I mean, these cars are only a few thousand dollars more than equivalent Civics. Here's one of the same age, color and mileage.
There are cheaper Civics, yes, but you can find an equal BMW for low to mid-teens if you're okay with less desirable options or issues.
That's a really funny looking Kia.
EDIT: Look, we get it. We aren't the clientele that brings in the revenue for ads and content. I understand, it's business. Just because we understand doesn't mean we don't still feel a little left out. A good low budget grassroots track build on a cheap chassis with cheap consumables would be great. But I know that doesn't sell magazines or advertising. It's ok, just remember us!
In reply to bobzilla :
You have to give me some credit. I built a Volkswagen Fox, probably the cheapest and weirdest car we ever did. Sadly, the readership didn't like that car as much as we did. At the end of the day we try to build what people want to read about.
Tom Suddard said:
Wow, there is a sucker for everyone I guess! I'm looking at those cars in the $4-8k range.
Don't forget to start your oil filter housing and oil cooler seal subscription.
Priority One should be a belt guard for the front main seal. Ask me how I know...
When I first saw the post/email I thought, "wow... that's pretty new..." then I looked at it again and realized... "no... no, it's not... it's an 8-9 year old out-of-warranty BMW - which is what GRM has always done projects on." Plus, as clean E36 and E46 examples start to become "collectible cars", I can imagine finding a cleaner late-model to build into a track car may be getting easier.
JG Pasterjak said:Jerry said:If you're staying more than the day, meet up with some of us locals. I can think of at least 4-5 people within 30min of that place.
I'm tempted, but I kind of need to be at my desk Monday morning. And the weatherman says a winter system is basically meeting me and my shorts and my hoodie there, so the sooner I put some miles between me and Ohio the better.
Is there someplace south of the dealership easily accessible from 75/71 that would be doable post-pickup on my way out of town?
Well with the typical Ohio forecast of between 0" and 72" of snow possible, you should probably just beat feet outta here when you can. There's a White Castle about 1 mile south on Vine street if you're interested. (The funeral home I did the Star Wars service yesterday is right across the street.)
I'll take a different spin and Tom's side on this..
I know I'm curious to see if I can pick up a used BMW that can be made into a daily driver/track car. This car would make a good driver and fun car to teach the kids about car control for me.. I'm in... $20k isn't cheap, but it isn't expensive anymore.
Anxious to watch this project as just last week we picked up a '16 m235. I shopped for a long time before settling on one to buy. From what I've seen in the market the 4 series cars are generally less expensive than the 2 series, even though it was the opposite when new.
JG Pasterjak said:Tom Suddard said:
@TomSuddard on Instagram
Deciphering BMW options is like reading the Necronomicon, but to the best of my deciphering ability it looks like you couldn't get a non-M4 six cylinder 4 Series without a sunroof, and non-M3 slick top six cylinder 3 Series might not have existed, either. America loves us some sunrooves.
Ahhh, you're pointing out what combo's may have been available.
Because immediately I was thinking there are a ton of VIN decoders out there.
Interesting, will follow but not into BMW land where most paper type gaskets are made from parchment from the Dead Sea scrolls. Soaked in "glue glycerin Let alone and other needs u might have for parts.
Really interesting the apparent world class "dealership" pictured in the back ground. I can believe the visit to the (dealership} should provide a story within the story.
Close friend had such a "dealership". His source was the city impound lot /action, he would drag a car back do what was needed, what he paid for the car then became the down payment.
1960s
one of his better fix I remember a ford all the lug nuts were broken off one wheel, Ed welded that wheel on slapped a hub cap on it put it on the front row. With only one hub cap.
More to the story but u get the idea as the guy was paying for the car at the lot, weekly.
still makes me laugh to think of some of his fix's.. Bought Bondo in 5 gal buckets. Etc. Etc.
I was with you until you mentioned the automatic transmission...
(I'm an outlier, still daily driving an e28 and an e30, both with three pedals.)
jgrewe said:
Priority One should be a belt guard for the front main seal. Ask me how I know...
Had to look this up and found a description:
"It is a well-known issue on the BMW N54/N55/S55 platforms that your serpentine belt can fail for various reasons, when this happens you have a high chance of the belt getting sucked behind the front damper, and then being pushed past the crank seal into your oil pan. From there it can get sucked into the oil pick up causing total engine failure,"
Okay that is seriously one of the most insane failures I've ever heard of. BMW never disappoints with the ways they are able to make the most mundane things into Eldritch nightmares.
In reply to Tom Suddard :
I had to go back and look at the lead photo...DOH... it does have a sunroof. That's Ok, I assume this will not be a dedicated TC.
JG Pasterjak said:jgrewe said:
Priority One should be a belt guard for the front main seal. Ask me how I know...
Had to look this up and found a description:
"It is a well-known issue on the BMW N54/N55/S55 platforms that your serpentine belt can fail for various reasons, when this happens you have a high chance of the belt getting sucked behind the front damper, and then being pushed past the crank seal into your oil pan. From there it can get sucked into the oil pick up causing total engine failure,"
Okay that is seriously one of the most insane failures I've ever heard of. BMW never disappoints with the ways they are able to make the most mundane things into Eldritch nightmares.
By far the biggest reason is an oil leak either from the valve cover or OFHG, that leaks down the front of the block and causes the tensioner to fail.
And since the harmonic balancer sits IN FRONT OF the crank pulley it provides a nice way to just guide the belt right toward the front crank seal.
Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:When I first saw the post/email I thought, "wow... that's pretty new..." then I looked at it again and realized... "no... no, it's not... it's an 8-9 year old out-of-warranty BMW - which is what GRM has always done projects on." Plus, as clean E36 and E46 examples start to become "collectible cars", I can imagine finding a cleaner late-model to build into a track car may be getting easier.
Yeah, pretty much this. Our wheelhouse, traditionally, has been 5-to-15-year old cars, especially including BMWs. We’ve also done several new BMWs over the years, but back in the early ’90s, we were working on 2002s. Then we moved onto E28s, E30s, E36s and E46s.
Today, a 10-year-old BMW seems newer than you’d think. Then add in the fact that a new Miata goes for about $40k, and our local dealer is asking $60k for a Golf R.
We’re not forgetting our low-buck projects, but this car should fit nicely into our mix. I’m excited about it. Also eager to see how it runs against the E46 M3, no longer a spring chicken....
I'm in for the live stream test drive doing burnouts.
I swear there's some point in our life where we internalize car values and we never accept increases. That's how you get people complaining about "OMG you can't buy a new Miata for less than $28k!", not realizing that the MSRP for a base model Miata in 1990 was the equivalent of over $33k today - and it had no radio.
This BMW project is priced lower than the ND project Miata that gets a lot of GRM time, as that was purchased new off the lot in 2019.
This $20k 2015 BMW today is equivalent to GRM buying a $15k 2004 BMW back in 2015. And what did GRM introduce as a project car in 2015? A brand new M235i, which had an MSRP at least three times that much.
So yeah, it's GRM enough. It's not dragged out of a chicken coop or has a body built out of parts of washing machines, but it counts.
David S. Wallens said:Then add in the fact that a new Miata goes for about $40k..
Ahem. They start at $28k MSRP. People keep forgetting about the Sport. To get to $40k, you need to go for the top trim RF, choose the most expensive paint and leather, and then tack on the "aero" parts. That gets the MSRP up to $39,370.
In reply to Keith Tanner :
Even $30k sounds like a lot of bread and, yes, I was just looking at a new RF. Just looking, just looking.
The take-home message here: New cars–and used cars–have gone up in price. Sadly, it’s no longer 1995. Or even 2015.
Oddly enough this is almost exactly what we paid (inflation adjusted) for our ratty, high-mileage E36 M3 back when it was 7 years old: https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/project-cars/1996-bmw-m3/
Tom Suddard said:Oddly enough this is almost exactly what we paid (inflation adjusted) for our ratty, high-mileage E36 M3 back when it was 7 years old: https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/project-cars/1996-bmw-m3/
You texted me this today and I had to do the math myself to believe it, but, yeah, basically the same price for a car that appears to be in better shape.
Also, we really loved pointing at things in the early oughts, didn't we?
Tom Suddard said:Oddly enough this is almost exactly what we paid (inflation adjusted) for our ratty, high-mileage E36 M3 back when it was 7 years old: https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/project-cars/1996-bmw-m3/
You mean the car we also had to repaint? And dang, that math does sting a bit.
GRM history, though: Guess which car in particular influenced the E36 M3 board filter? Seriously, for reals.
JG Pasterjak said:Tom Suddard said:Oddly enough this is almost exactly what we paid (inflation adjusted) for our ratty, high-mileage E36 M3 back when it was 7 years old: https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/project-cars/1996-bmw-m3/
You texted me this today and I had to do the math myself to believe it, but, yeah, basically the same price for a car that appears to be in better shape.
Also, we really loved pointing at things in the early oughts, didn't we?
We should do a web gallery: GRMers using spring compressors and/or pointing at things. I’d be down for that.
You'll need to log in to post.
