Ford Vans - Gas vs. Diesel

In my ongoing research into finding a cargo van to replace my aging pickup, I've stumbled across an E350 with 6.0 Powerstroke. I've not really given diesels much though - I don't tow heavy loads or drive tons of miles now, but that could change in a year or 2.

My questions are:

1.) What kind of service and repair, especially major/expensive, does the Powerstroke require. Particularly at around 120kmi.

2.) What is the MPG difference of gas vs. diesel in a full-size van? Do those plug-in diesel "tuners" help MPG much?

3.) Any reasons to avoid diesel and/or the 6.0 Powerstroke? I don't expect this to make much of a financial impact over the life of the vehicle. I'll keep it long enough that resale value will be negligible, I know the cost of gas vs. diesel doesn't offer much savings, and I won't be driving millions of miles to make up the difference. But if it doesn't cost much more over the long run, I might consider it. The price difference between equivalent vans is less than $2k.

Thanks!

6.0l require the EGR recirculation tubes to be replaced early or else the whole thing becomes a big expensive mess. Do that and replace head studs with ARP.

There are some 6.0L Powerstroke Fix Kit that run a grand or so, but installing them will be fun.

7.3L is the better choice, and you'll notice that those vans with the 7.3l sell for higher prices than those with the 6.0.

Personally, I'd go with the gas engine if you think the van will sit more often than not. In my experience (with my Cummins vs. my old 5.0), the gas engine stood up to long periods of inactivity much better than the diesel. I'm sure lots of folks will say I'm full of it, but that's been my experience. My Cummins hated sitting for longer than a few days. I tried to drive it once a week whether I needed it or not, but that just wasn't always practical. My 5.0 could sit for months (and literally often did) and start up like it was last run yesterday.

It may be urban legend, but the 6.0 PS has one of worst reputations of any diesel engine since the old GM 350s.

A good buddy has a landscaping business and he has had numerous Ford diesels. He has had two or three 6.0 liter trucks. Despite the fact that they are older, he prefers the 7.3, much less troubles. My dad has had his 7.3 ('02 Superduty)since new and has never had any trouble.

I will say this: I have driven both gas and diesel ford vans.. the Miliage increase is incredible with the Diesel.. perfect for long distance runs

Diesel usually has a buy in tax attached to it, gas is way cheaper to purchase initially

PHeller wrote: There are some 6.0L Powerstroke Fix Kit that run a grand or so, but installing them will be fun.

The 6.0L can be fixed of its problems, but remember, that job is not much fun in a pickup, it gets much worse in the van (like PHeller mentioned). Seems to be the first step when working on a Ford Diesel van is to remove the body.

I prefer Diesels myself, for the mileage and power, but a gasser will do the job and be a bit cheaper, sometimes a lot cheaper.

I like the 6.0 in my F250. It sits for a couple weeks at a time without any issues.

That said, I'm planning on buying that kit linked above.

Thanks for the tips, I'll pass on this one!

The early 6.0's did have a lot of problems. The EGR system and the head bolts are the two major ones. From my readings, as I have also been looking for a diesel van my self, the later ones such as the 06's have fewer issues. The EGR system was improved and removing the EGR system on a van is not harder then the PU as you can get access to the back of the engine on the van. Also the vans aren't rated as high HP and TQ wise as the PU's. This results in longer life for the head gaskets. It's the guys that installed tuners on their 6.0s to boost power that popped all those head gaskets.

aussiesmg wrote: Diesel usually has a buy in tax attached to it, gas is way cheaper to purchase initially

But resale value will put WAY more money back in your pocket with diesel.

Skip the 6.0L. Its a pile of junk. EGR coolers spring a leak. Best case scenario is an oil change and $1000 worth of parts that probably require removing the engine to install. Worst case scenario is hydrolock and then your only choices is $7000 for a reman engine. Oil coolers are a sandwich style and they are also problematic. They clog and starve the engine of oil. If that happens, see the $7000 comment above.

7.3L is fantastic. You'll go through 3 GPRs in its lifetime ($60 each, half hour to change), one CPS in its lifetime ($200 and an hour and a half to change). Otherwise, change the oil and run the piss out of it. I've had two with zero mechanical failures in a total of about 400k miles.

Tuners will help mileage a wee bit. On the 7.3L in my E350 I get 20+ mpg on the highway and 16-18 in stop and go, completely stock. The first modification though is exhaust and intake along with an EGT gauge. Always do that first or you risk cooking the turbo with tuners. Keep EGT under 1000-1100 degrees F at the up-pipe and you'll be kosher.

For me, its a no-brainer. I can get 20 mpg from a diesel with 3.73 gears and can tow a mountain with the torque. Or, I can get 18 mpg from a V6 and have trouble merging on the highway.

I wouldn't take a 6.0L if you paid me to take it off your hands. Plus, you will not get a resale premium, because everyone hates the 6.0L.

My daily driver is a 7.3L with 435,000 miles on it. My next truck will be another 7.3L.

Not a fan of the 6.0. We have numerous 6.0 engines in our school buses and they have been no end of trouble for us, EGR coolers, injectors, IPR valaves and so forth and so on. They can be made better with mods but not good enough for me. I would take a 7.3 if it was given to me, but would probably buy a gas van if it was my money. The only reason I would consider a diesel van is if I was planning to tow some serious weight.

Planning? No. But extra capacit would be nice, I can't imagine anything I'd want to tow that 7.3 couldn't pull....but I don't need one. Today.

So there's no need to fear chassis problems on 200kmi+ Ford vans? I was worried I'd be swapping every bushing, bearing and seal with that many miles, so I've been skipping over anything with more than 150kmi.

In reply to petegossett:

This one is still available .http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/200x-classifieds/1988-ford-e-350-1500/56302/page1/

In reply to pilotbraden:

I wish his van was about 10-15 years newer, otherwise its what I want.

petegossett wrote: So there's no need to fear chassis problems on 200kmi+ Ford vans? I was worried I'd be swapping every bushing, bearing and seal with that many miles, so I've been skipping over anything with more than 150kmi.

No. Vans are not driven hard. An E-250 chassis is probably not worn out at 200K. My F-250 (which I beat to death) has no suspension wear issues at 450K.

petegossett wrote: Planning? No. But extra capacit would be nice, I can't imagine anything I'd want to tow that 7.3 couldn't pull....but I don't need one. Today.

You don't need the diesel. They are rare, and pricey. Don't worry about it.

The 7.3L will not change the towing capacity of the van, it will simply change the longevity, endurance, and fuel consumption of the engine.

But, if you DO stumble across a 7.3L diesel E-250, let me know. I am in the market for one.

Hey Paul.

http://fortwayne.craigslist.org/cto/3547894229.html

SVreX wrote:

petegossett wrote: So there's no need to fear chassis problems on 200kmi+ Ford vans? I was worried I'd be swapping every bushing, bearing and seal with that many miles, so I've been skipping over anything with more than 150kmi.

No. Vans are not driven hard. An E-250 chassis is probably not worn out at 200K. My F-250 (which I beat to death) has no suspension wear issues at 450K.

Agreed. Many people poo-poo the twin I-beam suspension on the Ford HD trucks. I find them to be incredible. Granted, my current E350 only has 114k, but I finally discovered the first thing that might need to be replaced sometime in the next decade; the sway bar bushings are just starting to show signs of cracking. Kingpins, tie rod ends, and ball joints? fuhgettaboutit. The HD vans have two massive forged steel control arms. The simple fact that they only have a minimum of bushings to start with (and that those bushings are a long way away from the moment of inertia), they are very reliable.

After about 450k (conglomerate) of twin-I beam ownership I will say one thing. Don't cheap out on tires. I always ran Firestone Steeltex R4S, Michelin XPS Rib, Bridgestone Duravis and never had a single issue. My first set of cheapy off-brands are wearing terribly. I posted it on here and everyone came out of the woodwork saying how awful Ford's twin I-beam suspension was and it occurred to me - Don't buy cheap tires.

Four new Bridgestones are on their way as we speak.

I think people poo on the "Twin I beam" swing axles because they're swing axles and have to be treated as such, I.E, keep the ride height correct to maintain proper camber. I see a lot of beat to death ones running around Detroit with broken or just plain worn out springs with about 10* negative camber.