Uber

I've never considered taking an uber, but then again I've been in a taxi one time in the past 15 years.

DaveEstey wrote: I use it to avoid driving unsober, and the cleanliness of the cars and ability to pay including tip without needing cash or dealing with cards is a big plus. They could increase their prices 50% and I'd still use them over Boston taxis.

This. Because the fun spots to go out drinking on the weekends there are usually tons of them in the area able to pick you up in just a few minutes.

$20 is WAY cheaper than a DUI. And without the social stigma of being a POS.

Uber presently is only available in NYC proper.

There is a big push to allow it in all of upstate New York

I work for a small business, my family has owned small businesses. I've always resisted Uber as they don't have to play by the same rules that other transportation services have to--- and to me, that doesn't seem fair. I've had my share of bad taxi rides, but I feel for the owners (and operators) of those companies when they have a competitor come to market that doesn't have to follow any of the regulations that they are forced to. (See $85K to get a taxi medallion in Chicago) Until they level the playing field, I'll avoid using Uber and other gypsy cabs.

I did take an Uber once--- the minivan that picked us up smelled like kitty litter, and it it was kind of a POS. Over the years I've taken hundreds of cabs---- only a handful have been unpleasant. Most have been very courteous and nice. I always try to be courteous and nice to them too--- -which probably helps.

I live in Chicago - the cabs here simply weren't cutting it - there weren't enough of them, they kept asking for higher rates. The drivers themselves weren't making a dime after paying to rent the medallions/cars. The medallion owners were reaping huge benefits just to sit on their asses. To me that reeks of an inefficient system and is why this is one of the first cities where uber was rolled out.

The city and the cabby union tried to play hardball, but the uber guys knew how to play the game and hired some very influential lobbyists. So now rideshare drivers have to pay something like $50 a year for a permit and have background checks and yadda yadda. But you know what - rideshare drivers are making just as much or more than cab drivers used to, without a bunch of money going to a corrupt medallion system and you can get an uber or lyft in neighborhoods where you would never DREAM of getting a cab.

The cars are also nicer and the drivers are nicer as well. I personally prefer Lyft as they allow you to leave the driver a tip and I feel that they have higher standards when it comes to drivers actually knowing where they're going rather than just listening to navigation (which insists that my house is located in an alley).

I use Uber occasionally when the wife and I go out for dinner etc, Its cheaper, better and easier than a cab IMO. I generally tip the drivers, and they seem to appreciate it.

I dont know if their company will survive, but I like the service offered. If it were a little more expansive i would probably still use it.

I always thought there was something about riding in an high mileage crown vic, on dead shocks, without seatbelts, at 60+mph on city streets, that seemed to complete the 'Chicago experience' for me. I even lucked out and happened to flag down "the singing cab driver" on one special occasion. Do Ubers provide that kind of characteristically memorable experience?

I've never taken one or a cab, but I may try to drive if they open up the rest of NY.

Driven5 wrote: I always thought there was something about riding in an high mileage crown vic, on dead shocks, without seatbelts, at 60+mph on city streets, that seemed to complete the 'Chicago experience' for me. I even lucked out and happened to flag down "the singing cab driver" on one special occasion. Do Ubers provide that kind of characteristically memorable experience?

I had one Uber driver playing the entirety of Michael Jackson's music videos. He even fast forwarded to Billy Jean for us so we could see it before our ride ended. Does that count?

STM317 wrote: Apparently, they've spent $1.55 for every $1 they've made, and there's a legal battle over autonomous stuff brewing with the state of California. Yet somehow, this company is worth $62 billion on annual revenues of $2 billion, while Ford is worth $55 billion on $136 billion in revenue.

Some of that difference might have to do with Ford's debt load, which is some 10x that of Uber's.

I've never used Uber, but I know a few co-workers have. They said getting a ride during peak times can be very expensive.

Kreb wrote: Two thoughts: -I'm starting to see more and more insane valuations and its looking more and more like the late 90s. You can only burn through other people's money for so long before they start jumping ship. Throw in the possibility of trade war on the horizon, and I'm really wondering if I need to start cashing out....

If you're gonna sell, sell when markets are high - and it's never really been this high.

That said, it's probably wiser to ride it out. Even if you're just entering retirement, it could bounce back (as it has every time before) and be a nice windfall for you later in retirement.

In reply to Ian F: But if those figures are correct, Ford is making 68 times the revenue that Uber is. 10 times the debt, for 68 times the revenue sounds like a pretty solid trade off to me. Of course the real deciding factor is likely profit, where Uber's service is nearly all profit due to not having very many actual employees/brick and mortar facilities/etc, and Ford's profit margins (while healthy) are no doubt slimmer due to massive overhead.

Still, a company cannot survive long if it's spending 50% more than it's taking in. Investing towards the future is smart, but should be done responsibly, and I'm skeptical that is what is happening here.

drdisque wrote: I live in Chicago - the cabs here simply weren't cutting it - there weren't enough of them, they kept asking for higher rates. The drivers themselves weren't making a dime after paying to rent the medallions/cars. The medallion owners were reaping huge benefits just to sit on their asses. To me that reeks of an inefficient system and is why this is one of the first cities where uber was rolled out. The city and the cabby union tried to play hardball, but the uber guys knew how to play the game and hired some very influential lobbyists. So now rideshare drivers have to pay something like $50 a year for a permit and have background checks and yadda yadda. But you know what - rideshare drivers are making just as much or more than cab drivers used to, without a bunch of money going to a corrupt medallion system and you can get an uber or lyft in neighborhoods where you would never DREAM of getting a cab. The cars are also nicer and the drivers are nicer as well. I personally prefer Lyft as they allow you to leave the driver a tip and I feel that they have higher standards when it comes to drivers actually knowing where they're going rather than just listening to navigation (which insists that my house is located in an alley).

I had the same exact problem with both lyft and uber--for whatever reason, they'd end up circling my Bucktown apartment for 10 minutes. I eventually just put in the taco joint down the street from me.

STM317 wrote: In reply to Ian F: But if those figures are correct, Ford is making 68 times the revenue that Uber is. 10 times the debt, for 68 times the revenue sounds like a pretty solid trade off to me. Of course the real deciding factor is likely profit, where Uber's service is nearly all profit due to not having very many actual employees, and Ford's profit margins (while healthy) are no doubt slimmer due to massive overhead.

Who said market evaluations always make sense and are logical? Prime example: Tesla. If you think Ford is under-valued, buy it. If you think Uber is over-valued, short it.

As far as the market as a whole, they is some arguments the current value has been created by the massive amounts of nearly free money that has been pumped into by the Fed. If that tap gets shut off or even slowed a bit, the resulting correction has the potential to be deep and may take years to recover from.

So, I'm thinking that my Miata will NOT make a good Uber car...

Before we feel too sorry for the cab companies, let's remember that prior to Uber et al, they had no incentive to provide good service. I distinctly remember waiting 3 hours one afternoon for a dispatcher to send a cab to my part of town in Orlando. Kept getting the excuse, "That's out of the way."

Uber's UI, straightforward paperless payment, and nicer vehicles are just gravy. Uber is simply better at being a cab than real cabs are. There was time for cab companies to unite and improve the customer experience, move to a mobile platform, but they chose not to, because they did not have any competition.

So true story...the last time I was in San Francisco for a conference we took a cab from the airport. We were crammed into a dirty, neglected Prius etc etc. On the way back I request an uber black. We were picked up in a very nice Cadillac XTS, very professional driver in a suit, and the car is of course clean etc. Those two rides cost essentially the same amount of money with the uber being slightly less iirc. That's just one example, but I have several like it. Generally the only time I take a cab now is if I need an immediate ride and they are sitting right there ready to go.

In reply to Cotton:

Interesting. I was under the impression "Uber-compliant" vehicles couldn't look like a tradition livery vehicle. Around here, the XTS is essentially the standard if you call for a hired car (limo service rather than a traditional cab).

Joe Gearin wrote: I work for a small business, my family has owned small businesses. I've always resisted Uber as they don't have to play by the same rules that other transportation services have to--- and to me, that doesn't seem fair. I've had my share of bad taxi rides, but I feel for the owners (and operators) of those companies when they have a competitor come to market that doesn't have to follow any of the regulations that they are forced to. (See $85K to get a taxi medallion in Chicago) Until they level the playing field, I'll avoid using Uber and other gypsy cabs. I did take an Uber once--- the minivan that picked us up smelled like kitty litter, and it it was kind of a POS. Over the years I've taken hundreds of cabs---- only a handful have been unpleasant. Most have been very courteous and nice. I always try to be courteous and nice to them too--- -which probably helps.

Interesting. I respect this, but I think the opposite side means that playing by the rules is impossible for anyone not established or wealthy--and here in Chicago, out of the ~20 cabs I've been in in the last 5 years (2 years in the suburbs, 1 in the city, and frequent visits to both) there has been 2 cabs that broke down, 4 others that I can guarantee would not pass a safety inspection, and on average they smelled poorly.

So far in probably 100 ubers, there have been about 10 that smelled bad, and 1 that was in bad shape. Otherwise they're in decent shape and condition, and the drivers are much, much better and safer.

I already found some of Uber's behavior to be a bit unsavory, but the bit about them claiming that California's autonomous vehicle laws didn't apply to them was just totally around the bend, followed immediately by "Yep, they keep turning into bike paths. Don't know why. Huh."

Basically, the claim that they're not subject to traditional rules while behaving as if that means they have no rules at all (as opposed to some sort of internal compass of okay behavior)... Well, I just removed the Uber app. I might install Lyft. I might install one of the local taxi companies' apps... I don't use any of these very much; I haven't had an issue with taxis; the big convenience for me is being able to handle booking and payment on the phone. I hate arriving and then having to conduct a CC transaction, or having to make sure I've got cash.

I don't have the app but my wife does and we use it for nights out on the town. The convenience alone makes it nice, but I'd have to imagine it also makes it much easier for others to decide to take an Uber home instead of driving. Whereas, before Uber, the process of calling and waiting on a cab led to too many people making an unfortunate decision. No evidence on this, just my gut feeling.

As far as the establishment and a level playing field, I've seen multiple cases of corruption by these taxi companies where they are buying off officials to keep the monopoly going, so I am all for some disruptors coming in and forcing some change.

That valuation, though: "In the short term the market is a voting machine, but in the long run it is a weighing machine" - Benjamin Graham

Having read of the significant numbers of rapes and assaults by ride-sharing drivers, and specifically Uber's management team's responses to them (as well as their generally crappy attitude toward the whole of society), I'm not about to give them dollar one.

I think the driver's harassment of the past is what really holds ppl back from using. Look at the news for today. An uber driver stabbed someone over an insult. I've used over three times. Once was an older gentleman in a 328. Nice guy. Second was a young Russian bodybuilder dude that looked like he was part of the Mob and scared my wife with his "Russian roulette" style driving. (I just laughed and said "no tip for you!") the third was an old chick with a thyroid problem. Her car stunk like cats. Overall: 1/3. If I had a a choice to choose from a guy in a cool car or a convertible I would choose that every time. At least until I get stabbed.

STM317 wrote:

Kreb wrote: Two thoughts: -I'm starting to see more and more insane valuations and its looking more and more like the late 90s. You can only burn through other people's money for so long before they start jumping ship. Throw in the possibility of trade war on the horizon, and I'm really wondering if I need to start cashing out....

If you're gonna sell, sell when markets are high - and it's never really been this high. That said, it's probably wiser to ride it out. Even if you're just entering retirement, it could bounce back (as it has every time before) and be a nice windfall for you later in retirement.

I tell people that if they want a sure-fire route to financial success, just watch me and do the opposite ;)

As an aside, I've got a friend who works in Uber's autonomous vehicle development department after years as an auto tech and service manager. He is one happy dude!

Long before FaceBook ever made a dime their market evaluations were totally out of whack too. I don't think they are going anywhere.

I seriously doubt services like this will ever be legislated away. Yes, the business model is sketchy. But that's the way we like it, because...Internet.

Much more likely that the business model will over run the legislation than the other way around.