jfryjfry said:
In reply to APEowner :
A little Left foot braking when driving somewhat aggressively does it
taking off from a stop and my left foot is the slightest bit behind getting on the gas....
If my left foot happens to move the brake pedal even slightly, it doesn’t apply brakes but does illuminate the brake light (which isn’t good but better than what it does:) which causes it to cut power
what happens is it moves and then kills power for a second or more even once you get off of the brake. Pumping the accelerator sometimes helps.
It definitely has made me better about not having unnecessary overlap or putting inadvertent pressure on the brake. But the consequence is dangerous.
Professionally it rears its head when I’m tracking with another vehicle (picture car, camera car, etc) and two-foot driving is the best technique to do it. Double pumping the throttle while keeping the brake slightly pushed often defeats it.
But the original issue is also, imho, a major safety issue for reasons described.
Your street driving technique is discouraged and your track driving technique is pretty unusual due to your job. While I can see why you find it really frustrating I'm not sure it's fair to call it dangerous as most people will never encounter those conditions. Overactive traction control however could be considered a hazard.
Power cut on gas / brake would be annoying to me, I think. In anything with an auto, I tend to 2 foot it off the line if I'm on a decent hill unless it's got a really right torque converter, as it makes for a smoother takeoff and prevents any roll-back.
The other fun thing about the Impala is that if you have the stability control off, trick the car into getting sideways, and hit the brakes while it's sideways, it turns stability back on.
My buddy's new C5 Z06 tried to kill us when he stomped the throttle in second, and commenced to drive up the road sideways. That worked for about a half second, then the car actively tried to hit the guardrail. TC OFF was the way to go after that.
snailmont5oh said:
The other fun thing about the Impala is that if you have the stability control off, trick the car into getting sideways, and hit the brakes while it's sideways, it turns stability back on.
My buddy's new C5 Z06 tried to kill us when he stomped the throttle in second, and commenced to drive up the road sideways. That worked for about a half second, then the car actively tried to hit the guardrail. TC OFF was the way to go after that.
That's surprising. The Camaro SS 1LE I test drove back in December, with everything turned on, was a joy. I hammered it going up a long on ramp, 2nd gear, I felt the diff trying to work out the slightly off-camber on ramp but it never felt like it cut power or anything. It was like "Let me get this just---------OK there it is"
That E-Diff is awesome sauce. And it's not an "ediff" using the brakes, it's a legit electronically controlled LSD.
APEowner said:
Turboeric said:
APEowner said:
jfryjfry said:
The other “safety” feature I despise is how many cars will cut power when both pedals are simultaneously pushed.
I think that these things could cause more accidents than they prevent.
Under what circumstances is this a problem for you?
Braking into a corner while doing a heel/toe downshift.
That would be an issue. Are there any manual transmission cars that have that issue? I haven't run across it yet.
Manual VWs do this. It's irritating for track driving and autocross.
Snrub
HalfDork
6/14/18 5:30 p.m.
clutchsmoke said:
My brother's RX-8 is the same, but once snow is on the ground it's better to turn off traction control.
Everyone's definition is different, but I'd argue the opposite with a S1 RX-8. I find it sucks in the dry. In the snow it's not perfect, but the TC mixed with the SC keeps the back end from moving around too much.
First you have to spin the tires to activate the TC, so don't spin the tires.
The stability control is another thing. The only time I've activated is on a dirt road and I practically have to make it work. Boy is it quick.
My 05 Colorado is horrible to the point of unsafe as well. Standard start up procedure for me is, start engine, turn off traction control.
nderwater said:
APEowner said:
Turboeric said:
Braking into a corner while doing a heel/toe downshift.
That would be an issue. Are there any manual transmission cars that have that issue? I haven't run across it yet.
Manual VWs do this. It's irritating for track driving and autocross.
My Focus ST cuts power if you brake/gas at the same time, but only after about 3 seconds. You can do left foot brake taps and heel/toe downshifts just fine, you just can't stand on the gas/brake at the same time for an extended period (but you shouldn't be doing that anyway).
iceracer said:
First you have to spin the tires to activate the TC, so don't spin the tires.
Going uphill in deep snow, that's virtually impossible to do. Allowing some tire spin as the car claws it's way up the hill allows you to climb the hill. Cutting the power simply makes you stop.
This thread makes me happy that neither my s2000 or my Forester have traction control.
nderwater said:
APEowner said:
Turboeric said:
APEowner said:
jfryjfry said:
The other “safety” feature I despise is how many cars will cut power when both pedals are simultaneously pushed.
I think that these things could cause more accidents than they prevent.
Under what circumstances is this a problem for you?
Braking into a corner while doing a heel/toe downshift.
That would be an issue. Are there any manual transmission cars that have that issue? I haven't run across it yet.
Manual VWs do this. It's irritating for track driving and autocross.
Wow! That's a seriously bad implementation of that safety feature. I'm frankly surprised that a German company would mess that up that badly. I wonder if it's only the US cars that have that problem.
In reply to Turboeric :
Once, on a frozen lake, I ran into some heavy snow, the TC light started blinking so held my foot lightly on the gas.I kept moving forward, the TC light kept blinking. Made it though.
I sometimes wonder what would happen if I had gone full throttle.
I sometimes think my old time winter driving habits may come into play ,light throttle, less wheel spin, help me have less problem with the TC.
Old way was to have as little wheel spin as possible by letting up on the throttle. I won a winter rally by doing that. No snow tires.
We used to start in second gear (3sp), this is what happens with those vehicle that have the traction choice.
This is the theory behind TC. Un fortunately sometime is doesn't work as it should.
iceracer said:
In reply to Turboeric :
Old way was to have as little wheel spin as possible by letting up on the throttle. I won a winter rally by doing that. No snow tires.
when I had my 318ti, I was lucky to have a model with the "winter package". in early 1996, that meant heated seats and an LSD. Driving on summer tyres one late fall, I got caught in a freak blizzard at work. By the time I got out, there was already 6 inches of snow on the ground and it was still coming down. I got stuck twice. Once on the road as I tried to make a turn, I got out of it by spinning the rear tyres and then depressing the clutch. The rears would immediately stop spinning, but the momentum would get transferred to the car, slowly pushing it out of the ruts it was stuck in. The second time was in my own driveway, I didn't care at that point
iceracer said:
In reply to Turboeric :
Once, on a frozen lake, I ran into some heavy snow, the TC light started blinking so held my foot lightly on the gas.I kept moving forward, the TC light kept blinking. Made it though.
I sometimes wonder what would happen if I had gone full throttle.
I sometimes think my old time winter driving habits may come into play ,light throttle, less wheel spin, help me have less problem with the TC.
Old way was to have as little wheel spin as possible by letting up on the throttle. I won a winter rally by doing that. No snow tires.
We used to start in second gear (3sp), this is what happens with those vehicle that have the traction choice.
This is the theory behind TC. Un fortunately sometime is doesn't work as it should.
In most cases, I'd agree with you. However, my driveway is long and steep, with a hairpin corner at the bottom of the steepest pitch. Going uphill with FWD, weight transfer works against you, and there isn't a sweet spot where there's enough power to climb the incline, but not so much power as to overwhelm the traction available. By allowing a little wheelspin (using my old fashioned right foot traction control), I'm able to get up the incline as the tires hunt a bit for traction (it's gravel under the snow). I'm not just flooring it and hoping for the best. The problem is that the traction control is so aggressive, the car grinds to a halt like it hit a wall. With the TC off, it climbs out with no difficulty, and most external observers would barely be aware of any wheelspin. Reducing power as a form of traction control, whether implemented by a computer or by an experience right foot, is an essential strategy. The problem with the GM system is that it is too binary - no wheelspin is allowed at all, and the power cut is very aggressive.
In reply to Turboeric :
my 10 forte was the same. 2nd gear stalls because it cut throttle in the middle of the drift in the driveway were bad.
