What Rally Cross car would you build?

mgb-gt. I haven't rallyx'd mine yet (only ran my e36 and SVT focus), but now that I am thinking about it since I started reading this thread I cannot stop.

AWD and FWD are great for getting around the course quickly without drama. RWD is for having the most fun while you get through the course, and savoring the drama.

irish44j wrote: Subaru guys, by default, assume that their cars can enter WRC or RA in stock condition....no need to recruit them, they already know about rallycross :)

Have you DRIVEN a stock GC? I mean... damn. They just work. Pitch them, fling them around, drive them neatly, lug the engine, rev past the powerband... they don't care. I am continually reminded of a comment made about the works MkII Escorts: No matter what stupid situation you put yourself in, you just wiggle the steering and play with the pedals and you can save it.

Yes you still have to be Good to wring 100% out of it. But you can get 85, 90% of it with incredible ease, and it becomes a game to try different ways of seeing the course to find that last few percent, instead of trying to work around the car's deficiencies.

Not all of them are blue. Some are red and some are white and some are black and some are green and some are silver.

If your are rally crossing an AWD and it's too drama free, you are aren't driving it hard enough. They respond best when you beat the hell out of them. To me, that is much more fun then trying to stay clean and tidy with a 2WD car. Push a FWD or RWD car too hard, and you are slow. An AWD car with enough power should leave a corner like a RWD, except is it also going forward in addition to sideways. Most of the power will be going to the rear wheels, it's not 50/50 unless you are driving with a locked or no center diff. That said, the car I'd recommend is a surprisingly unpopular car. Especially considering that it is a cheap, readily available, shorter, lighter, version of a homologated rally car. Yes, I'm talking about a DSM. If you can pry one away from the drag strip, you would find they are much happier in the dirt.

Knurled wrote:

irish44j wrote: Subaru guys, by default, assume that their cars can enter WRC or RA in stock condition....no need to recruit them, they already know about rallycross :)

Have you DRIVEN a stock GC? I mean... damn. They just work. Pitch them, fling them around, drive them neatly, lug the engine, rev past the powerband... they don't care. I am continually reminded of a comment made about the works MkII Escorts: No matter what stupid situation you put yourself in, you just wiggle the steering and play with the pedals and you can save it. Yes you still have to be Good to wring 100% out of it. But you can get 85, 90% of it with incredible ease, and it becomes a game to try different ways of seeing the course to find that last few percent, instead of trying to work around the car's deficiencies. Not all of them are blue. Some are red and some are white and some are black and some are green and some are silver.

Hey, hey, I'm just some internet know it all who talks about rallycross without ever having done anything, you know? (kidding, aero!)

Yeah, I've driven Adam Kimmet's stock-ish (minus most of the interior, and the fact that it was created by welding two wrecked GCs together) GC 2.5RS on course and I completely agree....the car is intuitive and goes pretty much exactly where you want it to go (I'd say the same thing about my WRX for the most part as well). But I've said it before....I laid down far faster runs in his car than I could have in mine, and I just thought it was boring in general. It was almost too easy to drive it fast (granted to drive it "fastest" would be much harder, as you note). If going fast and margin of error are the goals, a GC is the ticket. I don't know that it punches the excitement ticket like most RWD rallycross cars do, though.

But really, I was just being facetious. I drive a WRX every day (not my first Subaru), so I'm pretty familiar with why they're so great on the slippery stuff.

Also, those silver, white, black, and green imprezas you've seen? Yeah, those are all repainted. They were all originally blue. I'm quite certain of it

Mike924 wrote: If I was to build a Rallycross car, I would like 4wd, but I think there is more fun to be had in a rear wheel drive car. So that being said here is what I would look for. RWD Small car -- Chevy Chevette would be good. Small, low power, but rear wheel drive fun. No worries if I run into something because it is cheap. I wouldn't worry about class I would do it for fun. I am sure if you looked at any local car club associated with SCCA or NASA they would give you lots of information about car setup and tips and tricks It does look like a lot of fun though. Mike Kirby

+ =

Boost_Crazy wrote: If your are rally crossing an AWD and it's too drama free, you are aren't driving it hard enough. They respond best when you beat the hell out of them. To me, that is much more fun then trying to stay clean and tidy with a 2WD car. Push a FWD or RWD car too hard, and you are slow. An AWD car with enough power should leave a corner like a RWD, except is it also going forward in addition to sideways. Most of the power will be going to the rear wheels, it's not 50/50 unless you are driving with a locked or no center diff. That said, the car I'd recommend is a surprisingly unpopular car. Especially considering that it is a cheap, readily available, shorter, lighter, version of a homologated rally car. Yes, I'm talking about a DSM. If you can pry one away from the drag strip, you would find they are much happier in the dirt.

really you could just say "if you're rallycrossing ANYTHING and it's too drama free, you aren't driving it hard enough."

My WRX has been backwards on AD08s on an autocross course more than once, and is usually the first car out of the neighborhood on snow days... I've driven it to and over the limit plenty of times, just not on a rallycross course (350lb springs would make that not enjoyable). I'm really just speaking in a comparative sense if we're talking about "fun" here. Which of course is a totally subjective measure, and that's just my opinion on the matter

oh,and just for you Boost_crazy

this is Dave Shindle's DSM, which is mostly used for stage rally recon runs, but occasionally he brings it out to rallycross.

I've been wanting to buy a TR7 coupe and convert it to a V8. Something like this.

Back in the day, John Buffum was fairly successful in one of these.

DSMs have the same problem that WRXs have - the gearing is just waaaaay too tall. A good gearing for rallycross would have 3rd gear winding out at 55-60mph.

Yes, I am completely spoiled for gearing Heck, even the car I don't rallycross anymore has 4th gear wound out at 65mph, although it would be lucky to see over 45 on the kind of course that would have the RX-7 see 70.

while I would not suggest destroying an antique.. the Fiat 124 Spider did very well in Rallying, it was only ever an also-ran due to the dominance of the Stratos

In reply to irish44j:

oh,and just for you Boost_crazy this is Dave Shindle's DSM, which is mostly used for stage rally recon runs, but occasionally he brings it out to rallycross.

Boost Crazy approves of this message.

You know, if I hit the lottery one of those Hawk Stratos replicas would be a pretty epic rally-x car. 8)

Back when I ran with the Detroit region, there were three guys that regularly rallycrossed in DSMs. They were pretty competitive, too.

Brett_Murphy wrote:

aussiesmg wrote: I am resurrecting my $2009 and $2010 challenger, the 96 S10, as my rallycrosser.

Is there a build thread for this?

There is, the early part is on Cardomain then continues on GRM, but it is not very complete at this stage.

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/build-projects-and-project-cars/1996-chevy-s10-challenger/52505/page1/

I had a 93 Eagle Talon with 260k miles on the chassis (probably 200 or so on the 2nd engine) that I would have loved to rallycross, but sold it long before I got involved in these shenanigans & still living with the soul-sucking ex-wife.