For perspective, which is worth more an E30 M3 or a 240z? They have hit 130k on BAT.
For perspective, which is worth more an E30 M3 or a 240z? They have hit 130k on BAT.
Slippery (Forum Supporter) said:dean1484 said:This just made clones of that car worth building.
Its not just simple swap of parts to a regular e30. I don't think you can properly clone one for that money.
Almost every body panel is different, including bonded windows for extra rigidity. Suspension, and the engine itself is worth a pretty penny.
Yep.... when the E36 M3 came out, people called it, well, "E36 M3", because it wasn't a special model like the E30 M3 was.
It's my understanding that stuffing Z3 suspension bits under an E30 gets you close suspension-wise. The deck becomes tricky, since BMW raised it for aerodynamic reasons (got legal wings/spoilers higher into the airstream?).
The S14 engine holds a special place in my gear-brain, and it's kind of funny that S14 swaps used to be popular in 2002s. Just imagine all the M3s that died to make that possible.
maj75 (Forum Supporter) said:For perspective, which is worth more an E30 M3 or a 240z? They have hit 130k on BAT.
That is a good question. I'd say that the M3 is more rare yet BaT did get $310k for that one 240Z.
David S. Wallens said:maj75 (Forum Supporter) said:For perspective, which is worth more an E30 M3 or a 240z? They have hit 130k on BAT.
That is a good question. I'd say that the M3 is more rare yet BaT did get $310k for that one 240Z.
I'm sure they made fewer E30 M3s overall, but the 240Z is significantly older and from a time when cars rusted a lot more, so there aren't as many left in nice shape. It was also a car that "would never be worth anything", whereas E30 M3s bottomed out on depreciation fairly quickly.
The list of once reasonable cars I will now never own grows even larger.
Mad to think that theese were a pretty common trackday and racing tool among enthusiasts when i started this in the early 2000s.many of them with engines tuned to the moon. Now they are all dead, as most air cooled 911s etc. By dead I mean just sitting in garages and collecting dust in orginal condition, not part of the community anymore.
In reply to Pete. (l33t FS) :
My point exactly. Agreed.
In reply to Cedricn :
True!
On the other hand, there is one other 80's DTM hero still cheap enough to be raced/driven/enjoyed.
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/m3-killer-could-have-been/
In reply to CrustyRedXpress (Forum Supporter) :
Whatch out. 2.3-16s are climbing up in price without many people noticing.
Slippery (Forum Supporter) said:In reply to CrustyRedXpress (Forum Supporter) :
Whatch out. 2.3-16s are climbing up in price without many people noticing.
Those were super-cheap at one point, too.
CrustyRedXpress (Forum Supporter) said:In reply to Cedricn :
True!
On the other hand, there is one other 80's DTM hero still cheap enough to be raced/driven/enjoyed.
https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/m3-killer-could-have-been/
Yeah, there were definitely less of those on the tracks, they didn't have the same aftermarket support or street cred, which shows up in the current pricing. Probably good cars though, but that is seldom enough for a high price today :)
dyintorace (Forum Supporter) said:Sold my '88 with 105k in 2003 for $12k.
I remember those days. My ex- still had her '97 M3 and the idea of an E30 M3 was almost doable. We'd see affordable examples for sale in Roundel and other places. Part of me wishes I'd bought one but then I remember how much I like how an E30 looks much more than how they drive, having owned an '88 325is since that time.
Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:dyintorace (Forum Supporter) said:Sold my '88 with 105k in 2003 for $12k.
I remember those days. My ex- still had her '97 M3 and the idea of an E30 M3 was almost doable. We'd see affordable examples for sale in Roundel and other places. Part of me wishes I'd bought one but then I remember how much I like how an E30 looks much more than how they drive, having owned an '88 325is since that time.
One of my biggest regrets is not buying your '88 325is when you were selling it. You gave it away.
Pete. (l33t FS) said:Slippery (Forum Supporter) said:dean1484 said:This just made clones of that car worth building.
Its not just simple swap of parts to a regular e30. I don't think you can properly clone one for that money.
Almost every body panel is different, including bonded windows for extra rigidity. Suspension, and the engine itself is worth a pretty penny.Yep.... when the E36 M3 came out, people called it, well, "E36 M3", because it wasn't a special model like the E30 M3 was.
It's my understanding that stuffing Z3 suspension bits under an E30 gets you close suspension-wise. The deck becomes tricky, since BMW raised it for aerodynamic reasons (got legal wings/spoilers higher into the airstream?).
The S14 engine holds a special place in my gear-brain, and it's kind of funny that S14 swaps used to be popular in 2002s. Just imagine all the M3s that died to make that possible.
I had one of those s14swapped 2002s for 13 years until I sold it to my son. I had the engine pretty seriously built (214 whp). I've suggested to my son that we do another engine swap & sell the s14 because the engines have gotten so expensive.
In reply to M2Pilot :
That car has to be a right handful like a bucket full of soapy otters.
At this point, what would you even replace it with? It's sort of special in its own right as a vintage swap...
jr02518 said:I think the expression is "well sold".
I have a E30 of a different ilk, mine is a older NASA GT2 build with stock fenders and a M-50 under the hood. No more wheel to wheel for this one, just for weekend drives.
Nice to see its M3 cousins hitting 6 figures.
This is hot. A better photo would be cool.
Pete. (l33t FS) said:In reply to M2Pilot :
That car has to be a right handful like a bucket full of soapy otters.
At this point, what would you even replace it with? It's sort of special in its own right as a vintage swap...
F22C from a Honda S2000 
Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:I remember how much I like how looks much more than how they drive
Most things I flip on BAT can be summed up best by your statement above. You nailed it.
guys sit at home and office and pay us huge money because they are buying with eyes.
Slippery (Forum Supporter) said:Pete. (l33t FS) said:In reply to M2Pilot :
That car has to be a right handful like a bucket full of soapy otters.
At this point, what would you even replace it with? It's sort of special in its own right as a vintage swap...
F22C from a Honda S2000
S54? :)
Slippery (Forum Supporter) said:Pete. (l33t FS) said:In reply to M2Pilot :
That car has to be a right handful like a bucket full of soapy otters.
At this point, what would you even replace it with? It's sort of special in its own right as a vintage swap...
F22C from a Honda S2000
We've been toying with that idea. It's a moderately documented swap & the F22C is a bit like the s14 engine (high reving, not much torque down low, etc.)
In reply to M2Pilot :
The F20C makes more torque than a "torquey" Subaru 2.5l at 2000rpm. No idea what the 2.2l does but it's probably better.
"No low end"...
Pete. (l33t FS) said:In reply to M2Pilot :
The F20C makes more torque than a "torquey" Subaru 2.5l at 2000rpm. No idea what the 2.2l does but it's probably better.
"No low end"...
People love to use the "it's got good low end torque" thing as a way to justify an engine that's a gutless lump. As the graph shows, those are comparably torquey engines, but one falls on its face at high RPM and the other doesn't (and goes on to make far more power).
In reply to Slippery (Forum Supporter) :
Perhaps. To me it was a car that broke damn near every time I drove it... It was broken when I sold it, although Blaze said it was a faulty injector - something he said was a fairly uncommon issue. The E30 was second only to my Cummins for most unreliable vehicle I've owned - and I have a fleet of British cars as well as a VW Mk IV Jetta. I don't seem to have good luck with the "reliable standards"... although I still have plans to install a 12V CTD in my E350 eventually - with hopes that not being installed in a Dodge (and starting with a fresh engine) will improve the situation.
Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:
Part of me wishes I'd bought one but then I remember how much I like how an E30 looks much more than how they drive, having owned an '88 325is since that time.
I actually enjoy driving my wife's E30 318is. It is as stock as I could make it. Just a Conforti chip and a Supersprint muffler. It's not much fun on the highway (I can't believe I used to drive for hours at 80+ mph in the thing) but it's great to buzz around town in. It's so slow I sometimes wonder if something's wrong with it but my daily is a VW Golf Sportwagen making ~320hp so I've probably just forgotten what 'normal' was like 29 years ago.
It's so ridiculously small compared to modern cars. My wife's MINI (!) is shorter but dramatically bigger in all other dimensions. I sure wouldn't want to get into an accident in it though!
The reactions to the car are pretty fun too. A few months ago, two people asked me if it was for sale in the space of 5 minutes.
I was just going to ask, and still might in another post "which box-fendered cars are the cheapest" and it's apparently not the E30 M3.
It would seem if you really wanted a high performing E30 that had the box-flared look and didn't want to ruin the original M3, and 325 with LTO's Widebody kit would be ideal.
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