Take a look at what can be done ....(mind the wrap)

http://www.totallytriumph.net/cgi-bin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi?az=read_count&om=46&forum=DCForumID27&viewmode=threaded

Carter

I actually miss mine (69 6+). A lot. The guy who owns the shop I used to race out of let me put it over at his place when I got divorced. If it's still there I may go get it back, provided I can give him something for 10+ yrs. storage...

The 2-ltr motor is related to the 2.5 in the TR-250 & 6, but has a higher compression head (9.something, been awhile). Smog era cars will be trouble. It seems they tuned the Strombergs to meet emissions, then simply sealed the mixture screws to keep people from playing with it. Over time, the needle wears a groove in the jet, and the damn things won't spray properly.

Check for straightness/strength (and rust) in the frame outriggers for the rear suspension trailing links. They were welded to the Spit/Herald frame as an afterthought, and whether or not they were done well was up to the guy doing the job on the production line that day. If you're restoring an older Rotoflex car, replace them immediately-and if you're buying one restored, make sure that the PO did it.

The diff gears seem to go on a regular basis, but modern gear lubes might help one live. On a related note, I had the non-overdrive rear end installed in my O/D car (can't recall the ratios, or how to tell them apart-but they are different), and the engine was a lot more relaxed on the highway. If the overdrive works, replace all the electric switch gear..mine would go in and out of O/D on the highway until I did that. If the O/D is dead, it's probably the O-rings inside the thing. The whole engine/transmission has to come out to replace them, but the thing's not much harder to pull than on a Spitfire. And the transmissions weren't really beefed up, either. They bend forks (not going into 3rd is a common problem, especially in cars that have been used to teach noobs to "drive a stick"), and the synchros & rear output bearings go away quickly without a little tenderness. Victoria British (and others, I'm sure) offer a fibreglass replacement for the original cardboard transmission cover. You'll want it..GTs get hot inside, especially during the summer.

They have a tendency to understeer, because of the bigger lump up front, but some careful tuning can get rid of it (although I did seem to go through front tires quickly after I did it ). I'm a bit odd in that I prefer the Mk.2 rear suspension to the Mk.3. If I had money & a second chance I'd convert the Rotoflex/Unijoints to CVs (a common upgrade on modern TR6s), but if you go with a Mk.3, all those great Spit 1500 rear suspension upgrades bolt right on.

A lot of parts houses treat the GT like a stepchild..one of the reasons I did so much buisiness with Victoria was that some of the other "big" Britcar parts suppliers only stocked spares for them as an afterthought.

And oh, yah...almost forgot! I'm 5`11", and I had to stick my head out the window to see the stoplight if the balk line was too close to it.

The Vintage Triumph Register is one of the best marque clubs I've ever been a member of.

http://www.vtr.org/index.shtml

Victoria British Spit/GT-6 catalogue:

http://www.victoriabritish.com/icatalog/sg/t.aspx

One last note..the few Sixes still found in junkyards have been pretty picked over, when it comes to mechanical bits. The only letter I ever had published in GRM was after a "Boneyard Brigade" style article in the early `90s after half the Spitfire section was "..take the bigger one off a GT-6..". I reminded them that some of us were still driving Sixes, and we'd like to find a part every once in awhile.

I still think they're wonderful cars. And different. Everything I've just posted about their weaknesses is true about any other British car-and most of it's true about any 40yr-old car.

Here's Rick Cline in 1974 running his Mk.3 in SCCA D-Production.

I like the idea of the BMW M motor. I was thinking about that but right now I know very little about BMW motors. That would be a lot of power for that little car.

friedgreencorrado, thank you for all that info. There is so much there I have had to read 2-3 times to make sure I get it all. When you race, what kind of power was your car making?

So in doing a little research into the BMW motors, I like the S50B30US. Is that a large motor? The current motor in the GT6 is a 2.0L, I believe, this motor is a 3.0L. Anyone fried to fix it into a small bay?

02RSXS06 wrote: friedgreencorrado, thank you for all that info. There is so much there I have had to read 2-3 times to make sure I get it all. When you race, what kind of power was your car making?

I only ever autocrossed it, it was the street car. Not much more than stock (100-105hp). Header, some velocity stacks, and a good racing oil (this was back when synthetic was an aircraft product ). I had a buddy with a Mk.3 who'd replaced the Strombergs with some bigger (2 1/2" maybe) SUs, and a competition grind cam, and he was probably getting about 115-120).

They'll turn some "period" okay numbers tuned, but not much to crow about next to a modern engine. Kas Kastner's (he was to Triumph on the West Coast what Bob Tullius was in the East) republished all his data & tricks:

http://www.kaskastner.com/kasbooks.html

SHO v6

Is the SHO v6 inline?

02RSXS06 wrote: Is the SHO v6 inline?

Nope, it's a Yamaha built V.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_SHO_V6_engine

It was supposed to go into this:

http://www.autoblog.com/tag/gn34/

Having owned one, I'm with Dr Hess on this one. Run away. Like a lot of old British cars, they are classic beauties but underneath the body lies antique and crude mechanicals. If I remember right the engine only has 4 main bearings, definitely not good for turbocharging. Other than the disc brakes, the front suspension makes Chevys of the era look high tech. If you are totally in love with the looks--and I can understand that--take the body off and build a new chassis and drive train for it.

WLB, I agree. Trying to use the stock motor and turbo will not work. I would like to put the S50B30 1995 E36 motor into it and turbo that down the road.

02RSXS06 wrote: WLB, I agree. Trying to use the stock motor and turbo will not work. I would like to put the S50B30 1995 E36 motor into it and turbo that down the road.

That would be a pretty quick little car. Don't forget you'll have to beef up the rest of the driveline to take it.

The only guys getting serious "modern" horsepower out of old British lumps are the SCCA Production racing guys, and those motors have lifespans measured in hours-and rebuild costs of five figures..

I hope to be able to use the tranny from a 95 M3 too. It would make life a little easier. With it being a 5 speed I would have a little more gearing too

Having owned a GT6, at least a dozen Spitfires and done three Spit engine swaps (Datsun A12, 2000 cc Ford Pinto, 12A rotary) let me point out the #1 and #2 problems with swapping anything into those cars.

1, the stock diff is good to maybe 100 HP (on a good day) and swapping something different is at best difficult. Swing axle Spit and 6 diffs have a bearing type stub axle which keeps the swing axle from pulling out of the diff. I have never found another type of diff which uses this setup. Rotoflex cars don't have that problem, since the lower control arm takes the sideways load. They have their own unique feature, though: the transverse leaf spring is the upper control arm and it can change length, so to speak. Right now my rotary Spitfire has a 2nd gen RX7 diff, Miata suspension uprights, custom upper and lower control arms and custom CV axles. So far I haven't been able to bust it (well, once the CV axles were completed it's become pretty tough) but it was not easy. I'd not do a live axle because of the limits to control arm length which would lead to some pretty extreme rear roll steer issues (yeah DHerr I know the TR7 axle worked well for you!). By the time you got done working around that an IRS would be no more difficult.

2, the steering rack position limits engine placement. GT6's have the front 2 cylinders hanging out past the steering rack, making them nose heavy. The engine also sits high in relation to the frame for the same reason. The hatch glass, roof etc helps offset the weight past the centerline of the front axle but ideally you would put the engine behind the front axle centerline to help with weight distribution. Most inline 4's are a snug fit, the engine has to sit high enough to clear the steering rack and unless you are willing to fab a custom trans tunnel etc it's difficult to get the engine back far enough. A rotary fits good (yeah Tim and Tommy, I know that's a relative term!) because it's so short lengthwise (~14 1/2") that shifter positioning is much more easily handled.

IMHO a V6 of some flavor would probably be easier to do from a lengthwise perspective but then you run into weird exhaust routing. Can't win.

I appreciate your incite. You sound like you know alot about Spitfires and GT6s. You are the type of person I was hoping would post, letting me know if what I wanted to do is completely crazy and pretty close to impossible. And it sounds like it is. Looks like I just hit the road block, with the BMW motor not being small.

Maybe the 1.9 (?) from a Z3, a 318is motor, something like that? A boosted Miata or Ecotec is a possibility as well. This page shows a turboed Miata motor in a Sprite. http://the-mite.com/

I will have to look into maybe a S50B20. I am assuming that is a little smaller.

1.8 turbo Miata engine in a sprite, ebay reserve not met at $9,100? Wow, I would never have believed something like that would bid up that high. Do swapped small British convertibles (NOT TR6, MGB, etc) sell for this much if finished properly?

Sorry for the threadjack, I was shocked at how high the bids went, maybe even more shocked about the reserve not being met. It is a nice car, but that's some real money.

I'm a fan of the L28 Nissan engine. Would that fit, or too long? Lots'a potential there, dirt cheap to start with.

The L24/26/28 are great motors, but they are somewhat taller than the original GT6 motor. Back to fitment problems. I have wondered if a properly done L20 4 banger would be a good swap.

I bet an L28 would make a great swap in a TR6. Or a big Healey.

That Miata powered Sprite was a very nicely done car. I particularly liked the stealth 'period' exterior covering all kinds of hi po goodness. It would be a real shock to, say, a Challenger SRT driver from stoplight to stoplight (assuming you could get any rear tire grip).

Lots of LBC swaps here: http://www.britishv8.org/ Many of them seem to be more geared towards drag race stuff, but still some neat cars and good ideas.

So how is it a V8 can fit, lol. Matt Kline's 1968 Triumph GT6 with Ford 5.0 V8 Fuel Injected Engine

If you look carefully at the pics, at least the front half of the frame is completely custom built as well as the front suspension. The steering rack has been dropped way down, I do not think those are GT6 suspension uprights. It also has a narrowed straight rear axle.

There's an old saying among swappers: you can put anything in anything as long as you have enough money and time.

Heck, you can put a Rolls Royce Merlin in a '56 Chevy. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIj2GVfua84

Very true. I have the time part, not to sure about the money part. lol.

Jensenman wrote: The L24/26/28 are great motors, but they are somewhat taller than the original GT6 motor. Back to fitment problems. I have wondered if a properly done L20 4 banger would be a good swap. I bet an L28 would make a great swap in a TR6. Or a big Healey.

There's no way an L28 would fit in a GT6.

I HAVE seen an L28-powered big Healey, and it was a very nice swap. The L28 looked right at home. People had to look twice.

Well this really puts a nail into my plans. I am not sure this will make a good track car without more power then stock. I am trying to get away from the 4 cylinder world, lol. I want to get into the 6s. I might have to look into my second option, a early 1970s 280z wide body.