When do you decide to move on and sell?

Alright so, I took a bit to think on this thread and all the advice and here's what I've come up with...

As the current market is what it is at the moment, I'm going to continue to weld the rust together (thankfully the car is completely rust free).  The car will not be turned into a dedicated track car, but I may still take it to the occasional track event to scratch the itch.  Ultimately my goal will be to purchase a dedicated track machine in the form of a relatively inexpensive and easy to maintain race car like a Spec Miata, or if I have more money to blow a Rush SR.

The only big maintenance project that I have to accept by choosing to keep it is a coolant system refresh, as the water pump is a high failure item (and at 150k miles needs to be replaced anyway); radiator also shows some dried coolant around the plastic end tanks in a couple of spots.  Parts updated/replaced to this point: intake manifold, PCV valve assembly, entire timing chain assembly, high pressure fuel pump, all fuel injectors (in process), and majority of A/C system.  Other maintenance completed: dampers, suspension bushings, tie rods, swaybar end links, front wheel bearings, and ball joints.

As far as unobtanium goes: nothing that I can think of.  Functional replacement transmissions are a couple hundred bucks, functional used turbos are even less, and replacement OEM downpipes (if a catalytic converter fails) are a dime a dozen.  Replacement engines are easily available and are as inexpensive as you'll find for most cars.

When the auto market settles down I'll come back around to this question again, but I guess for the time being my wallet is better off sticking with this car as it's unlikely that I can replace it with anymore more reliable for what it's worth...  and if I can I definitely wouldn't enjoy driving it as much.

Something I'm realizing as a fun benefit of deciding to not use your turbocharged street car as a track car is that because I don't have to solve the problem of intake heat soak, brake overheating, and keeping oil temperatures under control... I can crank up the boost and just enjoy the extra horsepower.

Might even be some cheap motivation to keep gluing the car back together as a couple thousand bucks gets me Mustang GT acceleration. The weak link in the engine are the rods, but those aren't a concern until 400 ft lbs of torque which is well beyond what I care for in a FWD car.

Many/most people don't set a schedule for maintenance for their cars  - change all the hoses, belts etc. at regular intervals etc. - and then feel that the car is at fault for 'becoming unreliable'.  If you spread the maintenance out it doesn't hurt as much in the wallet, but of course the big things - engine, trans etc. are going to need overhaul or replacement some day.

I'm mostly on the other end of things - I have a bunch of old cars (1950s and later). People buy those, have the biggest holes in the bodywork filled in, replace whatever doesn't work when they buy it and call it a restoration. And then they get fussed when something they didn't get around to replacing or servicing craps out on them.  Old cars need restoration, not just fixing anything that obviously isn't working and ignoring everything that hasn't broken (yet).

A 2010 GTI is a nice car and worth keeping if you enjoy it , plus with the replacement of carbs with injection, we are getting 200.000 miles before serious things need doing, instead of needing a new engine in less than half that on a carbbed car.

I keep cars long enough that I have had to restore them twice (30 years + apart) but if I find that I just don't feel like doing a car one more time, then I move it along to a new owner who can repeat the cycle.

bobzilla said:

For us it's rust or chassis is done. The Elantra was still running great but the front frame horn had catastrophic rust. Wifes 250k mile accent the chassis was just done. Every panel had damage (hail, road debris, flying trash cans etc), the AC compressor was on it's last legs, rear windows were seized etc. The Forte was to make room for a new car. Her Rio rust was creeping into the subframes. The tiburon on jack stands yu couldn't open or shut the doors. 

This, pretty much.

Which is why I chewed through cars every 24 months or so until I finally was able to get a second car so that I didn't have to subject my "good" car to salt, and then bought a car with supremely good rust proofing.

Still, it was scary after I had my ten year old Subaru on a lift and removed the seatbelts by pushing gently from underneath.

wspohn said:

Many/most people don't set a schedule for maintenance for their cars  - change all the hoses, belts etc. at regular intervals etc. - and then feel that the car is at fault for 'becoming unreliable'.  If you spread the maintenance out it doesn't hurt as much in the wallet, but of course the big things - engine, trans etc. are going to need overhaul or replacement some day.

I'm mostly on the other end of things - I have a bunch of old cars (1950s and later). People buy those, have the biggest holes in the bodywork filled in, replace whatever doesn't work when they buy it and call it a restoration. And then they get fussed when something they didn't get around to replacing or servicing craps out on them.  Old cars need restoration, not just fixing anything that obviously isn't working and ignoring everything that hasn't broken (yet).

A 2010 GTI is a nice car and worth keeping if you enjoy it , plus with the replacement of carbs with injection, we are getting 200.000 miles before serious things need doing, instead of needing a new engine in less than half that on a carbbed car.

I keep cars long enough that I have had to restore them twice (30 years + apart) but if I find that I just don't feel like doing a car one more time, then I move it along to a new owner who can repeat the cycle.

Now-days I keep cars until the dreaded tin worm eats them.  Then they go to the junk yard.  ( My state excels at road salt) 
My last was 370,000 miles/ 20 years.   
     But I buy new,  so I feel good keeping the maintenance  up, buying good oil  tires etc. The result is no breakdowns, no surprises, and reliable efficiency.    
     I accept the reality of there is no free lunch. Buy a cheap used car and how much maintenance has been skipped? Used cars are a terrible risk and more expensive on a per mile basis. 

    

frenchyd said:Used cars are a terrible risk and more expensive on a per mile basis.   

Factually incorrect. I have taken several used cars to just shy of 500k miles. 

Used cars are much like new ones. Take care of them and they will take care of you. 

I don't really have a strong opinion on new vs. used as far as ultimate value is concerned, but I can say that I'm more comfortable with certain brands when buying used. For example, I wouldn't buy most German cars with over 100k miles already on the clock unless it came with a very thick stack of service records. The average Honda though? Yeah sure, no worries about those.

One thing I can say for sure is that a switch gets flipped in my head when I buy a brand new car making me feel like I need to spend a few extra dollars on quality parts. Part of the reason why I feel comfortable with the conclusion that holding onto my GTI is the best way forward at the moment is because for every part I've removed the replacement has been OE/OEM, top shelf aftermarket, or an aftermarket upgrade.

Toyman01 + Sized and said:

frenchyd said:Used cars are a terrible risk and more expensive on a per mile basis.   

Factually incorrect. I have taken several used cars to just shy of 500k miles. 

Used cars are much like new ones. Take care of them and they will take care of you. 

Quoted for truth.  I took a $1,200 Saturn from 120k to 273k miles with only replacing the alternator and radiator (plus brakes and tires).  My per mile cost was ridiculously low.

Not to turn this into a "woe is me" thread, but I thought I'd offer an update on the GTI that some might find amusing.

So I installed the new injectors and put everything back together and it fired up just fine and ran great. Cleared the ECU codes and it stayed clear, no fuel or boost leaks, no install errors to chase down, the car was happy and felt strong... for two whole days.

On the third day the car picked up a misfire on cylinder #3 at moderate throttle, it felt like the moment it started to build boost it'd stop working. While limping it home all I could think was "what did I screw up?" Checked all the intake connections for disconnected hoses then swapped coil packs around and the misfire moved to cylinder #4.

So... four new coil packs in the mail. It's like my car really, really doesn't want to make it to 150k miles.

In reply to MrFancypants :

I remember 1.8t people used to carry spare coils and the necessary tools to change them 

Pete. (l33t FS) said:

In reply to MrFancypants :

I remember 1.8t people used to carry spare coils and the necessary tools to change them 

lol yeah, I remember constant coil pack and window regulator failures with the mk4s.

I'll have three spares in the back now.

Pete. (l33t FS) said:

In reply to MrFancypants :

I remember 1.8t people used to carry spare coils and the necessary tools to change them 

Almost all British car owners travel with a small assortment of spare parts - usually points, condenser, sometimes also coil. spark plugs and such, plus a spare of anything that had ever betrayed you in the past (in my case a set of rad hoses and a spare water pump - I used a 3 main MGB engine in that car and they were a 2 year only engine so hard to find a pump if you needed it).

One corollary of traveling in old British cars that I learned was that if you carried a given spare, that particular part would never fail (though anything else was a possibility).  Kind of like good ju-ju - the car somehow sensed that there was no point in having any part that you had spares for, fail. 

I've been driving my XJ from 259k to 316k so far. I have roughly tripled my initial investment through repairs, bought at 2300 and currently at 7200. Currently 12¢ per mile.  I've been saying that if something BIG fails I might replace it, but through small parts replacements it slowly becomes a "new" car. There's a pile of sensors in the trunk and the tools to replace them. Oh, and 100 miles of AAA just in case.

buzzboy said:

I've been driving my XJ from 259k to 316k so far. I have roughly tripled my initial investment through repairs, bought at 2300 and currently at 7200. Currently 12¢ per mile.  I've been saying that if something BIG fails I might replace it, but through small parts replacements it slowly becomes a "new" car. There's a pile of sensors in the trunk and the tools to replace them. Oh, and 100 miles of AAA just in case.

Man that's incredible. I really love hearing about cars that keep chugging beyond 250k miles.

MrFancypants said:

Not to turn this into a "woe is me" thread, but I thought I'd offer an update on the GTI that some might find amusing.

So I installed the new injectors and put everything back together and it fired up just fine and ran great. Cleared the ECU codes and it stayed clear, no fuel or boost leaks, no install errors to chase down, the car was happy and felt strong... for two whole days.

On the third day the car picked up a misfire on cylinder #3 at moderate throttle, it felt like the moment it started to build boost it'd stop working. While limping it home all I could think was "what did I screw up?" Checked all the intake connections for disconnected hoses then swapped coil packs around and the misfire moved to cylinder #4.

So... four new coil packs in the mail. It's like my car really, really doesn't want to make it to 150k miles.

You are upset because your oe coil packs didn't make it to 150k miles? 

In reply to 1SlowVW :

I'd be upset; we have two cars that are well past.that with the original coil packs. OK Ok they're not VWs

1SlowVW said:

MrFancypants said:

Not to turn this into a "woe is me" thread, but I thought I'd offer an update on the GTI that some might find amusing.

So I installed the new injectors and put everything back together and it fired up just fine and ran great. Cleared the ECU codes and it stayed clear, no fuel or boost leaks, no install errors to chase down, the car was happy and felt strong... for two whole days.

On the third day the car picked up a misfire on cylinder #3 at moderate throttle, it felt like the moment it started to build boost it'd stop working. While limping it home all I could think was "what did I screw up?" Checked all the intake connections for disconnected hoses then swapped coil packs around and the misfire moved to cylinder #4.

So... four new coil packs in the mail. It's like my car really, really doesn't want to make it to 150k miles.

You are upset because your oe coil packs didn't make it to 150k miles? 

I'm not upset now. When the misfires came back so soon I was upset with a combination of "why does this keep happening?" and "what did I screw up when I put it all back together?" 

Coil-packs are cheap and it'll take me longer to remove the new one from the box than to install it.

If it makes you feel better, our supposedly indestructible, run forever, Lexus GX470 (aka Toyota Prado/land cruiser in the rest of the world)  totally fell apart from 115k miles to 127k miles when I gave up on it.

Everything wore out in that 12k mile time period.  Radiator, alternator, both front axles, suspension, brakes, etc.  I was constantly underneath it fixing it.  Then the steering rack started to leak and I was done with it. 

Stuff wears out, I totally get it.  Just hard to deal with the fact that everything was wearing out at the same time and at mileage that all of my german cars easily surpassed without those parts wearing out.  I've never had a steering rack need to be replaced on any of my other cars for instance...

In reply to docwyte :

Oh wow, that must have actually felt like a bit of surprise with a Lexus. I'd expect some high mileage, old car issues here and there but not so much at once.

With the GTI I kind of expected this would happen some day, but I never expected a new problem nearly every time I drove it. I suppose I should be thankful that the most difficult repair only required me to remove the intake manifold, a job I need to be comfortable doing for valve cleanings; it's also a lot easier to change the water pump with the intake manifold off.

In my experience with owning two modern VWs, the proper time to sell one is "yesterday". This coming from someone currently fixing up a E46 with 250k on it. Once stuff started going wrong with my VWs, it was just a constant flow of stuff breaking in new and amazing ways.

I've had good experiences with my VW/Audi's.  I do maintain them extremely well and tend to sell them around 140-150k miles though.  I've never run one up to, or past 200k miles though.  I know plenty of cars can do that these days, I just don't like having what I think is an extremely high mileage vehicle.  Stuff wears out with use and with 200k+ miles, you're more than likely going to be spending a bunch of money replacing things.

Everything I've had I've never reached a point of it's gotta go repair wise. I've gotten rid of them because I didn't really like, sorry miata fans but I can't stand them, or I moved and couldn't take it.

Most of them ended in a I took it apart and someone else decided for me.

If it makes you feel any better, our '06 Rav4 had an issue with the coil packs from the factory, they stared failing around 50k, I believe.  That was a fun game of whack-a-mole for a while, it felt like one was failing every 3 months for a while there.

My 150-200k list looks something like this:

- wheel bearings

- shocks/struts if not done already

- front lower control arms

- radiator and t-stat

- radiator hoses

- ATF fluid hard lines (they corrode around here)

- water pump

- check hard coolant lines

We get a lot of corrosion around here in the Northeast, so things like ATF and coolant hard lines become risks after a certain mileage. Better to replace them proactively than to lose and engine/transmission due to a failure on one. Two of the ATF hard lines were leaking on our Odyssey at 193k, and I replaced a crusty coolant line on our Rav4 around 130k. Currently looking at proactively doing the water pump and radiator on the Rav4 at 216k, I'm losing a small amount of coolant between oil changes and suspect both of them at this point (2GR-FE water pumps leaking are a common issue).

I thought I'd post an update for those who took the time to offer me their advice. All if the issues that had me feeling down on my car have been resolved and it's been going strong for a few thousand miles now. To get myself feeling enthusiastic about it again I've performed a few cheap refresh jobs like lubricating the squeaky anti-roll bar bushings, and chased some interior rattles. Also used a headlight restoration kit, applied some fresh red vinyl over the faded stripes on the upper grill, fresh wash/wax, and upped the boost a bit.

In reply to MrFancypants :

You can have your cake and eat it too.  
     Track car the VW and look seriously at an EV. 
 Perhaps you've noticed the price of crude oil is going up?   Have you looked at where they are going for oil now?  
  Not in Texas or California.  
      Arctic  ocean and deep sea.  You're paying those costs.  But the Sun shines everywhere and so does the wind blow.    While you may not be buying wind generators or solar panels. That doesn't mean they aren't  selling.   
      In short the cost of electricity will remain cheaper than the cost of oil.  
 Plus EV's are fast!! Even one's intended as just transportation. 
    VW is going all in on EV's.  So is everyone one else.