MattW wrote:ebonyandivory wrote: What's a better use of money, a $30,000 car that gets 32mpg or a $3,000 truck that gets 13mpg?But you're saving the planet!
It's better to reuse than to buy new. 
MattW wrote:ebonyandivory wrote: What's a better use of money, a $30,000 car that gets 32mpg or a $3,000 truck that gets 13mpg?But you're saving the planet!
It's better to reuse than to buy new.
My Mazda 3 has been getting between 26-28mpg since it was new. That's not great for a car in that class, but it has made up for it's fuel thirst by not needing much maintenance. The only part that failed prematurely, and one could consider it a wear item, was the transmission mount at 100k. That was $60. I also did rear end links, which I consider a wear item, around the same time for around $50.
Other than that, it's been the usual maintenance items, like tune ups, oil changes, tires, and brakes, that come with the territory of owning a car. Since it's paid off, I'm going to see how far it takes me. It has 124k on it and still drives like new!
Klayfish wrote:Carro Atrezzi wrote: Counterintuitive. And 100% accurate.Yep. I have never seen this graph, but a while back I did these numbers on an Excel spreadsheet and it laid it out clearly for me that it's diminishing returns as mpg increases. I drive about 35k miles per year, commute is 55-60 miles each way depending on what route I take. The Prius I had got about 42mpg, but I really didn't like the car. My current DD, a '13 Elantra 6spd manual, gets 35-37mpg. While it's no Miata, it's not as horrid to drive as the Prius. The fuel cost difference is very minimal, and I'm happy to pay that very small difference not to be driving a toaster oven.The0retical wrote:If I get anywhere around 30mpg (and the MS3 will) I could literally care less. Especially if I paid a song for the vehicle.
I know a guy with a killer coilover suspension to get that CoG down on that car and actually ride better.... make you a good deal!
I had a junky Buick Regal while gas was $4 = 21 MPG if I was lucky (it was not mechanically sound)
My current Mazda 3 is averaging 33 MPG doing the same (mostly) driving.
Klayfish wrote:Carro Atrezzi wrote: Counterintuitive. And 100% accurate.Yep. I have never seen this graph, but a while back I did these numbers on an Excel spreadsheet and it laid it out clearly for me that it's diminishing returns as mpg increases.The0retical wrote:
This graph and discussion comes up all the time. I don't get why its such a big deal to people.
If you are comparing ownership and operating costs, do the math.
The graph also changes a bit when the yearly miles goes from 12,000 per year to over 30K per year.
In the three years I've owned my Grand Caravan, I've spent almost as much on gas (~$7K) as I did to buy it ($10K). 
On top of my great mpg I get a 10/20 cents off per gallon.
My grocery chain has a deal with the gas station chain.
As long as I fill up only once a week. Usually doable.
vwcorvette wrote:KyAllroad wrote: None of my cars get great mileage but my commute is just under 5 miles each way. So due to warm-up time it isn't much different if I drive the suburban or the Miata.Just how long are you warming up these things? More than 30 seconds to a minute unless uber cold and defrosting needs doing is just a waste of fuel. Extending idling can be damaging. Besides you gotta get the thing moving to warm the trans, diff, etc.
Sorry, I should have been more precise. By "warm-up" time I was referring to the time during which the car is stone cold and the computer is dumping extra fuel into the system. I'm not sitting and idling but cold engines get really E36 M3ty MPGs.
Bobzilla wrote:Klayfish wrote:I know a guy with a killer coilover suspension to get that CoG down on that car and actually ride better.... make you a good deal!Carro Atrezzi wrote: Counterintuitive. And 100% accurate.Yep. I have never seen this graph, but a while back I did these numbers on an Excel spreadsheet and it laid it out clearly for me that it's diminishing returns as mpg increases. I drive about 35k miles per year, commute is 55-60 miles each way depending on what route I take. The Prius I had got about 42mpg, but I really didn't like the car. My current DD, a '13 Elantra 6spd manual, gets 35-37mpg. While it's no Miata, it's not as horrid to drive as the Prius. The fuel cost difference is very minimal, and I'm happy to pay that very small difference not to be driving a toaster oven.The0retical wrote:
The Elantra is sort of soft, makes a nice comfy highway ride if nothing else. The only one thing I've noticed that bugs me is that the rear will hop sideways if you hit bumps mid-corner. Apparently, it's a common complaint for this generation Elantra. It doesn't inspire confidence if you want to take an onramp at speed.
Yes, you have to do the math when looking at ownership. Not all that hard to do. However, the graph is nice in that it puts it in a nicely presentable format.
RossD wrote:MattW wrote:It's better to reuse than to buy new.ebonyandivory wrote: What's a better use of money, a $30,000 car that gets 32mpg or a $3,000 truck that gets 13mpg?But you're saving the planet!
Especially if you've tried new-planet shopping. Not one decent model in any of the dealerships we can find! And even the closest ones seem to be lightyears away! And talk about delivery charges...
Carro Atrezzi wrote: In reply to 81cpcamaro: Motorcycles burn more gas than big block duallies. Why? I live 2 miles from work but my route home on the BMW GS takes me 45 miles
I wish my commute was that short (2 miles). Currently I drive 37 miles one way. Not driving the motorcycle to work yet, but it is an option. Since my commute is mostly backroads, no need to go out of my way on the bike, enough curves to keep me entertained.
My current DD is a '12 Camaro SS, mpg is decent, car is fun to drive (manual trans of course). I did drive the Suburban as a daily for a couple months, didn't cost as much in gas as I feared, but 12-14 mpg will add up. Once I get the MGB fixed up, I could drive it as well.
Cheap gas? lol. I live in SoCal, so no such thing as cheap gas.
I can live with my 21-22 MPG I get in the e46 wagon.
Chris_V wrote: Cheap gas now makes it a great time to buy this: cheap Focus EV and not use gas ever for commuting.
I didn't realize those had that much range... I gotta get my shop built so that I can park my daily indoors and charge if need be.
STM317 wrote:Chris_V wrote: Cheap gas now makes it a great time to buy this: cheap Focus EV and not use gas ever for commuting.I didn't realize those had that much range... I gotta get my shop built so that I can park my daily indoors and charge if need be.
Damn... that particular car is cheap, too. Hard to believe it dropped that much in value in 3 years. Seems fishy.
Unfortunately, the 76-ish mile range just isn't enough for my commute. I need at least double that to cover the commute and potential work-related local trips. Preferably around 200.
Ian F wrote: Damn... that particular car is cheap, too. Hard to believe it dropped that much in value in 3 years. Seems fishy.
That dealership has two at that price and there are about 10 around me less than $10k. Depreciation hit them hard, mostly due to the 80 mile real world range. But they are still damn near new Foci and as such, decent cars to drive.
Since I commute less than 10 miles each way, it'd be the perfect commuter/errand runner...
Klayfish wrote:Bobzilla wrote:The Elantra is sort of soft, makes a nice comfy highway ride if nothing else. The only one thing I've noticed that bugs me is that the rear will hop sideways if you hit bumps mid-corner. Apparently, it's a common complaint for this generation Elantra. It doesn't inspire confidence if you want to take an onramp at speed. Yes, you have to do the math when looking at ownership. Not all that hard to do. However, the graph is nice in that it puts it in a nicely presentable format.Klayfish wrote:I know a guy with a killer coilover suspension to get that CoG down on that car and actually ride better.... make you a good deal!Carro Atrezzi wrote: Counterintuitive. And 100% accurate.Yep. I have never seen this graph, but a while back I did these numbers on an Excel spreadsheet and it laid it out clearly for me that it's diminishing returns as mpg increases. I drive about 35k miles per year, commute is 55-60 miles each way depending on what route I take. The Prius I had got about 42mpg, but I really didn't like the car. My current DD, a '13 Elantra 6spd manual, gets 35-37mpg. While it's no Miata, it's not as horrid to drive as the Prius. The fuel cost difference is very minimal, and I'm happy to pay that very small difference not to be driving a toaster oven.The0retical wrote:
I despise the way the wife's 12' Elantra rides on the highway. It bottoms out way too much and is terribly rough.
In reply to Nick (Bo) Comstock:
Rear shocks help tremendously. I've said it a million times, but they just can't get their E36 M3 together on shock/spring rates. The Forte (same generation chassis) had the same problem. Rear sway bar only enhanced the problem. Then Lee hooked me up with a pair of Koni's and I've never looked back. Set them to 1/2 turn up from full soft and it's perfect with the stock springs. Coilovers helped as well, and honestly compared to the stock spring/strut/shocks it rode better.
In reply to 81cpcamaro:
The wife used to have that 2 mile commute. She got 12mpg out of the old Suzuki GrandVitara because it never warmed up enough to get out of closed loop. We could take it on a weekend drive and get 24.
/me waits for the truck market to crash. Again.
Bobzilla wrote: In reply to 81cpcamaro: The wife used to have that 2 mile commute. She got 12mpg out of the old Suzuki GrandVitara because it never warmed up enough to get out of closed loop. We could take it on a weekend drive and get 24.
I had a short commute from my old house and my Accord wagon would get about 15 mpg. On long trips it cleared over 30 mpg. The warmup cycle is murder on fuel economy!
Damn, I was hoping OPEC would keep flooding the market until demand dies. I hope the stupid tar sands never come back.
Even though i have some friends on the dole, i'm also in the camp that is fine with OPEC trying to kill american oil. The current low prices only really lead to more stupidity and less reflection along our current trajectory to ruining the planet.
I'm driving the Leaf and I'd encourage people to look at them used. It's pretty simple to find them for less than $8000. Stick with the SV or SL model, 2013 or newer. It's been a fantastic commuter for me.
Pah. Having been here for over 22 years now I still think gas is criminally cheap in this country.
When I left the UK in 1994 petrol was about £2.40 an imperial gallon. With the 1.6 exchange rate at the time that was around $3.68/imp gal or about $3/us gal. So gas is still cheaper now than it was in the UK when I left!!
Wake me up if gas ever gets even remotely expensive over here.
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