In reply to Antihero:
While cattle aren't exactly gorillas, I've personally administer Rompun to a ~900 lb bull, at the Vet recommended dose to tranquilize. It's a slow down and eventually fall asleep kind of a reaction that takes a few minutes, not an instant lights out like movies would like you to believe. I'd guess darting it was too risky, and had a real potential to have pissed it off to the point of doing something tragic in the amount of time it took to sedate it.
Being from Cincinnati, and living in southern Dayton, I've been reading A LOT about this. That enclosure has existed since 1978, millions of children and adults pour through it, possibly yearly. One child gets through 4 different layers while the mom, who's in charge of 7 kids that day mind you, and the child had just said he wanted to go in the water (red flag mom! watch your berkeleying kid), and suddenly it's the zoo's fault for not having an idiot-proof system? Mom on her cell phone will just spawn a better idiot.
I don't blame the zoo for shooting the animal. From what I've read, he seemed to be trying to care for it until everyone started screaming and freaking him out. But if he overestimated and did something to cause the kid's death, in front of a live audience, because they hesitated to decide if it was safe? Nope.
That said, mom should be liable. If that kid knocked a $20 plate over in the gift shop and broke it, I'll bet she would be expected to pay. What do you think the street value is for a 17 yr old endangered primate in a large public zoo? "It only takes a second..." Sorry, it took more than a second for him to get thru 4 layers and into that area.
Some E36 M3ty E36 M3 happened, it doesn't deserve 10% of the news coverage or attention it got.
SVreX wrote: In reply to Antihero: Do you think a 400 lb gorilla would need to be enraged to harm a 4 year old child? Those videos look like it was a fortunate accident that he didn't smash the child into a pulp, rip his leg off, or drown him. I don't think intent has anything to do with it (or even if gorillas are capable of intent). The child was in imminent harm.
Lol, gorillas aren't trees or boulders, they can have intent. It's probably not a reasoned well thought out intent but animals are able to act with intent.
From what I read the reason for not tranquilizing him seems to be is they were worried how he would react, he didn't seem agitated.
I'm glad nothing worse happened
In reply to bigdaddylee82:
Interesting, can definitely see why that wouldn't work
In reply to KyAllroad and Nick:
I don't see why me showing some respect to a couple of emergency responders I appreciate should be either volatile or polarizing.
Take a deep breath.
(and don't post in threads that piss you off 
)
Antihero wrote: ... he didn't seem agitated.
Well, the Wildlife expert from Zoo Miami (who owns the animal and loaned it to the Cincinnati Zoo) disagrees with you. He said he was clearly confused and agitated.
I kinda doubt either you nor I know very much about Mountain Gorillas living in captivity. Which is EXACTLY my point. The armchair vets and PETA bleeding hearts calling for the zoo officials heads on poles don't know anything about Mountain Gorillas either. They look at YouTube videos and think they've got it all figured out.
The zoo staff emergency responders are trained professionals. They include handlers, vets, and security personnel who knew this animal personally, and who had trained for every possible scenario. 38 years without an incident. When the time came to make the hard call, they did what they needed to.
I admire them. That is all.
It's absolutely horrible that a woman who was in WAY over her head in terms of watching too many small children caused the death of an endangered animal who is pretty damn high on the food chain.
A lot of the people who scream about accountability don't seem to scream about it in this case.
ooh ooh, i have incendiary comments to add!
i think the zookeeper missed. he should have been aiming for the mom...
im sorry, its your child. you are at a ZOO. if your boy falls into a gorilla pit, you have failed as a parent. there are accidents and then there's negligence. this is CLEARLY in the second category, by a long shot. to make it more fun, the mother works at a daycare. yeah. watching kids, and keeping them safe is her 'JOB'. let that sink in for a minute. i think charges are in order, and the ZOO should sue her. i would. how much does a gorilla go for on ebay these days?
-J0N
I don't fault the zoo employees, they took the only option they had. They said tranquilizing it was likely to agitate it and then it would have killed the kid in the time the tranquilizer took to take effect.
I do fault the mother. She was even quoted at one point as saying "I couldn't be expected to keep my eye on all those children at once." News flash: That's your berkeleying job as a parent, is to watch your children so no harm befalls them. You failed. And it wasn't like the kid hopped a single fence. He had to go through a couple layers of security, so her eye was off him for a good while.
I also hate all these genius PETA people who are using this as more ammo for the "This is why we shouldn't have zoos" agenda. If a lot of these animals weren't in zoos, a good portion of them wouldn't exist anymore, they would be extinct.
Ah, the weekly major rant thread.
People are stupid, and we need to kill dumb, but rate, animals because people are stupid. That's what happened.
be as angry as you want- it's not as if the zoo had a lot of choices dealing with a stupid mom.
And, I'm fine with anyone being judgmental with the guardian. They were over their heads, and should take the brunt of the criticism directed toward them.
BTW, it's funny how people react to fringe groups and how they see the issues... PETA in this case, but many others for other major rants.
Now that precedent has been set - can we shoot all the animals at the zoo? I can't afford to go to Africa then kill and stuff all the creatures I need for my exotic animal themed basement bar - but I can go to Philly or DC. Maybe even the Bronx. I promise to yell "He was comin' right fer us!" first.
can I join the rant as well?
Seems like those without kids know more about being a parent than those with kids.
Fueled by Caffeine wrote: can I join the rant as well? Seems like those without kids know more about being a parent than those with kids.
Throughout history, it's always been the easiest path to criticize without experience. 
Zoo enclosures should be designed such that kids can't get into them.
Anyone who thinks that any parent can keep their eyes on every kid 100% of the time is disillusion.
The Zoo should be applauded for being able to handle that situation before it went badly.
Human life is more important than animal life.
Thane Maynard (director of the zoo) made some sense, and he's also the 90 second naturalist guy http://wvxu.org/programs/90-second-naturalist#stream/0
Bathrooms should be relegated to biological sex
Get offa' my lawn
Can't blame the zoo for killing the gorilla. Not the best solution but a defensible one.
It seems like kids don't know how to avoid obvious dangers these days. I knew not to go near dangerous animals, drink poisons, touch dangerous machines, because my parents beat it into my head at every opportunity. Maybe because they were paranoid. Does it take paranoid parents to raise a kid who won't go play with a gorilla?
In reply to Toyman01:
Oh, that's just wrong
http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/science/2016/05/harambe_s_death_is_not_a_reason_for_moral_outrage_it_s_an_opportunity_to.html
Thats about the right sentiment..
Also, Tuna... not this bathroom crap again.
alfadriver wrote:Fueled by Caffeine wrote: can I join the rant as well? Seems like those without kids know more about being a parent than those with kids.Throughout history, it's always been the easiest path to criticize without experience.
This seems like a fun time to insert this (NSFW LANGUAGE VIDEO) into the thread: https://www.youtube.com/embed/ekoDt_uxb_E
People sure get upset at gorilla shootings easier than people shootings:
http://edition.cnn.com/2016/06/01/opinions/harambe-gorilla-shooting-coates/index.html
In reply to ¯_(ツ)_/¯:
Funny, but label it NSFW please.
In reply to Fueled by Caffeine:
Done, although I'm not sure what you thought you were signing up for when you clicked "play" on the dude with the microphone and the extended middle finger
In reply to ¯_(ツ)_/¯:
I'm at home right now, but for others. I've heard many comedians go off about this subject, it's always funny and mostly right. Still dosen't change my main point. Those without responsibilit for another human's life are very quick to judge those who do.. After kids, i've caught myself thinking about the crap I used to say when I was pre-kids. The dumb stuff I used to say. "I'll never blah blah or That won't be me, or I'll do better with my kids".. I'm my own worst enemy some times.
GameboyRMH wrote: Can't blame the zoo for killing the gorilla. Not the best solution but a defensible one. It seems like kids don't know how to avoid obvious dangers these days. I knew not to go near dangerous animals, drink poisons, touch dangerous machines, because my parents beat it into my head at every opportunity. Maybe because they were paranoid. Does it take paranoid parents to raise a kid who won't go play with a gorilla?
No, it takes something much more spectacular. A parent who can look up from their cell phone and keep track of their spawn. Kid leashes have been around for generations now. Zoos, malls, fairs, that's what they're made for. If you have so many you can't keep track, keep them on a leash or only take as many as you can carry with you at one time.
If these enclosures have kept animals away from people for so many years, we shouldn't need to put animals in bubbles to keep people away from them, which will probably wind up happening from this. When in reality, those ball things from Jurassic world would probably be better all around, trap the people in a safety bubble then we wouldn't even need walls.
Of course, I still firmly believe we should have to get a permit to reproduce but that apparently makes me an even bigger shiny happy person.
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