I've been doing autocross in my car for about a year now and think it's time to start spending money on suspension. Starting to be decent and the suspension on this car is over 25 years old and desperately needs and upgrade.
Basically there is one thing I KNOW I am getting which is new subframe and diff bushings. Both of which I clearly need.
The next part is where i'm not so sure. All the rubber on this car is basically heavily deteriorated and it would take a massive effort to replace all the bushings. I could get something like this:
http://www.driftworks.com/driftworks-r32-suspension-kit.html
Along with other suspension bits which effectively replace the bushings, so i don't have to press new ones into OEM stuff, as well as installing stronger parts and eliminating HICAS.
The other thing I can do is get coilovers. Unfortunately the route of koni inserts + springs that I would go with a different car are not made for this car otherwise I would have the money to do both. Instead I have to get coilovers in this case BC Racing BR.
Which would be more important to get at this stage? I'm thinking getting the coilovers now is the best route but I was curious what you all think. I might be able to budget coilovers + something else like front camber arms or the hicas kit (low in my priority since hicas is functioning) but that's about it.
maj75
Reader
9/14/15 7:55 p.m.
First, it would be nice to say what kind of car you have...
maj75 wrote:
First, it would be nice to say what kind of car you have...
Yes it would. I am guessing it's at least a Nissan.
Sorry, forgot Nissan Skyline gts-t
Similar suspension to a 240SX in the rear completely different in front.
If you stick coilovers on it first, you'll end up with a lower car that's still got deteriorated suspension bushes. There might be some improvement but you'll still have some waywardness in the handling that new shocks or coilovers aren't going to cure.
I think the big question is, are the shocks or the bushings in worse condition and replace those parts first.
Are the struts/ shocks blown? If not I'd do bushings first and maybe throw some sway bars on.
DatsunS130 wrote:
Are the struts/ shocks blown? If not I'd do bushings first and maybe throw some sway bars on.
They are not blown.
I guess i'm going bushing route then. Thanks for allt he info everyone.
At 25 years old it's more likely that the shocks have been replaced than the suspension bushings. I'm guessing that since it's a non-USDM car that they're running you in some crazy class like A-mod or something, but if not, you should take a look at what the rules allow for the class you do run in.
That said, even if the suspension bushings are in bad shape, if the shock are blown, new shocks will make more of an improvement. Be careful when trying to lower the car, as it will likely make the handling worse without making other changes on the suspension.
I don't know what year you have, or how close the rear sub-frame is to the 240sx, but the S14 rear subframe has much better geometry than the S13 or the Z32 300ZX. The S14 240sx rear subframe mounting points are 10mm wider than the S13, but can be swapped in if you leave the rubber bushings in, but if you go with solid mounts they have to be offset.
Yep. Before modifying a car get it back to good working order. This gives you a baseline to work/modify from and you may find that you actually need less radical mods/upgrades to get you to where you want to go.
Yeah - bushings. Replace anything with movement with a stiffer material or a spherical. What you want is zero play and zero stiction in anything. DO NOT IGNORE that last part. It has to move in the way it was designed to move with as little drag as possible and not at all in ways it shouldn't. That is impossible to achieve - but try your best and you will transform the accuracy and consistency potential of the car down to mostly chassis/component flex. That is as good as it gets until you get a cage.
Then spring and dampen it properly.
How long have you been racing? It never hurts to invest in instruction. I have learned somthing from every instructor I ever had. I also never turned down any instruction offered. When I stated I was taking off seconds as the years and decade's went by it turned in to tenths and hundredths.
This I not ment to be condescending. It is advise an old timer gave me when I was starting out that proved well founded.
dean1484 wrote:
How long have you been racing? It never hurts to invest in instruction. I have learned somthing from every instructor I ever had. I also never turned down any instruction offered. When I stated I was taking off seconds as the years and decade's went by it turned in to tenths and hundredths.
This I not ment to be condescending. It is advise an old timer gave me when I was starting out that proved well founded.
Not long and I do have a friend who is very experienced who takes pax regularly that has been "instructing" me. My ex-room mate was also very good and he was as well.
If I wanted to be more competitive in autocross I would use a different car. I more or less am running autocross as in a "for fun" reasons and learning how to drive cars properly and refreshing/upgrading this car along the way.
I'm guessing that since it's a non-USDM car that they're running you in some crazy class like A-mod or something, but if not, you should take a look at what the rules allow for the class you do run in.
They are having me run in SSM there are some ridiculous cars and extremely good drivers in that class. Some crazy good S2000 drivers.
I don't know what year you have, or how close the rear sub-frame is to the 240sx
Exactly identical to S13
I'll second the instruction thing although it was not part of the original question.
If your instructor is faster than you in your own car that is money you don't need to spend until you can go that fast. Bonus you.
Re the instruction thing. No instructor is 100% perfect. Your "job" is to take the best info from each and piece together what works for you.
Welcome to the fun.
I see the driver as just another piece of a car. As crew chief I often had to figure out if the car needed fixing or if the driver needed "fixing".
I guess I have one final question.
If I have no clunking and no uneven tire wear should I even replace the bushings at this point? The only thing that got me wanting replacing the bushings was the subframe bushings causing issues and me just thinking "if that's bad the rest must be".
That's up to you. I'd be replacing 25 year old bushings because well... they're 25 year old bushings. But if you feel there's no harm coming from them, that's your call.
The Integra Type-R I owned in the UK has really badly worn rear suspension arm bushes. Still drove fine, no clunks or wayward handling.
However after putting a set of Mugen bushes in, the difference was massive.
