New job, major relocation (Nashua, NH), looking for advice

I've grown up and worked in the Louisville, KY area my whole life. Recently, a great opportunity presented itself in Natick, MA. I've accepted a tentative offer and am looking at a large move for my wife, three kids, and myself. While the job is in MA, we are focusing on the Nashua, NH area as far as living goes for a number of reasons. The job is roughly half and half tele-work vs. in office, so the hour commute is not offensive to me on a part time basis.

We currently own (10 years left on mortgage) a small home and will be looking to rent for the short to mid-term once we relocate. Given the market, we will in all probability walk in cash with more than we paid for the house five years ago. My wife and I have already decided to ditch a lot of the "consumable" furniture (chairs and couches specifically) as the space they take up isn't worth it in the moving process. Essentially, we are looking at taking durable furniture (dressers, bed frames, mattresses, tables, etc.) and personal belongings. This will probably be a significant downsizing with respect to what stuff we keep and what we let go.

Having never made a big move like this, I don't really know where to start. We have three cars which we plan to keep and our household goods to move. I'm thinking a rather large U-Haul (20 or 26 ft) would cover us and we'd recruit our family members to help us shuffle it and the cars up there. U-Haul rates are absolutely ridiculous currently, so I am 100% open to other ideas.

If anyone is in or familiar with the Nashua area, I'm looking for location recommendations or ideally a referral on a rental.

Does the move have to be made in 1 trip?

Do you want to sweat for it, or pay someone?

Do you have a tow vehicle?

The cheapest way I've been able to move long distance is to buy an enclosed trailer, move it myself, take several trips, then sell the trailer. 
 

The easiest way to move is to pay someone else. The hardest way to move is to pay someone else. 

I lived in the Boston area about half of my life.  Your estimate for commute time from Nashua to Natick will only be accurate at the lowest traffic times.  You go through several major highway intersections to make that trip, all of which will seriously back up.  There are lots of people commuting into MA from NH and the traffic that goes with it.  
 

What specifically draws you to Nashua?  We might be able to recommend places closer that had similar features.  

For a move that big, it's probably worth paying somebody to move you. If you do this and pre-pack easily portable things you don't want lost or broken, it's good for your peace of mind.

 

In reply to SVreX (Forum Supporter) :

No reason it has to be one trip, just looking to make this as pain free as possible. Given we have lots of family around us currently, we could absolutely store some of the non-essential stuff on a short to mid-term basis and pick it up on a return visit down the road.

We are looking to make this a DIY move, could absolutely pay for it, but don't really want to.

As far as tow vehicle, 01 Tacoma, not exactly the highest tow capacity but would absolutely use the enclosed bed to fill with whatnot.

In reply to Sonic :

Put bluntly, the laws in New Hampshire are more hospitable to things I enjoy that would not be legal or require registration in Massachusetts. Lower overall tax rate is an added bonus. My current commute is 40 to 45 minutes five days a week, a little bit longer commute on a part time basis isn't objectionable to me as it is my time for moments of Zen. I just targeted Nashua because looking at the highway map it looks to be the most direct shot to Natick. If there are "off the beaten path" places along the MA/NH border, we are entirely open to them and would love the suggestions.

When I moved from NY to NM I found AFB U-Pack to be the best balance between cost and convenience. They dropped two tractor trailer trailers in my NY drive way and told me to call them when they were loaded.  I only ended up needing one and that's all they charged me for.  a few days after pickup they dropped the loaded trailer in my NM driveway and told me to call them when it was empty.  I don't remember the cost.  It was more than a rental truck but I thought it was quite reasonable.

I'll second Sonic's commute comments.   I've been doing 50 - 55 miles each way from another town a few miles beyond Natick to the office near Lowell for the better part of 20 years.  Lately with lighter overall traffic it's usually right around an hour.  A year and half ago the same commute was an a hour 10 in the morning and approaching an hour 45 on the way home.  My justification is it's a great company, many of my accounts are in Boston which is easier to get to from where I live and I have a company vehicle.   Previous job was in Boston and it was less mileage / more time all those years ago.

One of my guys lives in Hudson (right next to Nashua) and it can take him close to an hour to get home on Rt 3, roughly 20 mile trip.   Nashua to Natick early AM, probably doable in an hour 20, homeward trip will often suuuuuucccck in my experience especially Thursdays and Fridays in the summer months when many (myself included) from southern New England and beyond are heading to the NH lakes region / mountains and the seacoast of Maine.   There indeed are some really nice towns in NH west of Nashua, the further west the more "old NH" it becomes in my opinion.  That said they're less developed / more rural because there aren't many quick or convenient ways to get from there into the greater Boston area.   You'll be looking at a lot of rural 2 lane roads that are now seeing more traffic than they used to and get quite congested during commuting hours.  Throw some winter weather into the equation and it can be close to impossible.

Not a political statement (we have several people here who may enjoy similar things that made them choose to live in NH so I get it) but your statement on taxes is something I believe you need to do some due diligence on.   If you're working in Natick, Massachusetts will be witholding income tax negating no income tax in NH.   NH does not have a sales tax however the real estate taxes are often significantly more than would be for a similar value home in a comparable town in MA .   (We have a seasonal cottage on a NH lake, the property taxes are basically the same as the year round home in MA that has town water / sewer / trash / schools, etc.   NH town has a fireboat that would keep the rest of the island from burning and basically nothing else for us.)

Good luck, I don't want to dampen the possibility of a new opportunity but you should do some checking.   One more thought, Natick is far closer to Rhode Island than it is to NH so maybe check their rules on the "things" and see if anything is a deal breaker.    The NE corner of RI is very rural and it would be a more doable commute in my opinion.

Edited to add and note that the "humor"  font is on:  the NH state motto is "live free or die".   Several of the guys who currently live in NH have sarcastically suggested the it could as well be "live FEE or die".   The state fees for car / boat registrations, fishing licenses, etc. seem to be a bit more than the similar charges here in MA.  I can speak to the boat registrations; it's just under $60 bucks a year for the 17' whaler and just over $80 a year for the 22' cuddy cabin.  

bigbrainonbrad said:

In reply to Sonic :

Put bluntly, the laws in New Hampshire are more hospitable to things I enjoy that would not be legal or require registration in Massachusetts. Lower overall tax rate is an added bonus. My current commute is 40 to 45 minutes five days a week, a little bit longer commute on a part time basis isn't objectionable to me as it is my time for moments of Zen. I just targeted Nashua because looking at the highway map it looks to be the most direct shot to Natick. If there are "off the beaten path" places along the MA/NH border, we are entirely open to them and would love the suggestions.

Make sure you look up The Free State Project, if you haven't already. 

In reply to 11GTCS :

Taxes - thank you for clarifying with MA withholding. Where I live, KY and IN have an agreement regarding tax collection based on state of residence. I mistakenly assumed this was a standard thing. Was already tracking the SIGNIFICANT property taxes and no sales tax in NH. Now that I have an actual offer, I definitely need to look at everything closer. As always, this board is a great wealth of knowledge.

Not quite sure I follow the taxes conversation here. Does this mean that if you work in MA, MA taxes are withheld... But does he actually owe MA taxes? Would he have to claw them back, because presumably he'd owe them in NH? 

In reply to mtn :

Looks like MA collects income taxes on non-residents. NH has no income taxes, but I would have to file a MA income tax return.

bigbrainonbrad said:

In reply to mtn :

Looks like MA collects income taxes on non-residents. NH has no income taxes, but I would have to file a MA income tax return.

Exactly correct.  As mentioned a number of our guys live in NH and are required to pay MA state income tax as a result of us being a MA business / office in MA.  The state of NH is presently engaged in some type of litigation with MA related to people working from home during Covid times should be exempt since they did the work in NH.   Recent reports I've read is that the the rulings will likely follow the precedent of MA employer / MA taxes that they agreed to be employed under.

ABF is easy to deal with.  I've got my things in U-Pack Relo Cubes still (UGH) while I've been living in a hotel.  You have to pay storage on them per month but they just sit in a warehouse somewhere while you look for where you'll live if you need to go this way.  It's made my life pretty easy knowing they're locked up, I have the keys, nobody else goes through them to load and unload in/out of a warehouse.

I wouldn't want a commute anywhere near that long on a daily basis.  I hated the times I've had commutes that got near an hour each way.  And if they're going to tax you like you're living in MA anyway I would just live there.  Drive over the boarder for whatever you miss in NH for the once in a while it actually matters.

My 2 cents, do whatever.

I believe the income tax only applies to what you earn while working in Mass, or at least that was how it used to be handled. So you could end up paying mass income tax on every dollar earned during the year, and then get a refund when filing to recover taxes paid on the earnings from days you were working remote in NH. 

YMMV: That may have changed since I last had any involvement with that ( over 10yrs)

As for other things that may steer you towards NH. While Mass does require CC permits and FIDs, I have not had any issues with the process and have not had to fill out any additional paperwork beyond the process to get the permit. BUT....if you were to move  into Mass, check on specific towns to see how they operate. The local chief can make things difficult for CC permits in certain towns and cities. 

Wow - that’s a move !

Louisville, KY to the Boston Metro Area. Working in Natick - US ARIEM perhaps?

Full Disclosure: I was born in Boston in lived half my life in MA, RI & CT. The other half (while I was in the US and not in other countries) was spent in Southern States near large Army posts. I actually spent a few years in the Louisville area in the 80’s. I’ve lived in 12 US states for the military and jobs after so I'm somewhat familiar with relocation.

Few points:

• Traffic is horrible and Google travel times are optimistic. Picture Atlanta traffic w/ angry and unfriendly people.
• Don’t go to Rhode Island, they are rated worst roads in the US and that’s being generous.
• Winter weather makes all the above worse. And just think, dark at 4pm in January.
• You know New Hamster touches Canada right?
• All the Northern States (NH, MA, RI, CT, Etc…) have high taxes, and fees for everything. It’s expensive to live in the Northeast and there really no dodging that.
• Southern NH is full of Ex-Bostonians. The “New Hampshire are more hospitable to things I enjoy” is more Northern NH starting maybe around Concord?
• Generally there has been an out migration from Northern states (BC - before Covid) to Southern states and that has only increased. Northern states tend to just swap people and grow from immigration. I met maybe 8-10 people from South, Midwest, Left Coast in my whole life, who moved to New England. All that I kept up with, did not stay.
• Talking about renting U-Hauls? If your taking job and your not getting relocation assistance from you new employer - then its not the kind of job you move half across the US for.
• And don't forget that famous Massachusets Attitude. Its not everyone but its a real thing.

Besides the obvious like Commute Time and Taxes I would urge you to consider the Political and Sociological ramifications of a move like this. Louisville and Boston are just about as different as you could imagine. You might feel like you moved to another country, not another state.

NH, the land of "Low taxes unless you look and we replaced a lot of taxes with fees"

Nashua is on the come up, which is a good thing. Also means you'll be paying a lot for what you get. I'm 30 minutes further north and used to commute to Quincy and... I didn't like it. If it's only commuting half time though you could probably get some good podcasts going and it will be OK. 

MA collects income tax on income earned while physically in the state, which the pandemic and work from home has made odd. I never had any problem filing my taxes and only paying income tax on what I earned while physically in the state. 

Regarding "Generally there has been an out migration from Northern states (BC - before Covid) to Southern states and that has only increased."
That's old people. Old people move south out of New England. 

Lots of racing opportunities within a couple hours of Nashua though. 

You should be able to deduct moving expenses from your income taxes since this is a move for employment. I did when I moved back to Vermont from Georgia.

You are looking at a two hour commute during peak hours of 6:00am to 9:30am. And 3:30-7:00 pm. I would look as close to the ma/nh border and you may save 15 min or so.  I would never want that commute. It would be horrible. 

I have spent a fair amount of time in southern NH (Portsmouth area) for work and will agree with previous comments. 

My version, "Live Free or Die - MY ASS".  At least compared to living in PA.  Man, they have a lot of odd rules. The fees and land taxes are substantial. 

House prices in southern NH are eye-watering.  Since I was working a lot in NH, I would occasionally look at houses to consider relocating.  A small, 600 sqr ft, 2 BR/1BA house on a lot similar to mine is roughly 2x the cost (saw few under $300K). The only properties I could find that were somewhat affordable were about an hour drive from Portsmouth. And this was a few years ago before housing market went nuts.  As mentioned, Nashua is full of MA commuters.  

When I was living up there, I quickly learned where/how to route and time my travels to avoid the vacation traffic, which cannot be understated. I-95 through NH is about 12 miles long and 6 lanes wide. On a Friday evening during the Summer, it often turns into a parking lot.  On one particular day I was driving home to PA, I was on I495 going south and the northbound traffic was backed up from Worcester to the 95 merge. That's about 50 MILES. I sh1t you not.  The traffic on Rt 3 and I-91 is similar. 

Winter is real in New England. Salt use is big.  Some folks still have "winter" (sacrificial) cars and "summer" (nice) cars up there.

Compared to KY, the COL increase will be pretty big.  I hope you're getting a BIG salary increase.

I really do like NH and New England in general, but after spending a fair amount of time there, my desire to more there is pretty much at zero.

You couldn't pay me enough to do that commute.  Nashua to Natick is going to blow serious chunks with traffic, any kind of weather or accidents.  As pointed out you won't be getting any tax savings.  I lived in the Boston area for 12 years and the traffic back then was horrendous, it hasn't gotten any better in the years since.

Do yourself a huge favor and live as close to work as you can.

In reply to GM > MG :

Not RIEM, TACOM. Currently a contractor, this is a civilian position. No relocation funds authorized. While I have enjoyed my current job for the last 10 years, I have gone about as far as I can within my fairly specialized realm. I don't check any of the right boxes so no preference for me. TACOM does direct hires based on merit for this position so I got an offer.

Someone else mentioned salary increase, I essentially will be getting the same pay once cost of living is accounted for. After reading some of this last night and stepping back from the situation, I realized I was looking at this move as a lifelong decision; whereas the reality of the situation is it can/could be a mid-term decision. I get there like the job and decide it is what I want to do for the next 20 years, then I really sit down and think about where in the area I want to live. On the flip side, I move there put in my time, find another civilian position in a different place and move on. We've settled on living in MA, probably the Shrewsbury area as the commute seems entirely reasonable. I can go through the process of getting a FID and registering the funs, or I can just leave them here and enjoy them when I visit home.

If I was going to work in Natick, I would live no further away than Marlboro. Natick to Nashua is a long trip on a good day, so consider a bad one -  a Nor'Easter has just come in and I-495 is closed after a crash. 

As for the funs. I have lived in MA my whole life and hunt and fish. I've only ever registered vehicles. I have done the proper paperwork for other "fun" purchases, but unless I missed something there is no requirement for providing any list to the state or town. 
 

Shrewsbury is a nice town, good schools, plenty of restaurants, and close to outdoor activities.
 

Shrewsbury is getting expensive for real estate, so you may want to look around that area. If you consider a bit outside of that area including Boylston, Holden, Grafton, Northborough and other areas in that general area you may be able to save some money and still be close to everything. 
 

In edit: If you want more rural, looking a bit further west into Spencer, charlton, and Leicester. They add some miles to the commute, but should be low traffic until you get inside 495 on the pike. 

I think we are on our 8th (9th?) home all due to corporate moves, so we've probably done this more than 99% of the population.   As much of a sellers market it is currently in most fields, is there an opportunity to include some relocation money in the package?  Whether that be a lump sum (do it as you wish) or a typical relocation package (or a part of one)?   Lump sum relo assistance is becoming pretty common even at less than management positions.  If they want you, they aren't going to lose you over $10 or $15k (even better if they gross it up).

Moving is always a good time to purge.  Hopefully, we'll only do this once (or twice) more and then we can settle into a much smaller right sized home for the two of us (with a big shop).  It you are doing it yourself, I'd vote to purge any of the disposable flat-pack furniture that everyone accumulates over time, but is more or less worthless.  Easier to just toss donate it and rebuy new.

If you are doing this move on your own (no relocation $ help) keep track of EVERYTHING related to the move.  Meals, mileage, etc. and get a good tax guy/gal next year.  It always befuddles me what is / isn't tax deductible, as I look through what the company did / didn't gross-up on my moves.

Good luck!