What model/year FOMOCO product...

In reply to Jesse Ransom :

All automatics. If Bondurant had manual ones, he swapped them just like his Marauders.

codrus (Forum Supporter) said:

Javelin (Forum Supporter) said:

stroker said:

...is the closest thing to a four door, manual transmission Mustang?

I think there was a limited edition Fairmont HO that's a Unicorn but I can think of anything obtainable.   I'm beginning to think I'm stuck with an automatic no matter what I do.

73 Maverick four door with a 302 and a 3-speed?

Honestly, FoMoCo has never made this (in the US, don't look at Aussie Falcons, you'll cry) combo. Every time you got a four door with a V8 (Crown Vic, Marauder, Fairmont) it was automatic only. Every time you got a four door with a manual (Taurus SHO, Contour SVT) it was FWD.

Lincoln LS was a 4-door manual, but they didn't make many.

 

Manual only with the V6. The V8 was automatic only.

Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) said:

Stroker... What generation or decade you were thinking, and also... how much Ford does it need to be?  I noticed some Merkur/Jaguar type suggestions.  Are we looking for something that IS a Ford, or something with a Ford-ish connection?

I'm looking for a sedan with rwd and a V8 with a manual transmission that's NOT a BMW.  Don't care about age too much as I need it to be pretty cheap (sub $10K?).  Doesn't have to be a Ford/Mercury/Lincoln but I'd prefer those.  I've even looked for early/mid 70's Hornets without success.  Later stuff is so complicated I think I'm looking for older stuff, say pre-2000.  I'm open to suggestions.

stroker said:

I'm looking for a sedan with rwd and a V8 with a manual transmission that's NOT a BMW.  Don't care about age too much as I need it to be pretty cheap (sub $10K?).  Doesn't have to be a Ford/Mercury/Lincoln but I'd prefer those.  I've even looked for early/mid 70's Hornets without success.  Later stuff is so complicated I think I'm looking for older stuff, say pre-2000.  I'm open to suggestions.

Gen 1 CTS-Vs can occasionally be found in the $9-12k range. They're newer than 2000 though. And obviously not Fords.

The 4 door Fox chassis cars are probably the closest thing to a "mustang sedan", but you'd have to do the manual conversion, and it will probably come with an undesirable powerplant.

In reply to stroker :

Head over to https://www.fueleconomy.gov/
There you will find a Power Search function.  Put the parameters of sedan, V8, manual into the search and it will return back all cars sold in the US since 1985

All that comes back is BMWs, Cadillac CTS-V's and Pontiac G8

Maybe it is the Mandela effect, but I am sure the LTD LX came as with a 5 spd.  Or could be ordered that way?

Edit: Google says Mandela effect

John Welsh said:

Head over to https://www.fueleconomy.gov/
There you will find a Power Search function.  Put the parameters of sedan, V8, manual into the search and it will return back all cars sold in the US since 1985

All that comes back is BMWs, Cadillac CTS-V's and Pontiac G8

What about the Chevolet SS?  Plus, unless it's got a RWD filter it should also be returning the B6/B7 Audi S4/RS4.

(not that any of those are Fords, obviously)

codrus (Forum Supporter) said:

John Welsh said:

Head over to https://www.fueleconomy.gov/
There you will find a Power Search function.  Put the parameters of sedan, V8, manual into the search and it will return back all cars sold in the US since 1985

All that comes back is BMWs, Cadillac CTS-V's and Pontiac G8

What about the Chevolet SS?  Plus, unless it's got a RWD filter it should also be returning the B6/B7 Audi S4/RS4.

(not that any of those are Fords, obviously)

OP specified RWD and a $10k budget.

STM317 said:

codrus (Forum Supporter) said:

John Welsh said:

Head over to https://www.fueleconomy.gov/
There you will find a Power Search function.  Put the parameters of sedan, V8, manual into the search and it will return back all cars sold in the US since 1985

All that comes back is BMWs, Cadillac CTS-V's and Pontiac G8

What about the Chevolet SS?  Plus, unless it's got a RWD filter it should also be returning the B6/B7 Audi S4/RS4.

(not that any of those are Fords, obviously)

OP specified RWD and a $10k budget.

I think he was pointing out that the fueleconomy.gov site is not the best reference

You guys are slipping...

:p

Maurauder with a manual swap is my real answer though. 

My X-type Jag is a stick shift but AWD.  And slightly rarer than unicorn tears with the bigger engine.

Okay, let's take this from a different angle. 

It's clear we can't get from A to C directly.  What's the simplest path to go from A to B to C?  Fox Sedan with a 302/manual swap from a donor Mustang or Explorer?

I did the fueleconomy gov search and I just put in every category except truck, suv, and van so I got more results.  I got:

• Caddy ATS
• Caddy CTS
• Chevy SS
• Genesis (didn't know it came in a manual)
• G35/G37
• IS250/300
• S-type/LS
• C-class
• G8

Closest thing to a FoMoCo is the S-type/LS.  I love the looks of the LS, but I've heard they're more Jag-like in the reliability department, and not in the good x308/x350 way, more like the x200 way.

The Caddys I can see sub-10k as well as the older versions of the C-class, but if you're avoiding BMW I'm guessing it's the same reason you'll want to avoid a C-class.

The G8/SS are surprisingly fun cars, but doubtful they're in the pricing you're wanting.  The G8/SS is basically a Holden Commodore and it was the same platform as Aussie's Caprice and Ute, and in the States as the G8, chevy SS, and Camaro.   The G8 and Chevy SS are basically a 4dr 5th Gen Camaro.  All on the VF Commodore platform.

I'm also seeing the potential for a 2003-up P71 with a T56 swap.  Buy a solid car for $5k, spend $4k on a conversion.

stroker said:

Okay, let's take this from a different angle. 

It's clear we can't get from A to C directly.  What's the simplest path to go from A to B to C?  Fox Sedan with a 302/manual swap from a donor Mustang or Explorer?

That would be simple, but truthfully, the Fox sedans aren't very foxy.  If you like them, great.  Definitely simpler than Panther/T56, but not sure if it's any cheaper.

Do a budget on both of these:  The first with a 302/T5 swap (and something to replace the wee axle in the back) versus the P71 which already has a V8 and an 8.8" rear.  Just add T56.

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

Lets say google is close on actual curb weights. The Fox Fairmont is at least 1000lbs lighter than the Panther. 

stroker said:

Okay, let's take this from a different angle. 

It's clear we can't get from A to C directly.  What's the simplest path to go from A to B to C?  Fox Sedan with a 302/manual swap from a donor Mustang or Explorer?

Good options I can think of:

1. Find something from the '60s or early '70s with this combination already in place, from any of the Big Four. Most sedans then had V8s, and manuals had a better take rate then. Downside is that this probably won't be all that fast in a straight line in stock trim and have a suspension calibrated for slippery bias ply tires.
2. Get a Fairmont / Marquis, swap full drivetrain. These are pretty small cars with not much back seat, and are likely to need an axle upgrade. But they're about the lightest domestic RWD sedans this side of a '60s era Falcon, Dart, or Nova.
3. Swap a GM G-body (Monte Carlo, Grand Prix, Cutlass, etc from the early to mid '80s) to a manual transmission. I think there were a few sold with a V8 and manual transmission, but those are real unicorns. You might find an Iraqi Taxi package with a 4 door, V6, and 3 speed floor shift manual, though. Heavier than a Fox body, but might be a bit more substantial.
4. Swap a Panther platform car to a manual transmission, or a GM B-body. Might be the best option if you want plenty of room.
5. I've seen Chrysler LX cars swapped to a manual using Challenger parts, but that may be out of your budget.
6. Japanese option: Get a Lexus LS400 and get some of the Australian parts to put a manual behind a 1UZ.

Trent said:

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

Lets say google is close on actual curb weights. The Fox Fairmont is at least 1000lbs lighter than the Panther. 

 

It's also at least 1,000% more wet noodle-y. You can jack up one corner and three of the four doors won't open anymore.

Maybe the real answer here is buy a decent running/driving 5.0 SN95 Mustang and then swapping the drivetrain into a 4-door BMW of choice?

codrus (Forum Supporter) said:

John Welsh said:

Head over to https://www.fueleconomy.gov/
There you will find a Power Search function.  Put the parameters of sedan, V8, manual into the search and it will return back all cars sold in the US since 1985

All that comes back is BMWs, Cadillac CTS-V's and Pontiac G8

What about the Chevolet SS?  Plus, unless it's got a RWD filter it should also be returning the B6/B7 Audi S4/RS4.

(not that any of those are Fords, obviously)

It shows up. And it has a RWD filter.

I find a lot of early A-body Mopars with a slant six and a manual.  How hard would it be to upgrade to a 318 combo from a truck or later model car?  Not nearly as safe a design as later years but at least it would be light...

In reply to stroker :

Most Mopars need a k-member swap to go from 6 to 8... though the new engines may change that. That was the case for the old factory v8s.

Saron81 said:

In reply to stroker :

Most Mopars need a k-member swap to go from 6 to 8... though the new engines may change that. That was the case for the old factory v8s.

There's a kit to install V8 mounts on a Slant Six K-frame.  Been around for a while but I can't remember how much they cost. 

Javelin (Forum Supporter) said:

Trent said:

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

Lets say google is close on actual curb weights. The Fox Fairmont is at least 1000lbs lighter than the Panther.

It's also at least 1,000% more wet noodle-y. You can jack up one corner and three of the four doors won't open anymore.

This is easily rectified with a simple set of welded, bottom mount, subframe connectors and still avoids the heft of a BoF car.

In Ford land, I agree that manual swapping a 4dr Fox or Panther are the most logical paths within your budget. The questions are:

• How much of a project do you want? And,
• Are you looking for a comfy sedan with three pedals, or a four door Pony car?

Fox platform cars are Legos. It would be pretty easy to buy a couple and mix-n-match your way to the desired result. Not all the parts are 100% bolt-in, but they do all fit one way or another. I am well under $5K in my sn95 swapped '87 Tbird, including a smattering of aftermarket suspension components, thru careful shopping and being blessed to come out on top of a few less than ideal situations.

Manual swapping a Panther involves custom pedals and clutch actuation solutions. I am gathering parts to undertake this project, hopefully soon. The transmission chosen to swap in will determine the largest chunk of the budget, then the pedals, and then however much tuning is required if the car is new enough to care that you have removed the auto.

Didn't Granada's come with a V8 and a stick?

Running driving SN95 donor into Fox sedan seems like the easiest way to get this done.  Upgrade/update/swap/etc along the way. 

GM B-body like an 80's Caprice and then an MY6 OD 4-speed swap might be cool and doable if you can find the parts for the swap for the right money.