.
In reply to fanfoy :
Am I correct in assuming that checking the modules required proprietary software? How difficult is changing the PCV? I'm hoping he has records, but I don't know at this point.
Diff module can suffer from either water intrusion or a pump that overloads it and kills the driver. Xemodex is your friend. Climb under and see how much slack there is when trying to rotate the driveshaft. Some is normal. Too much is a new angle drive. If the pump is dead, just but it from Volvo, or someone who sells the Volvo ones. Dorman is not your friend.
Misfire is a dead coil or a burned valve, in a ratio of about 1000 to 1.
Transmission will probably shift a bit funky for the next 200,000 miles.
The P2s have sleeve problems too.
If it is a coil, use Volvo or Bosch coils from ipd. I learned the hard way that parts store coils do not play well, in the engine breaking sense.
I read this discussion of the Haldex issues from FCP Euro, so I think I understand the basics of the potential problems. From what I see from other sources, the job looks significant but fairly straightforward (correct me if I'm wrong). This AWD stuff is new to me, so I'm starting from square one.
I don't do cheap aftermarket parts for anything critical like coils or high pressure pumps, so no worries there.
The diff pump, the biggest parts of the job are dropping the exhaust, and getting the rear yoke off the diff flange. Hint: There's two holes between the bolt holes that allow you to punch it loose.
Oddly enough, buying Volvo coils from ipd is CHEAPER than the Delphi-made ones from the auto parts store. I think they were only $65 each. That is less than cost, let alone retail, for the parts store stuff.
OE plugs only. You can buy them in blister packs of five in Volvo packaging from your new best friend (ipd).
You may find that the wiring is rather crispy under the coil cover. Be very, very gentle with the wiring, and you may find yourself having to rewire that part of the car. It is not difficult, just tedious. I bought terminals, I think from FCP Euro, because pigtails are ridiculously expensive and you would have to splice them longer anyway. The plastic shells are also crazy expensive.
Mind you, the crank sensor connector is like $3. But coil pigtails are like $60.
In reply to Pete. (l33t FS) :
Makes me wonder if the misfire is a wiring problem. Certainly something to keep an eye out for when I see the car. How long a section did you have to rewire?
In reply to 02Pilot :
All five coils had damaged insulation. Replaced all coil wiring under the cover. The valve timing solenoid wires were fine so I left them alone.
In reply to Pete. (l33t FS) :
Oh, that's charming. I'll be gentle and hope for the best. Thanks.
In reply to 02Pilot :
In my case, the wire I was holding up was the power wire, which would short to the head and cause a certain underhood fuse to blow. I diapered under the wire with electrical tape and lived with it for ten months or so before the shipment of round tuits arrived 
My hand was eventually forced because the engine started blowing coolant. It ultimately was due to a failed thermostat, and this is where it gets strange. The A/C had a leak large enough to lose all refrigerant after a day or two. Volvo's strategy when it sees the high side refrigerant sender read crazy low is to assume the sensor is bad and run the cooling fan at full speed all the time. This probably helped the engine limp along with a thermostat that was not opening properly.
The other funky thing is that I learned the thermostat was bad because the replacement engine, and functional A/C, would run up to 260F at idle with the A/C and heat off. This is only a needle width higher than 200F. I only noticed because I had a scantool plugged in.
The thermostat could be replaceable separately, if it were available separately, but it only sold as a $160 water outlet assembly. You can't even get the gasket for where the water outlet halves bolt together. Annoying. Anyway, that's why I originally did not replace the thermostat...
In reply to Pete. (l33t FS) :
Sounds like Volvo adopted the buffered temp gauge approach I loathed in BMWs, before BMW decided that nobody really needs a temp gauge anyway (I mean, if drivers aren't going to use their turn signals, are they really going to look at a gauge?). That's a pretty convoluted failure mode, hopefully one I will not encounter if I go ahead with this ill-conceived plan. I will make sure to verify the operating temp with a scantool.
In reply to 02Pilot :
Autometer sells a $200 doodads that plugs into the data link connector so you can read all sorts of information in the cluster's LCD display. Not certain if they sell one for the XC70, but I would think that one for any AWD turbo five for a given year should work.
Having data is COOL.
So while I'm waiting for the seller to respond to my email trying to set up a time for me to see the car, I of course am perusing other options should he flake out on me. There are a number of similar XC70s around, and some of these are similarly broken. I've now seen two different cars listed with low compression on #5. Is there something on these engines that causes issues specific to that particular cylinder? If it's just the one I'd think burned exhaust valve, but if so, why on that hole? Or am I being misled by data from a small sample size?
Another question: There are a couple of V50s of the same vintage (2005-6) listed not too far from me. How do we feel about those? Same rust resistance? Looks to be the NA version of the same 5cyl in the XC70 - is this better, worse, or similar? Could be an option if it does what I need it to (survive winters and haul stuff) if the XC70 people can't get their collective act together and communicate with me.
Edit: One of the cars I'm considering is a T5 AWD version. Am i correct in assuming this is the same Haldex system on the XC70, with the same weak points?
V50 is NOT the same chassis, it is S40/C30/Focus/Mazda3. But made in Sweden.
The 2.4 is like any other whiteblock.
The AWD in the P1 chassis is similar to the P2, but different. I do not think the Haldex is particularly problematic, it just needs the fluid and filter changed more often than Never. The control module, I found, loses its water resistance when something gets on the exhaust and catches fire, melting the connector. D'oh.
This seems like as good a place as any for this...
That is the generation AFTER the OP's subject car. Slightly more on-topic - 2007 XC70 in my driveway since... well, 2007. It's been nearly flawless with little more than routine maintenance. It is a lower mileage car with an attentive owner, but still.
Forgive my ignorance, but is the S40/C30/Focus/Mazda3 chassis something worth pursuing? Does it spontaneously combust often? Is the turbo T5 AWD version something special or just another car?
In reply to bludroptop :
I don't suppose you want to sell me your XC70 for a low, low price, do you?
Going to look at the V50 T5 AWD tomorrow morning, so any dire warnings would be most welcome before then. Frankly, as long as it doesn't rust or burn to the ground, I'm not going to be hypercritical. I'm told the A/C is weak and there's an exhaust rattle. Other than that it's supposed to be ready to go.
Well, I never made it to the V50, and I think it's still for sale, so I'll ask again: what's the consensus on the P1 chassis? Does it have the same rust resistance as the P2?
I'm really more inclined to find an XC70, but the people who own them around here seem extraordinarily poor communicators when it comes to responding to inquiries.
Finally got to check out examples of both the XC70 and V50. Both were ~250k miles and pretty roached, so I'm not considering them representative examples, but I figure those with more experience here can help me better understand what is and isn't to be expected with these.
The 2004 XC70 felt like a bus. Now, my cars are all pretty small and light, but this felt huge and somewhat ponderous. Seating was very tall compared to what I'm used to. Engine sounded like it was working hard when I got into the throttle, but that didn't translate to as much forward motion as the noise level would suggest; I know it's an LPT engine, but it felt like this one had a boost leak. Or maybe it was the transmission. This car had issues, but even discounting them, I expected a more European - read lively - driving experience than this one offered.
The 2006 V50 T5 AWD, on the other hand, in spite of being a bad example (ABS light on, something loose in the suspension, various noises), drove a lot more like what I was expecting. Seating position was lower and better, and the engine made decent power. Not as cushy obviously, but still softer than anything else I own. Still enough space to be useful (I was pleasantly surprised by the cargo space in both cars, actually).
Are the driving experiences of these two cars normally this different? Or was the XC70 just a really poor sample? Right now, I'm leaning more toward the V50 (if I can find a better example with AWD) simply because the XC70 was not pleasant to drive.
The XC70 and V50 AWD had the same engine and trans, aside from minor differences relating to chassis fitment. (The P1 chassis is tiny compared to the P2)
Food for thought. The C30/S40/V50 are ranked as the best rust protection of any car sold in the US. The Mazda3 is ranked as the worst.
The suspension and stuff all rusts, but that is replaceable.
In reply to Pete. (l33t FS) :
If the P1 resists rust like the P2, I'm thinking that's my new primary target. It's big enough to hold my bikes inside and haul crap to the dump, and the AWD version covers all my winter driving needs (especially if I put snows on it, which I almost certainly will).
I was a little shocked by how big the XC70 felt.
