What Car? Track Rats

Hi all.

Since we all love "what car" threads, here is mine.

I am looking for the best, cheap track rat. Essentially, I need something that is both cheap, reliable, and has lots of aftermarket and replacement parts. Upgrade-ability is preferred. My searches have lead me to very few options. Miata is NOT one of them, as I can't stand those things and E30's are getting to be way too expensive (i.e., neo-classic status here in SoCal).

E36 BMW (either 325is or 318Ti) Civic/del Sol (eg, ek, or del Sol) GTi/Scirocco

That's basically it. I have looked at a few other popular cars, such as the 924/944, but I keep coming back to the three above. What have I missed? I am currently thinking one of the VWs would be the best, but are there any significant caveats to running one as a street-legal track car?

From what I know, of those choices I'd pick the E36. Mainly because you won't need to do squat to the engine to make it a fun track car. The other two can be great track cars, but may need engine mods that would make SoCal emissions testing a PITA.

Mustang? Lord knows the aftermarket is there.

In reply to mazdeuce:

The only problem with the Mustang is that I would have to re-engineer the whole suspension, and I don't know if I want to take that on.

Camaros, Mustangs, G bodies... I know to some it is not as cool running American Muscle but heck parts are plentiful, the cars can be inexpensive to be had, and they can be very easy to work on.

As long as it's small and has a stick, you can make anything into a fun track rat. Indulge your curiosity, buy a Lada.

E36 is a solid choice. If an E30 is too expensive though, I think you need to recalibrate your idea of a track budget. You can get a ratty example of either for less than you will spend on a two sets of NT01s and some decent race pads.

You can find one someone already got sorted for track use with a nice suspension, maybe a full cage, maybe even a log book for a screaming deal if you wait until October.

I would want a RWD for the track. A BMW or Mustang would be good choices that would be able to cheaply leave the other cars in their dust.

Man, DO NOT GO 924/944!! Yeah, they handle/perform great but you said an E30 is getting to be way too expensive. Wait till you have to buy consumables.

With that said. I DE a Corrado with Miata power and have fun. If I could do it over again and I was sticking with a FWD(which probably wouldn't happen) I would get a Scirocco/GTI or something Japanese(most likely Japanese).

If you are wanting to do a road course car I really think ruling out a Miata is just silly. If it is straight up a track car only, I think it is absolutely the best bet. I just wish I could fit in one. I am 6'5".

A Fox Body Mustang is also something to not rule out in my opinion.

If I had to make a reasonable list it would be:

Miata>E30>E36>Foxbody>Alot of Jap FWD>VW stuff

And thats coming from a long time VW fanboi.

My unreasonable list?

Thunder Roadster>Miata>E30>E36>Foxbody>Alot of Jap FWD> VW stuff

Sorry, that is just me.

I am not saying that the E30 is too expensive as far as parts and such go, but finding a ratty one for under 4k is hard in SoCal. They are basically in the same boat as the AE86 GTS and 240SX.

I know everyone here loves Miatas, but I really don't. One of the issues is that I really don't like convertibles. I know it is illogical, but they just seem like death-traps to me. Also, I just don't like them. Not sure why, it is just how I am.

The Mustang is a something I have considered, but I really do not want to drop 5k-6k on suspension just to get it so it will kind-of handle and kind-of stop.

The reasoning behind the Hondas and the VWs is that you can get decent examples for under 2500 and the performance parts are cheap and plentiful. You also don't need to completely re-engineer something just to get it on track.

Am I off base in those assumptions?

I think a Nissan 240sx would be a lot of fun and easy on consumables, If I had a bit more to spend, I would think about the 350Z.

the first gen and second gen RX-7s are fun too. In fact the old spec 7s can be picked up for dirt cheap.

Oh and this looks like fun: http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/cto/2937025493.html

My current track rats

84 RX7 5.0 82 3rd Gen Camaro RS 86 Mustang LX 96 Chev S10 406

The Mustang has the easiest sourced and simplest to install aftermarket suspension upgrades I have ever come across.

AW11 MR2. CHEAP to buy, cheap to run. Fun to drive.

Mid engine, rwd for the win.

Here I found one for you: http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sfv/cto/2923827636.html

If an E30 is too expensive though, I think you need to recalibrate your idea of a track budget. You can get a ratty example of either for less than you will spend on a two sets of NT01s and some decent race pads

Good line. Not necessarily towards the OP but just in a general perspective kinda way.

I cannot fathom buying a track car that is fail wheel drive. Ever.

I'd go 1st gen rx7 around here the scca spec rx7 class died and you can get running caged cars for that kind if money

In reply to Capt Slow:

Haha, I had that one linked in my favs already. I was giving the MR2 an outside shot. They don't really tickle me in all the right places.

Ok, another question for the Mustangers. In order to make a Fox-stang minimally track ready, what would I need? I am very partial to the 87-93 cars, which I know is more difficult.

Actually 87 and up is slightly easier due to front control arms being suitable for SN95 brake swap.

I have sourced a bunch of parts off GRM, eBay, Craigslist and Stangnet/coral forums for mine

Including:
FRONT

Konis
Steeda springs
Steeda sway bar
Steeda camber caster adjusters
Poly control arm bushings 87 control arms
K member
Steeda X2 ball joints
SN95 11" twin piston caliper front brakes (13" Cobra are available)

REAR

Konis Steeda springs
Steeda 4 link style upper control arms (parallel)
Building my own panhard bar.
Replaced worn LSD with better Ford Motorsport LSD.

Smart shopping, trading and some luck will mean I am still under $2012 with some horse trading on parts I got with the car.

Hint: Drag Racers almost give away stuff that makes these cars change direction

Consumables is a good point. The buy-in difference between an E30 and an E36 in your area may be offset by the difference in tire and brake costs.

Buy someone elses track car. The market sucks for them right now, and you can pick up a heck of a deal or half of what it would cost to build it your self.

Ah, yes, consumables. Very good point. That puts a kink in a lot of cars and it actually makes the lighter vehicles much more attractive. Tires for a Mustang are going to be much more than those for a VW, for example. That may end up being the deciding factor. I would much rather have a track car that I can afford to run and maintain over one that is going to require a lot more cash outlay, even if that means going FWD.

Z31 turbo. or an s30.

corytate wrote: Z31 turbo.

This. Take out all the unnecessary wiring inside and you'll lose like 400lb right there. I'm only halfway joking, these things had all kinds of bells and whistles before the advent of digital signal processing, so there's MILLIONS of wire. We had one we stripped down for our VG30 Miata, and it took a lot of time to dig all that wire out. That being said, we're supplied with wire for the next 1,000 years.

That, and motors are so cheap they're almost expendable. Just boost the piss out of it and change long blocks every 3000 miles like most people change oil. Probably won't cost you that much more.

Geekspeed wrote: I know everyone here loves Miatas, but I really don't. One of the issues is that I really don't like convertibles. I know it is illogical, but they just seem like death-traps to me. Also, I just don't like them. Not sure why, it is just how I am.

If it is going to be a track rat, you'd probably have to go ahead and get a hardtop to go with it.

Not that it fixes the issue of you not liking them, just pointing it out.

Ford Escort GT or ZX2 (with EGT/Protege rear brake conversion.) Dirt cheap, consumables cheap--buy anywhere, handling quite good. Reliable. Dirt cheap. Aftermarket good.

Our ST class autocrosser has also posted a "High-Speed" track record in class at the Milwaukee Mile road course, and has turned some respectable laps at Road America (was passing SM cars on track at HPDE).

http://www.mcscc.org/results/2010/ax/MC.AX.2010.TrackRecords.Milwaukee.pdf