learn me Spec Racer Fords

I've been into the track hobby for about 6 years, mostly in Miatas.  A year ago I bought an early 1.6L Spec Miata and an enclosed trailer.  This winter I got my SCCA competition license and began racing, which has been a hoot. 

My goals are to have fun, stay safe, and continue to improve my driving to be regionally competitive.  I like being in a big racing class where you always have someone to race against.  I have a busy work schedule so realistically I can only do a full race weekend maybe 4-5 times a year, but I try to get to track days or small club races at least once a month, and I'm thinking of joining AMP to get a ton more track time.

In working my way up from the back of the race pack, I'm up against a few things.

- I want more coaching.  Current car doesn't have a data recorder; I've been using Track Addicts on the Iphone but for real coaching its capabilities are limited.  Putting a pro data recorder into an OBD 1 car is a time consuming/expensive endeavor.

- The car will need some investment in the next year or two; namely the Penske suspension setup (currently on Billies) and a fire suppression system.

- While my driving definitely needs improvement, the car is just not competitive with 1.8L NB Spec Miatas at the big boy tracks.  I can be faster than the other guys in the turns but I get pulled on every straight, and passes are really hard to execute unless someone makes a big mistake.

So I've decided to just move on to a fully featured and competitive race car.  Nationally competitive SM's with all the goodies are north of $30k, which I can swallow.  The part I don't like is the endless chase to the bleeding edge of the "Similar Miata" GCR with time and dollars.  On a similar budget there's a very well prepared and competitive SRF3 for sale close to me.

Things I like:

- it's a true Spec class with sealed drivetrains

- the running costs seem similar to SM, and SRF Hoosiers reportedly last longer than SM Hoosiers

- it's a purpose-built and supported race car, maintenance and setup are simple, and one of the SCCA Customer Service Reps is only an hour from where I live

- they look like an absolute blast to drive

Things I question:

- Safety.  It seems that the safety history of SM and SRF are very similar.  There are gives/takes for each platform; open cockpit for SRF, proximity to side impact for SM.  On-track incidents aren't uncommon but it seems like serious injuries are rare.

- Use for track days.  The groups I run with permit them, and I've never heard of anyone having an issue.  But they are small, low, and fast, which could spell trouble if mixing it up with one of the big door-slammers.

- Culture.  Generally I like the SM guys that I've met, they're good to hang out with.  I would assume that it's similar with SRF, but I don't know any except the guy that's selling the car.

So anyone here have any experience with these cars or the racing scene around them?

I am familiar with them.

SRFs are built like tanks so they are super safe.

I don't know the current price for an engine refresh (my numbers are 15-20 years old)

The running cost should actually be lower than SM. SM has gotten ridiculous..............I love the class but at the national level it's crazy.

Much like SM they move all around on the tires so they are huge fun.

As for track days I wouldn't be concerned; there are enough people running Radicals and the like that I wouldn't expect it to be an issue.

Thanks for the feedback.  Seems that an SRF engine is around $4k, transmission rebuild around $2k.  Lots of cars running 7-8 seasons on a motor. A competitive SM motor from a good builder seems to be in the $6-8k range, and I know people that go through one per season.  The SRF I'm looking at has a brand new motor and a newly rebuilt transmission.

Regarding track days- Radicals, Atoms, Exocets and Lotus 7's are common around here so I guess the SRF isn't that out of place from a size/visibility standpoint.

OK so the engines are still 4K. I've heard 8-10K for a professionally built SM motor. I build the engines for my Datsun myself and I spend almost 2K on them.  I also have heard of guys going several seasons on SRF engines. 

I used to run my D-Sports racer at track days (I've done it with my F500 as well) and generally you are so much faster than road cars that it's not an issue. The key is to slot your car so it shows up in the mirrors.

SRFs also hold their value very well. If I were choosing between SM and SRF I'd go with an SRF. 

I rented a Spec Racer Ford (gen2) at a track day once.  While it was an interesting experience, I decided I wasn't interested in owning one.  If you can find someone offering it, then I recommend an arrive-and-drive rental first as a "test drive".

As for why, I found the shifter to be really really vague, and the pedals were placed completely stupidly (spacing totally wrong for heel-toe).  Combined it made the car virtually impossible to downshift into 2nd.  Some of that might be due to the age/maintenance on the car I was driving (it was a rental, after all) and there might be a capability to adjust the fit, I'm not sure.

I also found that I didn't like the helmet buffeting in an open-cockpit car at speed.  It was very noisy and tiring to drive.

And yes, SRFs are small and low (but not really "fast" -- better lap times than a Spec Miata, but even more of a momentum car) and personally I was a little worried about the implications of being out on track with 4000 pound BMWs around me.  This is strictly a track day concern though, I would expect they'd run in a race group with cars similar to themselves.

I'm curious about your concern regarding data logging in an OBD-1 car, though?  While my AIM dash is hooked up to the ECU's CAN bus (E46 M3), I rarely look at any of the ECU channels other than throttle position.  RPM very occasionally, and coolant/oil temps drive lights on the dash, but hooking up that kind of stuff is fairly simple.

Thanks Codrus, that's good feedback. I need to check into the situation with the pedal box; I have size 14 feet so I can imagine that being a substantial issue.  They make a little lexan wind screen now that's supposed to help with the wind buffeting for taller drivers. Also the Gen 3 cars have 30% more power and 6% less weight so they're supposed to be quite a bit faster than the Gen 2's.

Regarding data, anything can be done with enough time and effort.  I really want sensor driven data for brakes, steering angle, throttle position, engine RPM, etc.  It seems like a lot of work when starting from scratch. If the car was perfect to begin with I'd put the work in, but there's other reasons to move along. 

I raced them for about ten years, on an arrive-and-drive basis.  I never had any issues with the pedals or ergonomics, so maybe that has more of an individual thing.  As mentioned they are built like tanks, on track fender to fender rubbing is no big deal - just make sure your car is painted in a color that is also available in race tape, so any cracked or broken fiberglass won't be as obvious.  :)  I put them into the tire wall a couple of times, and they survived surprisingly well given the impact speed.  Assuming you don't have any crash damage you should be able to race a season without much more than oil and brake fluid changes.  They aren't the fastest things on the track, but you're sitting in a center cockpit of a purpose built open race car so you feel like you're really doing something.  (of course, the downside of an open car is racing in the rain.)

Note there are several generations of SRFs: they're on Gen 3 now which is a step up in performance, but depending on what the situation is for you locally there may still be a lot of Gen 2 cars around.  I haven't driven a Gen 3 but I've been told the shifter is more positive.  I think they have some data collection ability built in but don't know to what extent.  The manual for converting a Gen 2 to a Gen 3 is available online:   https://static1.squarespace.com/static/56b57754b6aa60c06e98c270/t/5a5466b7e2c4836a1c3f2751/1515480770024/Manual+GEN+3+Accel+2018-01-03.pdf 

The crowd I raced with was by and large very friendly, and more than happy to hand you a beer at the end of the day.

SRF is switching to sequential transmissions next year, along with some throttle body changes iirc. Gen3 as it stands with the 5 speed will probably be around for a while still (especially at the regional level), but it might be something to think about.

I have been considering moving to SRF as my current class has dwindled down to nothing.

I rented an SRF3 for a test day a couple of years ago, and thought it was amazing, low weight and low center of gravity made for a great race car, and the character of the SRF3 motor was great too - sounds good and likes to rev.

Overall, I think I would love racing one, but I'm probably not going that route because it realistically is a bit beyond my means.

Pro's:

really fun car to drive - it's a purpose built race car.

big car counts in the southeast and close racing

seem to be generally reliable and easy parts sourcing through the CSR's.

harder to be outspent to be competitive other than maybe tire budget

Cons:

Cost to buy - Steep buy in for an SRF3 car, and no one is running SRF2 anymore in the SE outside of FL. If your goal is just to be regionally competitive, i think you can get into a very good Spec Miata for maybe half to 2/3 the cost.

Cost to run - I downloaded a price sheet from a CSR recently, and I was seeing much higher prices than what was listed above. Like $5800 for a full motor rebuild with core and about $8k for a motor outright. $1500 for an "over-rev" service - i.e. fixing the head. And the SRF3 are seeing reliability issues with the trans. A couple of changes have been tried with straight cut and hardened gears, but it's not fully resolved. A full trans rebuild was $3500 on the price sheet I saw. There is an effort underway to certify a sequential trans, and I heard that is going to be a $10k box. Also, because the engines and trans are sealed, you can't really economize with a "lesser" motor or trans like you can in Spec Miata. Same is true for ECU's, fuel cells, bodywork and all the other SRF specific parts - harder to economize.

Lack of weather protection - sucks if it rains, although I didn't get overheated at all in the car like I do in my RX7.

Not as versatile -I'd not be really comfortable racing with door slammers just because SRF's are hard to see and there is a big weight difference. So, for me, I'd stay away from the multi class enduro's. Plus they aren't allowed at some track days.

sedrat said:

SRF is switching to sequential transmissions next year, along with some throttle body changes iirc. Gen3 as it stands with the 5 speed will probably be around for a while still (especially at the regional level), but it might be something to think about.

This prompted me to do some searching.  It looks like the new sequential unit is from SaDev, and the change to ECU and throttle body are to enable no-lift shifting and automatic rev matching.  It seems that they're still having some issues with reliability and short life of the current five speed trannys, which this will solve for the bargain price of $12.5k not including installation (!).  This is something I'm going to have to think through.

sevenracer said:

Cost to buy - Steep buy in for an SRF3 car, and no one is running SRF2 anymore in the SE outside of FL. If your goal is just to be regionally competitive, i think you can get into a very good Spec Miata for maybe half to 2/3 the cost.

Cost to run - I downloaded a price sheet from a CSR recently, and I was seeing much higher prices than what was listed above. Like $5800 for a full motor rebuild with core and about $8k for a motor outright. $1500 for an "over-rev" service - i.e. fixing the head. And the SRF3 are seeing reliability issues with the trans. A couple of changes have been tried with straight cut and hardened gears, but it's not fully resolved. A full trans rebuild was $3500 on the price sheet I saw. There is an effort underway to certify a sequential trans, and I heard that is going to be a $10k box. Also, because the engines and trans are sealed, you can't really economize with a "lesser" motor or trans like you can in Spec Miata. Same is true for ECU's, fuel cells, bodywork and all the other SRF specific parts - harder to economize.

Lack of weather protection - sucks if it rains, although I didn't get overheated at all in the car like I do in my RX7.

Not as versatile -I'd not be really comfortable racing with door slammers just because SRF's are hard to see and there is a big weight difference. So, for me, I'd stay away from the multi class enduro's. Plus they aren't allowed at some track days.

All great feedback, thanks.  I found the CSR price list online, and for the most part your prices are correct.  A rebuild with core is $5800 and a whole motor is $7000, so expensive but still less money and hopefully longer lasting than SM motors.  I need to do more research on the transmissions and the expected lifespan of the five speed for a mid-pack driver, because having to choose between annual $3500 rebuilds or a $12-15k sequential could be a deal breaker for me.

I would happily trade some discomfort in the rain vs. the sweltering 130 degree cabin of my SM in the summer.  You could fry an egg on the transmission tunnel.  Even with a coolsuit it's effing brutal, to the point where it's actually one of my bigger safety concerns.

Yeah, sounds like we're kind of in the same boat - I just heard about the sequential box a couple of weeks ago and that had me really dig deeper into the overall costs. Honestly, if anyone was still running SRF2, I probably would have one by now (even though the engine's a turd compared to the SRF3 spec).

I will say that I would expect longevity of the SRF and SM motors to be similar unless you are really trying to be at the pointy end of the pack. They are both production based with no major voodoo like big compression bumps, cams, lightened rotating assemblies, super high redlines, etc.

The other thing that I don't have a good handle on is non drivetrain related wear items. It seems like most of the ones for sale mention recent replacement of things like heim joints, control arms, steering racks, etc. Also seems pretty common to re-powdercoat the frame which does not sound cheap or at least a lot of work for a full dis-assemble and re-assemble. All that sounds more spendy than what a Spec Miata would need, but that's just my speculation.

Soooooo from the cheapskate perspective I've been seeing Gen2 cars for under 20K. I'd be tempted to buy one and race it on a regional basis.............finishing position be damned. If SCCA eventually bans the Gen2 cars (like they did with the Renault powered cars) I'd take it vintage racing.

So anyone here have any experience with these cars or the racing scene around them?

Since you asked about being around them . . . the SCCA race group I was in back in the 90s included the SRFs - I was in H-Production. They were straight line faster but in corners we were fairly even. Their reputation then was a bit iffy but I never really had a problem with them and never was even touched by one. I can't say the same for some almost pro GT drivers from back then. 

I went to look at the car in question yesterday and long story short, the seller and I have reached a deal and I'll pick it up this week. It's a championship winning car with a brand new motor and transmission, and has all the latest fixes and upgrades. I even fit the cockpit perfectly, won't even have to adjust the pedal box.  Regarding the transmission issues, they are a real issue but I would expect that I'll get 2 years out of this tranny and at that time I'll either upgrade to the sequential, or five speeds will be around pretty cheap from all the other people upgrading. Will pick up the car this week, pretty excited. 

Congratulations, and have fun with the new car.

In reply to ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) :

Congrats, you will have so much fun with this car.

Necro-post, but I saw my old thread from a year ago and figured I'd give an update. The Spec Racer Ford has been a great purchase, I'm having a blast racing it.  It's obviously a very competitive class and the guys at the front are super quick, but there's lots of racing from the front of the pack to the back.  My driving is still a work in progress but I'm solidly mid-pack and improving every race. Having a real data acquisition package has been a game changer, working with coaches is way more productive and I can self-diagnose and pick up time on every track. My transmission did in fact break on Memorial Day weekend, but I was able to ge the new SaDev sequential installed. Expensive?  Yep. Worth it?  Absolutely.  Like a whole different car now, it's basically a Formula Ford with body work.  I have had zero issues with people driving too aggressively or trying to make hero passes and taking me out.  The other midpackers I've met are great guys and are as committed to clean/safe racing as I am. Overall I'm really enjoying the car and the class and wanted to say that anyone who's considering the class should think about taking the plunge. 

Thanks for updating us; there really is nothing like a purpose built single seat race car.

I also love th fact that SRFs move around on the tires alot.......to me that makes for so much fun.

Coaching is also worth every penny.

In reply to ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) :

What is wonderful about cars like that is if and when events change. The car can just sit and not be suddenly outdated. 
  Then when things are better all you have to do is knock the rust off your driving.      AND YOU'RE BACK! 

Tom1200 said:

Thanks for updating us; there really is nothing like a purpose built single seat race car.

I also love th fact that SRFs move around on the tires alot.......to me that makes for so much fun.

Coaching is also worth every penny.

They do like a lot of slip angle and trail braking. When you go fast in these cars you really feel like you're doing something. 

ShinnyGroove (Forum Supporter) said:

They do like a lot of slip angle and trail braking. When you go fast in these cars you really feel like you're doing something. 

That tends to be my natural driving style so it's why I think the cars are cool.

Once you get used to having a car skate through a corner it's so much fun. Also learning to think in terms of trajectory versus a line takes some getting used to for most folks.

In reply to Tom1200 :

Except to dirt track racers, sprint car racers, and Ice racers. 
   And me.  

I did my SCCA school in a Spec Racer–back when they had Renault engines. It was fun–felt like a first-gen MR2 with the top cut off.

And, yes, very much built like tanks.