to be honest, I want a new honda civic si
however, with our 19 month old, my wife wants something big with lots of metal around the baby because of all the stupid drivers on the road.
i tried to tell her about the side curtain air bags on the civic, but she is convinced we need to drive the deathstar in order for the baby to be safe on the road.
mattbatson wrote: to be honest, I want a new honda civic si
Somebody needs to explain how lots of metal does not equal safety. Safety is safety! Do you like any Volvos?
Yeah I don't think the solution is a truck if that is your reason.
Volvo is a great suggestion, those things are a tank.
RoosterSauce wrote:mattbatson wrote: to be honest, I want a new honda civic siSomebody needs to explain how lots of metal does not equal safety. Safety is safety! Do you like any Volvos?
ha ha, no I'm not a volvo guy. I'm a firm believer in light is right and any sports car over 3k lbs is too heavy for my tastes. Unfortunately, she is an engineer and realizes the simple physics of a small car like a civic getting hit by an excursion means bad things for the civic occupants. Even though I disagree with it, he who has the biggest vehicle on the road wins...and with a tundra there arent many things on the road bigger. With a civic, most everything is bigger.
mattbatson wrote: With a civic, most everything is bigger.
Not my old accord
mattbatson wrote: Unfortunately, she is an engineer
Engineer: taught to be practical, bred to complicate things. Add a touch of feminine persuasion and VOILA! Irrational decision making at its finest.
Sorry, couldn't help myself 
I bought My Tundra in 2008 after looking at all the options out there pretty close. I was coming out of a Ram 1500 and needed a 10k towing payload. while the ram 2500 would do, they suggested I go to the 3500. ford -same thing. both these trucks rode like a lumber wagon, and the ride of the Tundra while empty sold me. I regularly tow 10k with my race trailer (enclosed 24'). btw I had a buddy that gave me lots of crap for buying "foreign" Once I pointed out that the dodge was built in Mexico, and the Tundra in Texas,, he stopped bugging me. I told him it had to be one of the fastest vehicles I had ever driven, including a 63 Vette, he scoffed at me.. then I found supporting statistics on the net. My Trd 4x4 handles awesome, is a pleasure to drive, gets good mileage (high 19's solo (have been as high as 21 on some tanks in the summer) and high 14's towing 10k) Last year I towed the race car to Grattan race track in Mi, at lunch My Son and 2 friends went for a ride in the truck with me to help me with some troubles I was having with the "line" I was keeping up through some turns with an autocross vette. after the "tour" I had many people come over and comment how fun it was seeing that big ole truck look like it was gonna run down and over the vette. Even the vette driver came over with a grin from ear to ear, Thought he was coming over to bitch at me, but in fact loved it. My son drove the truck on track, and he too commented on how well it felt and handled, and hes not one for compliments. After almost 40k miles I have only had to do oil changes and maint, and have had no troubles, but in 80k my Ram had the same history. The Tundra is just starting to "feel" like we are connected, The Ram was an instant love affair.
Arrival. Trd sticker, and dirty,,
trd sticker removed, simple pinstripes added
http://btdtracing.com/gallery/v/members/Willys+rides/tundra/
If that is your reason than why not a Sequoia/Expedition/Tahoe/Suburban? According to a Japanese engineer co-worker you don't want to buy Japanese for crash protection anyway. He actually lists them as third in what he would buy.
European
American
Japanese.
Korean
His experience show a direct correlation between vehicles passengers real world crash survivability and the average highway speed of the designing countries.
I understand her physics but she is making on common false assumption. Direct head on impact. The ability of the lighter vehicle to slide aids in energy dissipation as well. If you have two evenly matched vehicles, where does that energy go? Directly into the destruction of both vehicles. Guess who is in those vehicles? So yes a Civic vs a Tundra head-on, we all know the loser, but a Civic vs a tree or a garbage truck crossing an intersection (you hitting the garbage truck in the side) vs the same scenario in a Tundra well not so clear. Add in the lack of maneuverability in Tundra compared to the Civic and the chance of avoiding an accident also goes up. She has also increased the chance of roll over in a Tundra vs a Civic
She is thinking worse case scenario ever, but the odds of that being the case is statistically small, but preparing for that situation lends itself for a higher risk of other accidents which she has a greater chance of getting into.
30% of all accidents are single vehicle 57% are two vehicles (all forms) 13% are more than two.
So of the 30,797 fatal accidents reported 20,373 were head on collisions.
So the moral of the story is, no matter what you are in a head on collision is 2/3 fatal.
Man I want to go driving with my kids right now!
If you want to plow through the data yourself. Here is the link to the NHSTA crash data reports. There is a ALOT of stuff to go through and it takes time.
Good luck with whatever you get!
P.S. A Volvo S60R isn't a bad compromise!
willy19592 wrote: I bought My Tundra in 2008 after looking at all the options out there pretty close. I was coming out of a Ram 1500 and needed a 10k towing payload. while the ram 2500 would do, they suggested I go to the 3500. ford -same thing. both these trucks rode like a lumber wagon, and the ride of the Tundra while empty sold me. I regularly tow 10k with my race trailer (enclosed 24'). btw I had a buddy that gave me lots of crap for buying "foreign" Once I pointed out that the dodge was built in Mexico, and the Tundra in Texas,, he stopped bugging me. I told him it had to be one of the fastest vehicles I had ever driven, including a 63 Vette, he scoffed at me.. then I found supporting statistics on the net. My Trd 4x4 handles awesome, is a pleasure to drive, gets good mileage (high 19's solo (have been as high as 21 on some tanks in the summer) and high 14's towing 10k) Last year I towed the race car to Grattan race track in Mi, at lunch My Son and 2 friends went for a ride in the truck with me to help me with some troubles I was having with the "line" I was keeping up through some turns with an autocross vette. after the "tour" I had many people come over and comment how fun it was seeing that big ole truck look like it was gonna run down and over the vette. Even the vette driver came over with a grin from ear to ear, Thought he was coming over to bitch at me, but in fact loved it. My son drove the truck on track, and he too commented on how well it felt and handled, and hes not one for compliments. After almost 40k miles I have only had to do oil changes and maint, and have had no troubles, but in 80k my Ram had the same history. The Tundra is just starting to "feel" like we are connected, The Ram was an instant love affair.
well that is a pretty glowing review of the tundra. And, it actually mirrors most of what I've read from tundra owners, so I believe every word of it. My arguement for the civic is that it gets better mpg (and I expect gas to go back up within the next few years), is cheaper with smaller monthly payment, and would be much better to drive from day to day.
However, just the other day we had some moron merge over on us on the I-4 as he was too busy talking on the phone. I reacted quickly enough and avoided any incident, but she immediately brought up the tundra and why it would settle her nerves better than driving a small car.
I completely agree that you shouldnt buy a tank just for the minute possibility of a traffic collision, but cannot seem to convince her of the same.
We also have an 89 crx and 93 civic hatch that she says are my fun street cars. Only thing is, she wont allow the baby to be driven in either (no airbags, and they are small compared even to a new civic).
ah well...marital bliss
I understand, I sold a perfectly great Subaru Forester for a Mazda5 for marital bliss.
Good Luck
I love my Tundra, but if the main requirements were "large family vehicle", and I didn't need a pickup, I think I would get something else.
The Flex comes to mind--roomy, low CG, AWD, and a twin turbo engine doesn't hurt. ;) Don't know about the crash test ratings though.
Love our '06 with the 4.9-5.1 whatever, next size down from the 5.7. The only problem we had is well documented here. (search Tundra limping) BUT....our next truck will likley be a Ford.
I have nothing to add except..
http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29091 <-- build thread.
Interesting to see that the front wheel bearings are the same size as ford superduty.
Yeah, if you look at the Tundra, Toyota just built a 250/350 truck and put it in the 150 class.
Neat trick, most people didn't catch it. Makes'em last too.
FlightService wrote: Yeah, if you look at the Tundra, Toyota just built a 250/350 truck and put it in the 150 class. Neat trick, most people didn't catch it. Makes'em last too.
Well if that is the case..
then.. (directed at japan)..
Where the berkeley is the diesel I've been begging for you toyota CEO bastards!
FlightService wrote: Yeah, if you look at the Tundra, Toyota just built a 250/350 truck and put it in the 150 class. Neat trick, most people didn't catch it. Makes'em last too.
All but the suspension. They are too soft for big loads.
DILYSI Dave wrote:FlightService wrote: Yeah, if you look at the Tundra, Toyota just built a 250/350 truck and put it in the 150 class. Neat trick, most people didn't catch it. Makes'em last too.All but the suspension. They are too soft for big loads.
thats easy to fix though.. some big airbags and a big swaybar should do it nicely
Shim wrote: Well if that is the case.. then.. (directed at japan).. Where the berkeley is the diesel I've been begging for you toyota CEO bastards!
They sell it in the states, from Yanmar. It is the new 8LY should be very nice, scheduled for release around the first to mid year.
I don't know why Toyota won't bring it in the Tundra. The things a rocket and has a BOV that will wake the dead. Yanmar is rating it at 375HP and that means in a street application 400HP should be no issue. 800 ft lbs of torque if I remember. Revs quick and weighs about the same as a big block gas.
FlightService wrote:Shim wrote: Well if that is the case.. then.. (directed at japan).. Where the berkeley is the diesel I've been begging for you toyota CEO bastards!They sell it in the states, from Yanmar. It is the new 8LY should be very nice, scheduled for release around the first to mid year. I don't know why Toyota won't bring it in the Tundra. The things a rocket and has a BOV that will wake the dead. Yanmar is rating it at 375HP and that means in a street application 400HP should be no issue. 800 ft lbs of torque if I remember. Revs quick and weighs about the same as a big block gas. Old Autoblog leak
without an EPA/DOT tag that engine is worthless to anyone who wants to use it on the street in the US.
Ignorant wrote: without an EPA/DOT tag that engine is worthless to anyone who wants to use it on the street in the US.
It passes EPA Tier 3 emissions (qualified to be installed in new boats, 2012.) Which means it isn't far off of highway standards, (Urea injection and catalyst missing.) Maybe with the U.S. diesel vs gas prices and the fact Toyota doesn't market a truck that has competitors with diesel, (e.g. half ton class,) maybe the reason. Also given the Tundra is priced at the upper end of the price spectrum in the class, then you add a premium for the diesel engine you have a $50K half ton.
Maybe Toy should come out with a re-rated Tundra in the 3/4 or 1 ton class.
JohnGalt wrote: How can a modern full size get such horrible mileage?I have a 96 Chevy with the 5.7 that gets better than that.
Aerodynamics - there's only so much you can do to make air go around a brick.
Is that an incredibly large (CENSORED) behind your truck or are you just happy to be on this forum?
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