I'm probably overthinking this, but I'm going to be selling a car online, so there's the potential that it might go to an out of state buyer. I understand all of the paperwork involved, but how do you guys go about getting paid while reducing the risk of getting screwed? Do you use an escrow company? This is new to me, since in the past I've only sold cars locally paid with cash.
In reply to BenB :
When I bought my car from North Carolina I brought a cashiers check from my bank, and we deposited it in person at his bank.
What Wally said. Cash also works, wire transfers aren't reversible, so once it's in your account, it's yours.
Having done this several times, I'd be insistent about keeping your license plates. Several of the "nice guy" buyers ended up racking up huge toll bills on their way back home.
Cash is fine but it may take some planning to get a lot of cash from your local branch without calling a few days ahead.
Cashiers check works fine, but they are incredibly easy to fake and must be verified with the issuing bank.
The best way is to meet the other party at a branch and watch the check get cut. I've done that as buyer and seller.
When that isnt possible I've sent a pic of the check to the seller and insisted they verify it with my bank.
Wire
I have sold a handful of what I would consider big dollar vehicles ($50k plus) with cashiers checks.
If the dude isnt a total scumbag thats a good first step.
Google search the issuing bank and call them with the google number, not the number printed on the check.
Confirm the check is valid and good to go.
Sign the title and send them on their way.
When I bought my camper van we met at a local Chase branch and I had a cashiers check issued right there.
When i bought my Land Cruiser I got a cashiers check and flew with it down to the dealership.
I go with money wire. They wire the cash into my account, once I've verified that it's there and good to go I FedEx them the signed title, bill of sale and one set of keys. I keep the other set of keys and give it to the truck driver when they come pick up the car, or to the new owner if they're doing a fly and drive.
I love wires as a seller but it might make it harder to find a buyer.
As a buyer I hate a wire - there's no simple recourse if the seller is fraudulent.
Before asking a buyer to travel to you with significant amounts of cash, go look up civil asset forfeiture.
I have used a wire transfer at a dealership before. I got ahold of my lender ahead of time to find out the exact process. Once I saw that everything was in order, I called the bank, had them send the money, and the dealer was able to see the transaction hit their account within a few minutes.
I've used wires a couple of times as a buyer.
In one case, I dragged a trailer out to where the car was about 1000 miles West, checked over the car and wired the money after seeing the car, then picked up the car the following day.
In the second case, the car was sold by a well known dealer who is known legit around these forums, so I sent the wire and they shipped the car.
Third case, the deal was brokered by a trusted member of the community, who had personally checked the car out.
I also wired money for a motorcycle that I'd seen four pictures and a photo of the title of. That was below my "it would suck but I'd financially survive" threshold, though.
I'm still not a huge fan of doing things this way, but OTOH I've also sold cars halfway across the country and accepted wires from buyers. In the end it's a case of how much one trusts the buyer or seller.
What I personally don't accept are cashiers checks that the buyer allegedly got from their bank. I might make an exception for a GRM member on this, but otherwise, I won't take a cashiers check that I haven't seen printed by the bank in front of me.
In reply to paddygarcia :
Are you saying that the seller is fraudulent in that the car doesn't exist or something?
I sold a car, wire came in as expected and I immediately transferred the money to another account....my belief was that way it couldn't get sucked back again - not that it could, but that was my mindset.
Escrow at the bank is how I've done it in the past. The money is there and isn't released until the paying party says everything is good.
wae said:Before asking a buyer to travel to you with significant amounts of cash, go look up civil asset forfeiture.
One of the scariest things I ever did was go up to Michigan with an inch thick stack of cash to buy the Volvo.
It did not help that my driver was someone for whom speed limits are merely someone else's opinion.
(Seller did not trust transfers of any type, he wanted cash.)
MiniDave said:In reply to paddygarcia :
Are you saying that the seller is fraudulent in that the car doesn't exist or something?
I sold a car, wire came in as expected and I immediately transferred the money to another account....my belief was that way it couldn't get sucked back again - not that it could, but that was my mindset.
Whatever the fraud might be, from total scam where the car doesn't exist to the more typical risk that it isn't as represented, your money is gone once the wire runs.
Reversals are possible if the money went to the wrong account coordinates but the only option after a wire fraud is the courts.
Thanks for the advice!
paddygarcia said:MiniDave said:In reply to paddygarcia :
Are you saying that the seller is fraudulent in that the car doesn't exist or something?
I sold a car, wire came in as expected and I immediately transferred the money to another account....my belief was that way it couldn't get sucked back again - not that it could, but that was my mindset.
Whatever the fraud might be, from total scam where the car doesn't exist to the more typical risk that it isn't as represented, your money is gone once the wire runs.
Reversals are possible if the money went to the wrong account coordinates but the only option after a wire fraud is the courts.
Hence my suggestion for escrow.
wae said:Before asking a buyer to travel to you with significant amounts of cash, go look up civil asset forfeiture.
That's why it's wire transfer or cashiers check for me unless it's an amount I'm comfortable "lending" to a local government.
A young guy I know owned cash stations that converted cash to bit coin pieces in NYC and got picked up with $15,000 cash.
He gets the money back but not the lawyer costs he had to hire out. I guess I can't verify the whole story as the kid is kind of sketchy.
In reply to paddygarcia :
That's why you need to check the car out in person. If you're buying it sight unseen, buyer beware. As a seller, if I'm selling a car, it's cash or money wire only. Money wire especially if the person isn't bothering to take the time to come look at it themselves as everyone's idea of "good shape, or excellent shape" is subjective.
Datsun240ZGuy said:A young guy I know owned cash stations that converted cash to bit coin pieces in NYC and got picked up with $15,000 cash.
He gets the money back but not the lawyer costs he had to hire out. I guess I can't verify the whole story as the kid is kind of sketchy.
That does sound sketchy. They usually charge the money with a crime, so you can't defend against the "forfeiture", you just lose it.
docwyte said:In reply to paddygarcia :
That's why you need to check the car out in person. If you're buying it sight unseen, buyer beware. As a seller, if I'm selling a car, it's cash or money wire only. Money wire especially if the person isn't bothering to take the time to come look at it themselves as everyone's idea of "good shape, or excellent shape" is subjective.
How do you make that work when the wire takes 24 hours or so to run? Does the out of state buyer stay overnight or something?
In reply to paddygarcia :
Car doesn't leave my possession until the funds transfer. That's not an issue for someone shipping the car, that's all set before the trailer shows up. For those arriving for a fly n drive they can either set up the wire so the funds transfer before they show up, bring me cash, or we go to a bank and do the transaction there.
Gotcha, I think we're pretty much on the same page. If I were shipping and could have local eyes on the car I'd be OK with a wire, but pick up or fly/drive means I'm either bringing a cashier's check that the seller has approved or where possible we meet at a branch of my bank and watch me have a cashier's check cut.
Thanks for the advice. I think I've got a handle on it now. Just have to find the time to take pics and such.
Escrow is great. This is exactly what it's for. Use it.
In person:
Meet at the bank. Sign the title in the bank. Do the transfer in the bank. It's always the first place I suggest as the buyer or the seller.
Banks have cameras everywhere, if there's any doubt about the process it's really easy to have law enforcement (or your banker) check the footage. And zero chance of you being robbed unless the other party is literally willing to rob a bank.
Banks also have free water and sometimes little candies too
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