alfadriver wrote: Very simple, and quite incomplete, answer, Zomby.
Well, maybe... but everyone who is in the left lane seems to think they belong there. They are not yielding to faster traffic because there is someone not yielding to them and so on. Just because someone in front of you is holding you up does make holding someone else up correct.
Flynlow wrote: Any opinions on the alternative (supposedly more courteous) method? I've heard if you're approaching someone oblivious/underspeed in the left lane, keep a few carlengths back and turn on your left blinker (not right, they may think you're signaling you're moving back right). The repetitive light forces them to check their mirrors, but the lack of super bright high beam supposedly makes it less aggressive, plus you don't have to continually hit the stalk, just turn the indicator on and leave it.
I have been driving in Europe a lot lately ad this is the norm. Getting the heck out of other peoples way and NEVER passing on the right is also a norm.
Sadly, in NA, you have the three clown combinations occuring at the same time: Some farmer driving 50 in the left lane with the cruise on cause he is "Passing" a guy doing 49, the speed-demon who flies up behing him with the lights flashing and another shooting aross three lanes to try and get past all of them.
It is kind of sad that the powers that be have picked velocity as the safety standard for drivers and allowed stupid to be aceptable. I guess since stupid can't be quantified, if was too hard to make money from.
Zomby woof wrote: Great rant - NOT. I don't care how fast you're going, you don't own the left lane - the passing lane. Move the berkeley over, and stop talking about courteous
You did read the original post, yes? If so, you would see that there was a line of cars directly to the right of him as well. Where is he supposed to move over to?
In reply to Giant Purple Snorklewacker:
Hmmm - I don't see it quite that way.
Say you're waiting in line at the bank and there's 3 folks in front of you waiting and someone is impatiently waiting behind you. Do you give your spot to the person behind you? I'm with Alfadriver on this one....
eastpark wrote: In reply to Giant Purple Snorklewacker: Hmmm - I don't see it quite that way. Say you're waiting in line at the bank and there's 3 folks in front of you waiting and someone is impatiently waiting behind you. Do you give your spot to the person behind you? I'm with Alfadriver on this one....
Well.. at the bank you don't really have speed as a factor and everyone is going to the exact same place.
In traffic, if you cannot overtake the car in front, why not move over until you can? (obviously there is traffic heavy enough to make this impossible)
If everyone would yield control of the left lane until they could make use of it for overtaking then it would be clearer more often for its intended purpose.
The safest thing to do in this instance is get him boxed in behind you and then SLAM on the brakes, makes for a good show 
just make sure you have your pistol ready to take out his tires as he tries to blast past, or just drive him into the ditch, come on you know you want to 
(this entire post is in jest, please take it accordingly)
Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote:eastpark wrote: In reply to Giant Purple Snorklewacker: Hmmm - I don't see it quite that way. Say you're waiting in line at the bank and there's 3 folks in front of you waiting and someone is impatiently waiting behind you. Do you give your spot to the person behind you? I'm with Alfadriver on this one....Well.. at the bank you don't really have speed as a factor and everyone is going to the exact same place. In traffic, if you cannot overtake the car in front, why not move over until you can? (obviously there is traffic heavy enough to make this impossible) If everyone would yield control of the left lane until they could make use of it for overtaking then it would be clearer more often for its intended purpose.
Right lane- 65mph, for the trucks. Middle- 68 mph, 2mph less than the limit, as trucks pass each other. Left- 72 mph, 2mph over the limit.
I want to do 75.
First- how is moving over an improvement for me? Second- how do I really know that the guy behind me is going faster than me? Third- most of the time, the simple answers of "move over" almost never has really lived with traffic like that.
Honestly, there are plenty of people who ride the left lane, and I pass plenty of people who do that, but most of the time I do, I also don't NEED to move back to the left, and continue in the middle.
the OP's basic example is very common in the world of large cities and wide highways.
So if you want to flash to pass in heavy traffic- how do you know YOU are more important than the driver in front of you. Maybe they have an emergency. Maybe thier spouse or mother is having issues. Maybe.
Everything you say about the guy flashing the lights can be said of every single driver in front of them.
But I will admit taking a lot of pleasure making people mad when they swerve in and out pretending they are the most important. Makes me smile. More so when they get a ticket.
alfadriver wrote:Zomby woof wrote: Great rant - NOT. I don't care how fast you're going, you don't own the left lane - the passing lane. Move the berkeley over, and stop talking about courteousSays the person who does not commute in traffic. Very simple, and quite incomplete, answer, Zomby. Say, when I want to do 75, but the fast lane is doing 70, how do I know when the guy behind me only wants to do 72- I should get out of his way no matter what? Especially if there are cars in both of the lanes to the right? My personal favorite is the moron who does that, and then weaves in and out of traffic for 10 miles to just move back a few more places. When they are being a moron, I try to help them. 99.9% of the time, the flash means "my life is more important than yours", and I always answer- no, it's not. Eric
Says the guy who has been commuting 200 km/day on some of north America's busiest highways for the last 21 years.
I do it with very little drama. It is simple.
The left lane is for passing. You do not own it, nor do you belong there if someone wants by. You MUST get out of their way.
The fact that you profess to seek pleasure in 'assisting' people be what you perceive to be moronic, tells the whole story.
Leave the drama at home. Follow the rules of the road, and worry about what YOU are doing. Not what everybody around you wants to do.
Bottom line, driving in the left lane is the wrong thing to do.
Flashing lights is the right thing to do.
Doing things on the road to make other people mad, angry, or frustrated, is the irresponsible, and dangerous thing to do.
pres589 wrote: Zomby woof knows what time it is.
Another Damon Runyon fan?
Zomby woof wrote: Doing things on the road to make other people mad, angry, or frustrated, is the irresponsible, and dangerous thing to do.
Then I will choose to ignore you. No point in going out of my way for you, when people in front of me are not doing it, too.
If you want to "force" people to get out of your way, well, it's your blood pressure.
Have fun driving.
There is such a thing as common courtesy when driving. When some one wants by, idiot or not, let them by. A few years ago, I used to go toCanada, Qubec area. It was a joy to drive in heavy traffic. If you came up on some one in the left lane ,they just moved over and let you by even if there was a line in both lanes.
Lift and pace the car to your right.
Bet he knows sign language. 
iceracer wrote: There is such a thing as common courtesy when driving. When some one wants by, idiot or not, let them by. A few years ago, I used to go toCanada, Qubec area. It was a joy to drive in heavy traffic. If you came up on some one in the left lane ,they just moved over and let you by even if there was a line in both lanes.
So you assume that you are either more important or just driving faster than they guy in front of you? Never thinking that the opposite may be true, too?
I'm pretty sure that 20% of the cars in front of me want to drive faster than me if the opportunity arose.
So I assume that they are fast, and just choose to follow.
The left lane is for passing, and that is exactly what is being done- wait for your turn.
iceracer wrote: There is such a thing as common courtesy when driving. When some one wants by, idiot or not, let them by. A few years ago, I used to go toCanada, Qubec area. It was a joy to drive in heavy traffic. If you came up on some one in the left lane ,they just moved over and let you by even if there was a line in both lanes.
As it should be.
In a way I feel bad for the people here who are the problem on the roads, and don't realize it.
They're making their driving lives far more miserable than they need to be.
alfadriver wrote: I'm pretty sure that 20% of the cars in front of me want to drive faster than me if the opportunity arose.
I only flash my lights when it's obvious they have room to move over, or there is no one in front of them holding up the line. It's a particularly bad problem in the morning, I'm usually at work by 6:30 am (after a 20 mile commute, of which 16 miles is Interstate) with people parked like zombies in the fast lane.
I flash my lights from 100 yards or so back, then again at 50, if it looks like they still aren't moving over, I grab 4th and pass them on the right.
If you are in the left lane, and have the ability to move out of the way, then do it.
As far as this debate about "Who is more justified, important, etc" thats just a way for some to justify being a shiny happy person to another shiny happy person.
Not sure how it's the best way to handle the situation.
z31maniac wrote:alfadriver wrote: I'm pretty sure that 20% of the cars in front of me want to drive faster than me if the opportunity arose.I only flash my lights when it's obvious they have room to move over, or there is no one in front of them holding up the line. It's a particularly bad problem in the morning, I'm usually at work by 6:30 am (after a 20 mile commute, of which 16 miles is Interstate) with people parked like zombies in the fast lane. I flash my lights from 100 yards or so back, then again at 50, if it looks like they still aren't moving over, I grab 4th and pass them on the right. If you are in the left lane, and have the ability to move out of the way, then do it. As far as this debate about "Who is more justified, important, etc" thats just a way for some to justify being a shiny happy person to another shiny happy person. Not sure how it's the best way to handle the situation.
well, if you read the original post, you would have noted that this is a specific example where there are cars on all sides.
I'm not saying that I'll sit in the left lane by myself, and make people mad when they come up behind me. I never do that.
But if I'm right next to a semi, and a guy screams up behind me flashing his lights, exactly what am I to do- crash into the truck? I AM passing, and I WILL get by- just like the driver(S) in front of me.
This is either situational awareness is a problem OR people want to think that they are the most important person on the road- all of them. At the same time.
Zomby woof wrote:iceracer wrote: There is such a thing as common courtesy when driving. When some one wants by, idiot or not, let them by. A few years ago, I used to go toCanada, Qubec area. It was a joy to drive in heavy traffic. If you came up on some one in the left lane ,they just moved over and let you by even if there was a line in both lanes.As it should be. In a way I feel bad for the people here who are the problem on the roads, and don't realize it. They're making their driving lives far more miserable than they need to be.
Must be tough shaving in the morning.
alfadriver wrote: well, if you read the original post, you would have noted that this is a specific example where there are cars on all sides. I'm not saying that I'll sit in the left lane by myself, and make people mad when they come up behind me. I never do that. But if I'm right next to a semi, and a guy screams up behind me flashing his lights, exactly what am I to do- crash into the truck? I AM passing, and I WILL get by- just like the driver(S) in front of me. This is either situational awareness is a problem OR people want to think that they are the most important person on the road- all of them. At the same time.
I did, but thought I'd make it clear since there is an insane amount of sanctimony in this particular debate.
I solve this problem by taking my lane out of the middle whenever possible and driving at what I deem to be the only correct speed.
Zomby woof wrote: Great rant - NOT. I don't care how fast you're going, you don't own the left lane - the passing lane. Move the berkeley over, and stop talking about courteous
+1
Wally wrote: I solve this problem by taking my lane out of the middle whenever possible and driving at what I deem to be the only correct speed.
Spoken like a true civil servant, You have learned well grasshopper
TRoglodyte wrote:carguy123 wrote: You don't know the other driver's situation. He/she may have had a medical emergency and was just trying to get through. I've had that same situation but have been the guy in the rear and had a D-bag that wouldn't pull over. Not being able to get through could have been life threatening.If its an emergency use the EMERGENCY flashers, Thats what they're for?
in illinois at least that would be illegal. If the flashers are on , the vehicle must be stationary.
Like most of us here, it all depends on the amount of traffic there is.
Flashing lights in my experience just pisses people off. Most of the time, they already know you are there, so you're just trying to agitate them into some kind of response, and usually it's a negative one.
I think a lot of this phenomenon is caused by people thinking that anybody passing them under any situation is inflammatory and/or the person overtaking must think they're more important. How often do you signal a pass on the right, only to have someone speed up 10-15mph?
Emergency situations are different. Driving with emergency flashers on and/or flashing high beams is not rational, normal behavior. Whether it's a true emergency or if the driver is just a raging douche, I don't want them behind me. Put your junk away, move over and let them go pester someone else, get to the hospital, meet their crack dealer, whatever. You can usually fall right back in behind them (but I leave a little extra room for brake-checkers, alfa.)
I've only been in one emergency situation in my life that justified this kind of driving, and sure enough someone wanted to teach me a lesson and went out of their way junk-block me. So I had to pass them in the median, which was more dangerous for both of us. 
tl;dr Flashing lights is douchey behavior, so why counter it with an equally-douchey response?
Wow, this got heated quickly. I agree with using flashers if applicable to your area. I also believe if your boxed in and trying to get somewhere that you can move back over there's not crap you can do about it until someone moves out of the way.
I'm not gonna get into this debate, but you do have to realize (as I think someone else already said) there are different driving styles for different places. I live in a town in TX with only about 200k people. Using flashers to try and pass might get you shot. It is common to see three people driving side by side on the highway with no one around, and if you come up on them going above the speed limit in the left lane it is also common for them to slow down unanimously just to make you mad. I hate the way people drive here. It is idiotic, but it has taught me about patience. Especially since I'm driving with a trailer in tow for several hours every day for work, and I'm paying the guy sitting next to me by the hour. It's easier just to go with the flow instead of get mad about it every day.
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