1 2
mtn
mtn MegaDork
2/25/15 1:25 p.m.

I am pretty against Crossfit because

  • I am vehemently anti-cult
  • I find some of their exercises dangerous
  • and having discussed it with RD's and MD's, and doing my own research, I find their dietary advice... not necessarily bad, but there are frequent false negatives.

Now, all that being said, I can't really argue with their results other than the injuries--but I'll take the risk. I want to get in shape again, and frankly I'm so far gone that I need something as intense as Crossfit to at least get the ball rolling.

Then the other thing, I need accountability. If I sign up for a gym, I probably get more useage out of it than most people, but I fizzle out quickly enough. I don't really work out if I don't have a reason. So Crossfit seems like it would be a good fit for me.

So... How do I find a good one? I have no idea what to look for in a strength coach. Also, are there any other programs similar that I should be looking into? Not necessarily stuck on weight lifting or cardio or any particular thing, I just need to do something here.

bluej
bluej UberDork
2/25/15 1:38 p.m.

Gimme a minute, I'll go page just the person to talk to (golfduke).

calteg
calteg Dork
2/25/15 1:40 p.m.

It's the absolutely best way to get in shape while guaranteeing a debilitating back\shoulder injury.

It's far superior to sitting on the couch and hoovering doritos, but it's also far from the pinnacle of workout routines.

mtn
mtn MegaDork
2/25/15 1:51 p.m.
calteg wrote: It's the absolutely best way to get in shape while guaranteeing a debilitating back\shoulder injury. It's far superior to sitting on the couch and hoovering doritos, but it's also far from the pinnacle of workout routines.

What do you suggest?

And no running. I don't run.

calteg
calteg Dork
2/25/15 1:57 p.m.
mtn wrote:
calteg wrote: It's the absolutely best way to get in shape while guaranteeing a debilitating back\shoulder injury. It's far superior to sitting on the couch and hoovering doritos, but it's also far from the pinnacle of workout routines.
What do you suggest? And no running. I don't run.

what is your goal?

weight loss? muscle mass? strength? cardiovascular endurance? aesthetics?

Grtechguy
Grtechguy MegaDork
2/25/15 2:06 p.m.

Watching with interest

mtn
mtn MegaDork
2/25/15 2:13 p.m.
calteg wrote:
mtn wrote:
calteg wrote: It's the absolutely best way to get in shape while guaranteeing a debilitating back\shoulder injury. It's far superior to sitting on the couch and hoovering doritos, but it's also far from the pinnacle of workout routines.
What do you suggest? And no running. I don't run.
what is your goal? weight loss? muscle mass? strength? cardiovascular endurance? aesthetics?

In this order:
1: Fat Loss
2: Strength
3: Cardio

(Lot of space here between 3 and 4)
4: Aesthetics
5: Muscle Mass

In other words, I need to loose fat. I'd like to be stronger, and I'd like better cardio. Aesthetics would improve naturally with fat loss and getting stronger. Don't care much about muscle mass if they aren't strong, but again that is something that increases as strength increases.

Drewsifer
Drewsifer Dork
2/25/15 2:14 p.m.

T25 by Shaun Thompson. I think he's also the guy who created Insanity. All body weight exercises, only takes 25 minutes. It's not going to turn you into Arnold or anything, but I've put a few of my suborbinates on it and seen very positive results. Add in some bike riding for cardio.

Giant Purple Snorklewacker
Giant Purple Snorklewacker MegaDork
2/25/15 2:24 p.m.

Fat loss == eat better

The rest will all be exercise related but being lean and lighter is all about what and how much of it you put in your face. I was maintaining a spare tire while being in good enough shape to run a hilly half marathon at 1:45. When I changed my eating habits (same exercise)... I dropped from a 36 waist to a 32 in 90 days. Mainly by listening to this guy right here... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM and cutting that E36 M3 out where possible. Because if you buy what he is saying it really isn't calories in/calories out if you are ingesting poison as calories. I pretty much only eat water, coffee, lean meats, green veggies, fruit and (unfortunately) beer these days. I do fail miserably on occasion but it's the exception rather than the norm and the results are pretty great.

My advice would be to get a nutrition guy and do regular, easy gym stuff (mixed strength and cardio) until you you are close to goal weight then pick a physical program that will turn you into the sexual tyrannosaurus you want to be. Get in shape to get in shape so to speak.

calteg
calteg Dork
2/25/15 2:25 p.m.

http://stronglifts.com/5x5/

Find a friend or two to go to the gym with you in order to keep your motivation up. Or make friends with someone already at the gym.

mtn wrote:
calteg wrote:
mtn wrote:
calteg wrote: It's the absolutely best way to get in shape while guaranteeing a debilitating back\shoulder injury. It's far superior to sitting on the couch and hoovering doritos, but it's also far from the pinnacle of workout routines.
What do you suggest? And no running. I don't run.
what is your goal? weight loss? muscle mass? strength? cardiovascular endurance? aesthetics?
In this order: 1: Fat Loss 2: Strength 3: Cardio (Lot of space here between 3 and 4) 4: Aesthetics 5: Muscle Mass In other words, I need to loose fat. I'd like to be stronger, and I'd like better cardio. Aesthetics would improve naturally with fat loss and getting stronger. Don't care much about muscle mass if they aren't strong, but again that is something that increases as strength increases.
golfduke
golfduke HalfDork
2/25/15 2:26 p.m.

Pandora's Box :runaway:

This will be a long post. I apologize.

I will preface by saying this- I am a coach and Trainer at a Crossfit "Box". I have my L1 and L2 certifications. I also have a Kinesiology degree and am an accredited NASM/ACSM personal trainer. I am saying this not to brag at all, but to bring light to the fact that 09% of crossfit trainers do NOT have anything more than a weekend long crossfit certification course and $1000 to blow. I'm a black sheep, so to speak.

Before I start, I have heard and seen it all. Crossfit is reckless, dangerous, they do stupid pullups, everyone gets injured, and we're all pissing coca cola. On the other end of the spectrum you get the kool aid drinking 'I LOVE MY BOX' people. Each side is vehemently set in their beliefs and they are both annoying to deal with to be frank.

The truth? Somewhere in between. Crossfit is a multi BILLION dollar COMPANY. Let's get that straight. It is a marketing juggernaut with no signs of slowing down for the forseeable future. The exercize basis that Crossfit patented is not new, unique, or anything special really- Constantly varied movements across broad time and modal domains. What the berkeley does that mean? Basically, it means that the concept of crossfit is to be good at all things, but not excel at one. Varied fitness across all styles- gymnastics, olympic weightlifting, powerlifting, short/long distance cardio, etc... The way that crossfit aims to achieve that is through short, intense workouts that are never repeatable. Different combinations of moves, done in different orders and varying rep schemes for different periods of time. That's the gist of it. I can post a current week of my programming if anyone is interested, but I can assure you- there's nothing too crazy with it.

So you're asking- why the berkeley is it so popular, and why are so amny people paying ungodly amounts of money to put themselves through this? The answer is complex, but it generally falls around this premise- 1) it works. It is the most effective way of getting people fit, fast... that I've ever come across. 2) people by human nature are competitive. Putting others in a class setting, performing against a clock and others on a workout that can be benchmarked for progess over time, is going to push the average person 3x harder than if they were to do the same exact routine at your local Gold's at 6:30 after work. 3) The community, for all the whacked out kool aid Greg Glassman nutswingers, is simply amazing. Everyone is vulnerable, hurting, and thrust into the same thing day in and day out, and that forges EXTREMELY strong friendships.

Personally, I went from 265# and a complete lard-ass to no-question-about-it fittest I've ever been in my life 185# in about a year, just doing 5 days per week of Crossfit classes and not eating like an shiny happy person. It was a complete life transformation that stimulated me to learn EVERYTHING there was/is to know about fitness, go back to school to get a degree/accreditation, and to progress my future life hopefully as a full time trainer of couch potatoes, serious elite athletes, and anyone in between. I would never trade my crossfit experience in for anything in my life save for my son. Period. It's influenced me that much. With that said though, is it the be-all, end all to fitness? Hell no. It is simply an effective means to get and stay fit. You can get the same exact stimulus and resultant response from a variety of other sources and regimens.

So let's address the 'Crossfit causes injury' thing, because frankly it's a disingenuous rallying call for anti-CF'ers to build around. The truth is this- exercise causes injury. Bad trainers cause injury. Bad programming causes injury. People who do not listen to their bodies cause injury. Crossfit does NOT cause injury. There are several videos floating around of crossfit fails and the like, and none of those people should ever be associated with exercise in any mode, let alone crossfit. I have been coaching for almost a year now, and actively crossfitting for 2+. I've never missed more than a maintenance day due to injury. Knock on wood, I've never injured a client. Reckless programming and the 'go harder' mantra end up hurting people. That is why, if you only get 1 thing out of this post,it should be this- it is CRITICAL to find a good, reputable gym with a prudent coaching staff that isn't going to go all Basic Training on you on your first day there. Personally, I do not coach or program a few specific moves that are prevalent in crossfit because I think that they have a higher propensity to injure a novice athlete. Injuring athletes is bad for business. I cannot stress enough that the exercises themselves are completely safe, but the people demonstrating them and the people doing them when they probably shouldn't be is where 99.9999% of injuries occur.

1 other thing about the whole 'crossfit gives you rhabdo' thing too- It's bullE36 M3. Any high volume, eccentric-focused movement has the potential to indust rhabdomyolysis. In fact, the incidence of rhabdo is 15x higher in long distance runners and triathletes than it is in crossfitters, but we don't go around screaming about the safety of those sports...

So here's what I'd do. I'd encourage you to simply check the local places out. If you don't get a warm, fuzzy feeling about the place or the trainer can't be bothered to talk to you, leave and go to another. There are some really amazing crossfit gyms and coaches out there, and it's unfortunate that some of the extreme coaches and poor programming take the attention away from them. I know that for me, it works. I respect others where it might not. All I am saying is that to disregard and group crossfit as dangerous and cult-like is being narrow-minded about it. I'd be happy to help answer any questions that you may have as well specifically.

mtn
mtn MegaDork
2/25/15 2:34 p.m.
Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote: Fat loss == eat better The rest will all be exercise related but being lean and lighter is all about what and how much of it you put in your face. My advice would be to get a nutrition guy and do regular, easy gym stuff (mixed strength and cardio) until you you are close to goal weight then pick a physical program that will turn you into the sexual tyrannosaurus you want to be. Get in shape to get in shape so to speak.

Eh, close enough to goal weight that I can start with the program. I doubt I eat more than 2100 calories a day, including my beer--which I should cut back, or cut out. And my lunches are typically a sandwich, about 2-3 cups of assorted vegetables (celery, sugar snap peas, tomatoes, carrots, and cucumber) and an apple or orange. I think I'm going to start by cutting out the beer.

EDIT: Also, fiance is a Dietitian. So I'm familiar with the nutrition stuff.

fritzsch
fritzsch Dork
2/25/15 2:34 p.m.

golfduke: I don't think there are any Crossfits near me but I am looking to build muscle mass. what would you recommend? Just pick up heavy things and put them back down? Or something like Insanity with body weight?

calteg
calteg Dork
2/25/15 2:36 p.m.

@ golfduke.

Alright, you're a responsible crossfit coach...what are the chances that the OP gets a coach like you when he strolls into the local crossfit box?

The unfortunate truth is this; the same thing that motivates you and keeps you working out (peer pressure) is the same thing that convinces you that straight leg deadlifts for time are a good idea. This ultimately leads to injury far more often than it would for the typical gym rat.

golfduke
golfduke HalfDork
2/25/15 2:48 p.m.

In reply to calteg:

Truthfully, probably 60/40 he finds a decent coach... you are dead right on the second part. Completely. That is precisely why it's not for everyone. If your client/student is incapable of checking their egos at the door, they need to be scaled by weight, time, or both...

Alternatively, new testing has proven that high tempo, moderate weight lifts share no equal with regard to neuroendocrine response in the lifting world. It's obviously saved for more mature lifters, but it does serve a purpose and is part of the reason why you see so many rapid body transformations in crossfit as a result. But yes, I'll agree that it can just as easily cause injury if not monitored closely and shut down soon enough.

calteg
calteg Dork
2/25/15 2:56 p.m.

@ golfduke

That may have been the most concise and polite Crossfit debate I've ever had. Thanks.

FWIW, I'm not a blind hater. I joined a box for 6 months, decided it wasn't for me, and bailed. Both of my best friends are trainers with different boxes in town. Between the 3 of us, we have never seen someone bow out of WOD because it seemed like it had a high chance for injury. Peer pressure is a hell of a thing.

mtn
mtn MegaDork
2/25/15 2:58 p.m.

Thanks Golfduke. And I agree with you on almost everything you've said, which is why I asked the question--how do I find a coach who knows what he/she is talking about?

I still find some of the exercises dangerous, but that comes back on me knowing my limits. Push it to the limit, but be smart enough to know that I have them.

Joe Gearin
Joe Gearin PowerDork
2/25/15 3:04 p.m.

If you haven't been active in a while your metabolism starts to slow down. This becomes much more problematic with age. Once you start exercising again, you body will start to wake up, and it will become easier to motivate. Starting out is the hardest part-- you'll have to have some mental discipline to get progress.

Start by stretching out each morning thoroughly. If you haven't been active in a while, your muscles aren't used to strenuous activity, and you can pull (or tear) muscles easily. Be careful, go slowly and drink lots and lots of water.

Stretching, and doing say 20 or 30 pushups and situps a day can do wonders. Your body will start to "wake up" and you'll have a ton more energy. You'll also lose weight and start feeling better. I'd start to do this before attempting something as strenuous as Cross Fit.

  • 1 on the diet---as you know. Eliminate soda, fast food and junk food.
mtn
mtn MegaDork
2/25/15 3:10 p.m.

FYI, it isn't like I've just been sitting on the couch naked eating cheeto's all day. Prior to the new year, I was playing hockey 2 times a week and reffing hockey about 5 games a week. Since the new year, I've been walking 1 mile a day (to/from train), playing hockey a handful of times outdoors, and then reffing about 1-2 games a week.

So not a rigorous regimen, but not completely listless. I also don't drink pop, don't eat much junk food or fast food (the closest to that I have with any regularity is a hamburger once a week and popcorn almost nightly, but made on the stove), and in general eat healthy.

Joe Gearin
Joe Gearin PowerDork
2/25/15 4:06 p.m.

^^^ Sorry-- didn't mean to suggest that you were a soft, blob-like human. I was speaking from experience, as I hadn't been very active for a few years and recently have taken up playing softball twice a week. As my body wasn't used to strenuous exercise, (but in my head I was still a 14 year old kid) I got hurt a lot. (strained quad, pulled groin, torn calf) I'm finally healed now, but I make sure to stretch very thoroughly before playing.....or I pay the consequences. Granted I'm 45, and my body is more apt to break down now than it used to.

If you've been playing hockey on a semi-regular basis, I'd imagine you'll be fine with whatever you take on. Few things are as physically demanding as competitive hockey.

mtn
mtn MegaDork
2/25/15 4:23 p.m.
Joe Gearin wrote: If you've been playing hockey on a semi-regular basis, I'd imagine you'll be fine with whatever you take on. Few things are as physically demanding as competitive hockey.

Who said anything about competitive? I had a beer last night on the ice

Toyman01
Toyman01 GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
2/25/15 4:50 p.m.
Giant Purple Snorklewacker wrote: ...Mainly by listening to this guy right here... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM and cutting that E36 M3 out where possible. Because if you buy what he is saying it really isn't calories in/calories out if you are ingesting poison as calories...

Wow, that was a very interesting eye opener.

Thanks for posting that.

BradLTL
BradLTL GRM+ Memberand SuperDork
2/25/15 5:06 p.m.

After 15+ years of doing technical consulting and sales at various levels (lots of travel, restaurant food, and sitting at desks and meeting tables) it occurred to me that I had got a bit fat. It was time for me to do something about it. When I stepped on a scale (I didn't actually own one) I weighed a LOT more than I though. I weighed in at 230lbs. I'm 6'3" with a slender build so I hid the weight well, but in truth when I took off my shirt and didn't suck in the gut... we'll I kinda looked pregnant. That's really not a good look for a guy.

I like the concept of Crossfit, but the culture (or cult) didn't appeal to me in anyway. Luckily there are other options. I ended up at IronTribe. It's a similar high intensity, cross training type gym, and yes it does have its own culture (more on this later).

I joined in April of last year. Now, I'm down to 195lbs with less than 12% body fat. My blood pressure is normal, my cholesterol is "ideal". As a whole, I'm stronger, faster, and in every measurable way healthier. Something that isn't measurable, but was identified by my wife is that I'm a lot happier as well. I believe her.

The whole "cult" aspect of it. I think it happens regardless of where you go. If you are consistent, you see the same people, if you go to an instructed program you go through the same pain. It causes you to bond. At some point your friends and loved ones will no longer want to hear about your workout, your soreness, or the joke that is running around the gym currently. You end up wearing the shirts the sell because you start to identify with them, and you are proud of your accomplishments.

The question becomes do you like the people you bond with? That's another thing that I like about IronTribe. It seems we are constantly doing something charitable whether that is supporting curing childhood cancer and supporting the patients (kids), wounded warriors, or building drinking water wells. Part of the culture at IronTribe is to give back.

For me, one of the other turn-offs on Crossfit is the injuries. Google it. I know a handful of people who go to Crossfit, all of them have been injured (including my mother). A friend broke his wrist. In my opinion this comes from the focus on competition where members push themselves harder than they and their bodies can handle; and secondly from how they bring new members in to the gym. Having not done a lot of Olympic weight lifting exercises, I was intimidated by joining. IronTribe made that process a lot easier. For a month (4 weeks), I was not allowed to attend a regular class. I was going through their "101" program. It's only for new members. It's a smaller class, slower and an extreme focus on how to do the exercise correctly without injuring yourself. The classes are taught with PVC pipe and no weight, then the actual workout are smaller reps and small weight. They build your base fitness and understanding and teach you how to go up and VERY IMPORTANTLY scale exercises down to your level.

I've tracked my progress, here's my results:

As others have said, there is more to health that just working out. My wife and I have changed our diets to support our healthier lifestyle. IronTribe preaches paleo, I know some don't agree and that's fine. All I can say is that it works for me.

It all sounds like an ad for IronTribe, and I promise that I am not paid nor receive commission from them (although, I might have to ask about that), but the point of the whole long post is to say....

TL;DR: HIT Cross training works. There are options, find one that matches your personalty.

Fueled by Caffeine
Fueled by Caffeine MegaDork
2/25/15 5:36 p.m.

I would crossfit at a good box (there are some nearby), but the cost is insane. $200-$250/month. I can't justify it.

ProDarwin
ProDarwin UltimaDork
2/25/15 5:50 p.m.

I did crossfit for a while. Good but expensive. You can tell the people who are going to get injured right away. There are those who are uber competitive and let their form go to E36 M3, and there are those who are very focused on form. That's not all there is to it, but its a pretty big factor IMO.

Now I do my own crossfit-style workouts during lunch. Its about a 1.1 mile run to the end of a fitness track across the street. There we will stop and use the bars to do some combination of exercies in a crossfitty manner.

Ex: 5 pullups, 10 pushups, 15 squats - 20 rounds for time
5 muscle ups each minute on the minute for x minutes
10 dips, 10 t2b, 10 burpees - as many rounds as possible in x mins

Sometimes we will do exercises on the way to and from the bars. Today was a 2.2 mile run (there and back), with an interval timer and we had to stop and do 5 burpees each minute on the minute.

Occasionally we'll bring over kettle bells and wall balls, but never olympic weights. I'll do stuff with the bars in my own basement, but I stay away from snatches because I am not comfortable with them.

I guess what I'm saying is: give it a shot and after you do it for a while, do what you are comfortable with on your own.

1 2

You'll need to log in to post.

Our Preferred Partners
kPXxeMeBQHathwRXde3QusN7zkdZCbHf3PGuTw0I0KlML0dvAtdT1pN8RCRnSwbI