The anti GRM car

I want to look into purchasing an anti-GRM car.

For an incredibly anti-GRM reason.

My parents are really bad with money, but they did something once really smart, they cashed in their pathetic 20K 401K (they were late 40's when they did this, I am not rich, but will have this by 30 easy even with the market being as bad as it is). They bought a 1967 Corvette - 4 speed, sidepipes, Marlborough Maroon, 350HP/327 coupe. Beautiful car. Drives amazingly well too.

Now it's worth between 55 and 60. In something like eight years they tripled their money. And they have these huge benefits over the 401K, or a IRA, or a savings account...

No nasty price variations - The Corvette will pretty much never decrease in price that far

Collectors insurance - agreed upon value - you wrap it around a tree, you cash out

No capital gains taxes!!!

You can drive and enjoy your investment instead of checking finance.google.com every day, and being thrilled if you see a big green number next to your symbol(s) of choice (woohoo!)

And the biggest, We know stuff about cars. I can tell a bad deal from a good one. I know that a Mustang II is always going to be a bad investment. I don't know that about mutual funds or stocks. The stock market isn't 'fun' like that to me (us).

So, in addition to the Lemons Amazon (very GRM), the PT Cruiser (not very GRM), the 72 GMC (quite GRM, but not obviously) and the newly acquired 940 from JD (pretty GRM), I'd like to pick up (in the years away future) a investment car.

So what is out there that is in the 5-15K range that is going to increase in value, going to be easy enough to keep up, going to be entertaining to drive on weekends? I don't want to buy perfect, but nice is important.

As far as value, I have a theory that the best investors cars are the ones the generation you'd like to sell to saw as kids. My stepfather had a neighbor as a kid with a Corvette and BAM. So, if I want to sell, I will be selling to people my age now, in about 15-20 years when they are having midlife crises. I didn't have anything but muscle cars hanging up in my room, but the prices for any of them are already way out of whack. The 80's hair band crowd always had Lambos hanging up - no way. What else was the car to have then? Darn shame the Testarossa never dropped in value.

Aircooled 911 turbo?

300ZX?

Supra?

944?

928?

C4 ZR1?

Let's hear your ideas, theories, and opinions on my choices so far...

-Brian

Wise man once told me, never invest in anything that leaks oil unless you're drilling for it.

I have little to add to add to the list but I would certainly subtract a 928 from the list.

I would recommend any year CRX Si with 5 speed, but....
It needs to have less than 40k miles, be completely unmodified and pristine. In 10 years you could name your price because today (and in 10 years) you will not be able to find such a gem.

FD RX-7.

IMHO... never "invest" in a car... diversify well and you'll be OK... sure in the short term you can take a hit but in the long term you'll stay ahead of inflation as long as you choose something reasonable (not super risky)

... I however recall jay leno talking about when his wife talked him into buying a used mclaren F1... for about 700k... drove it for 10+ years and now it's worth 2-3x that...

I can't imagine any car that I would purchase expecting to get a return on investment from.

Well not any that cost $5-15k anyway.

What's worng with putting you money in old manase jars?

Remember, it's only worth what somebody will pay for it. There are a lot of factors beyond how many cars are left and the condition, like if the economy really tanks. After all, it's an easy choice between food and a collector car.

The FD is a good suggestion - I am going to look into that one more...

CRX Si, huh? I never lusted after them, but I am 'special'. I'll consider it too.

You already answered your own question. Find a nicely optioned Vette and keep it stock or easily converted back. The disco Vettes are on the upswing now, though the economy has slowed that a bit. C4s are a bargain right now as many on here have noted. Will it go up like a Sting Ray? No. Will it hold value? Probably. Like any collector car the rarer the better. Sure 84s sucked, but how many still have working cross-fire injection and are in nice shape? Original ZR-1s are probably out of reach so do the research and find which years only had like 5 red/red ragtops made or some such thing. The rare options can make or break a car for investment purposes. Chevy made limited editions most every year (or so it seems) and some will be better than others. The huge aftermarket support and relatively ease of serviceability makes a Vette a better bet than most imports imho, but like a brick with the boost turned up, your mileage may vary.

E30 M3 or E28 M5

I have a friend selling a Testarossa for $55K CDN, I would say they have depreciated over time in value!

they will never hit 308 , or 308GT4 numbers, mainly due to the 12 cyl.

JD, I hear ya on the C4s, but they don't seem to have the same huzzpah as some of the others. Maybe a Grand Sport... The ZR1s seem to be just a little out of reach, but that would be a great bet - Mercury Marine built engine was bulletproof too.

The Ms are noted...

C4 ZR-1s aren't much of a stretch from your price range, and they're pretty much as sure a bet as you're going to find.

2002maniac wrote: E30 M3 or E28 M5

+E30M3

Also 2002tii, 914-6... anything oil-cooled from Porsche is unlikely to decrease but anything significant in a 911 is 30k+ already.

So it sounds like: C4 ZR1 (or grand sport) E30M3 E28M5 FD

I still think a good SC or later aircooled can be had for this money too. True a ZR1 will whoops them in performance and reliability but the value? Hmm...

And all of this from a bunch of guys who buy cars for the exact opposite reasons in a few hours. I love this forum.

Sorry, I can't go for the CRX - I just can't.

AutoXR wrote: I have a friend selling a Testarossa for $55K CDN, I would say they have depreciated over time in value! they will never hit 308 , or 308GT4 numbers, mainly due to the 12 cyl.

yep, I looked at a clean Testarossa for 44k. Also C4 ZR1s and 1st gen Vipers are good deals now. Any decent Porsche 356 will appreciate if you can find one you can afford.

ZR-1 $21k

ZR-1 $17k

Gen1 Viper. :)

In my oppinion, the era of the collectible automobile is mostly over. Any kind of collectible has a "golden-era" with the rare, unique, and low volume items that seem to appreciate endlessly and an after period. If there is a paradigm shift in personal transport in the next few years that moves us away from gasoline powered automobiles, I think all values will depreciate.

That being said, if you are to have a chance at appreciation, I think you are on the right track with the Corvette ZR-1 and early Dodge Viper. You want something as limitted as possible, with as much mass appeal as possible. Slightly more current options might be the Subaru WRX STI or Mitsubishi Lancer Evo for the video game generation (can these be had for $15K yet?).

Will take a little shopping - p-car 356 - late B or C coupe (not all that long ago you could find earlier drivers for 10-15 - now they're 25+). Your upper range will get a decent projectish one- numbers probably won't match. Maserati Indy (1,025 built, Ghibli motor, 4 seats), Merak. Triumph TR 3 or 4

Investing in an automobile (as cool as it may sound) is far more risky than investing in the market.

• The gains are very slow in comparison to the gains of the stock market.
• Both can go just as low and just as high.
• The future of a stock is mostly based on management plan, market potential, and a few other factors.
• Rare does not make a car valuable. If that were so, my Celica would be worth $20K+, but it's probably more like $5k.
• The future of a collectors car's value is based on what society will find cool in several years.

There is no way to make an educated guess as to the direction of societies favorite color in the future. Really how many people have you heard of that have made money investing in cars outside the past 15 years. Compare that to the number of people that you have heard of that made money on stocks. This whole collector car thing is a fad, no one paid that much for a 1920's car back in the 70's. And yeah, you also hear the sob stories of losers in the market as well. Just remember, the reason you don't hear the sob stories from car "investors" is because they generally didn't do it for investment, and in the end are left with a sweet car (can't complain too much about that).

Speaking from experience (not from an educated investor, I went to school for engineering not finances) the stock market is way more profitable than the car market. I doubled my money in under 1 year with no help from anyone, and no background on anything financial. Google has answered all my questions, and it's worked great so far.

Buick GNX

seriously it is about the most collectable Merican car from the 80's

aussiesmg wrote: Buick GNX seriously it is about the most collectable Merican car from the 80's

The GNX has fetched uberdollars for years. Are you thinking Grand National???

Get your hands on a stock, low mileage 1997 Integra Type R. Store it properly. That one will absolutely appreciate.

However, it's a risky game--as previously mentioned. Even the vintage Lambo guys urge people not to buy cars as investments--buy what you like.