Does anybody here have proof that the protesters are collecting unemployment?
Does anybody here have proof that the protesters are collecting unemployment?
I don't care if they're collecting unemployment, so no.
Snowdoggie wrote: Does anybody here have proof that the protesters are collecting unemployment?
No, I readily admit it was an assumption but it's a hell of a way to burn your vacation time if you are employed and I have more respect for those who are doing that.
But can we realistically believe everyone there is just on time off from their jobs? If they are not then are they living off and inheritance? mom and dad's money? probably safe to say its not off their big Wall Street stock portfolio.....
Otto Maddox wrote: In reply to JThw8: Most businesses here pay less than 1% of the first $7K of each worker's salary for unemployment taxes. So, if an business has a typical unemployment tax rate of 0.5% and the worker makes $35K, the employer is paying an effective unemployment tax rate of 0.1% on that employee. Yes, 1/10 of a percent. I haven't done an unemployment tax return in a few years, so I could be a little off. In sum, "b" is pretty much impossible.
Again my apologies, I pay 35%+ of my paycheck in taxes, which you are correct only a small portion of which has anything to do with unemployment. It does not change the fact that you should, while on unemployment, be working towards gaining employment, not camping out on wall street. And by should, I mean as a productive member of society with an ounce of self pride and work ethic, not necessarily that the government or unemployment office compels you to do so.
JThw8 wrote:Snowdoggie wrote: Does anybody here have proof that the protesters are collecting unemployment?No, I readily admit it was an assumption but it's a hell of a way to burn your vacation time if you are employed and I have more respect for those who are doing that. But can we realistically believe everyone there is just on time off from their jobs? If they are not then are they living off and inheritance? mom and dad's money? probably safe to say its not off their big Wall Street stock portfolio.....
Don't be to sure. A lot of rich kids go communist as a way to rebel against Mom and Dad.
JThw8 wrote: And by should, I mean as a productive member of society with an ounce of self pride and work ethic, not necessarily that the government or unemployment office compels you to do so.
Ha. You act like those values exist in this day in time....
In reply to JThw8:
As if you don't already know this, the world today is vastly different than it was when you were growing up. If you try to do exactly what your dad did to get by in 2011, you could end up losing everything you own.
http://www.epa.gov/lead/pubs/renovation.htm
I'm sure your dad also didn't grow up in a culture where he was told by EVERY authority figure for the first 20+ years of his life that doing well in school and graduating from a good college was the number one most important thing he could do to be a valued, productive member of society and to provide for his future. Fat lot of good all that's done me. I also had the privilege of paying about 5x as much in constant dollars for my education than my father did, and I had partial scholarships/grants that many don't. I'm a very dedicated, productive worker when I get the opportunity, but you can't just keep on berating people for failing to have those opportunities. I have plenty of practical knowledge of "real" work (machine shop, welding, woodwoorking), but since I learned everything I know working in student shops in college, I don't have any certifications or work experience that will allow me to actually use those skills professionally. And no office job I've had has given two E36 M3s that I know my way around a shop.
BTW, a HUGE portion of those people attending these protests are college graduates who can't find a job, and are thus ineligible for any sort of unemployment assistance because they haven't yet had the opportunity to pay into the system, so your money is not being wasted on a large proportion of them. It's not a bunch of people begging for a handout, it's people asking for an opportunity to be productive. Not only is our government failing to create opportunities, they're actively working against it by fostering a financial system where banks and corporations can make money by just by asking for it (quite literally in the case of banks that borrow from the fed at near zero rates and lend it back to the treasury at much higher rates). Why would a bank give a loan to a man who needs the capital to start a small business or hire more workers to grow his when they can rake in billions without taking those risks? That's the sort of thing that needs to end.
And how much of that HUGE portion have degrees in ridiculous studies that gaurantee a job future doing menial retail work?
Cause I hate to break it to you, but colleges nowadays are glorified babysitting services, and the kind of moron who goes and expects a 120k salary with their womens studies degree is going to be in for a well deserved shock.
Josh wrote: Not only is our government failing to create opportunities, they're actively working against it by fostering a financial system where banks and corporations can make money by just by asking for it (quite literally in the case of banks that borrow from the fed at near zero rates and lend it back to the treasury at much higher rates). Why would a bank give a loan to a man who needs the capital to start a small business or hire more workers to grow his when they can rake in billions without taking those risks? That's the sort of thing that needs to end.
This is why the protest should be on Pennsylvania Avenue, not on Wall Street.
Obama had a chance to REALLY change things. Instead, he hired Bernanke and Geitner, doubled down on the bailouts, and commited to business as usual.
Grizz wrote: And how much of that HUGE portion have degrees in ridiculous studies that gaurantee a job future doing menial retail work? Cause I hate to break it to you, but colleges nowadays are glorified babysitting services, and the kind of moron who goes and expects a 120k salary with their womens studies degree is going to be in for a well deserved shock.
Something something beggars something something choosers...
Grizz wrote: And how much of that HUGE portion have degrees in ridiculous studies that gaurantee a job future doing menial retail work? Cause I hate to break it to you, but colleges nowadays are glorified babysitting services, and the kind of moron who goes and expects a 120k salary with their womens studies degree is going to be in for a well deserved shock.
It isn't just graduates with "useless" degrees that can't get jobs. I know many many people who have just graduated with an engineering degree who are really struggling to find a job. Most of them are working at restaurants and other places to make it by while searching for an engineering job. I will agree I know lots of people who went and got a degree in things like theatre and women studies and etc. (that pretty much mean they will never have a decent job) but it isn't just these people who can't find jobs. I got so lucky to find my job. And I don't know how you figure colleges are glorified baby sitting services. 
DILYSI Dave wrote: Obama had a chance to REALLY change things. Instead, he hired Bernanke and Geitner, doubled down on the bailouts, and commited to business as usual.
Not going to disagree with that, but what we did learn from the whole thing is who's really in charge regardless of the name on the desk in the oval office. That's why the protests are where they are.
93EXCivic wrote: It isn't just graduates with "useless" degrees that can't get jobs. I know many many people who have just graduated with an engineering degree who are really struggling to find a job. Most of them are working at restaurants and other places to make it by while searching for an engineering job. I will agree I know lots of people who went and got a degree in things like theatre and women studies and etc. (that pretty much mean they will never have a decent job) but it isn't just these people who can't find jobs. I got so lucky to find my job. And I don't know how you figure colleges are glorified baby sitting services.
Colleges are glorified babysitting services because highschools(and everyone else for that matter) push kids into going there, with no real idea of what they want to do, and a list of do nothing classes and degrees that are a massive waste of time. Plus, the stuff they keep pushing people into(this is true of tech schools as well) is mostly computer related, and that market has a ridiculous turnover rate and is already flooded.
Added point, you know why plenty of college graduates can't find a job? It's because most employers see a degree(In an actual field of course) and think the person is just going to move on once they find a job related to it. I had to take the HVAC stuff off applications to get jobs at warehouses and the like. A degree or training is only helpful in the field it's related too, not so much any where else.
Grizz wrote: And how much of that HUGE portion have degrees in ridiculous studies that gaurantee a job future doing menial retail work? Cause I hate to break it to you, but colleges nowadays are glorified babysitting services, and the kind of moron who goes and expects a 120k salary with their womens studies degree is going to be in for a well deserved shock.
This would be laughable if it weren't so insulting and typical of the people who don't get what the protests are all about. Almost nobody goes into known low paying fields expecting to be wealthy at the end. Students know they're not going to get rich off their social work degree, maybe they do it because they have a conscience and want to help people (what idiots, right?). What fits your definition of a useless degree, anyway? Only about 50% of law grads are able to find jobs in their field right now. What about architecture, education, structural/civil engineering, construction management, IT, sciences... the list goes on. There really hasn't been anything an 18 year old could have chosen for a career in recent history that has any sort of security or guarantee of a job, aside from signing up to be sacrificed in wars that a majority of us don't believe in.
Josh wrote: This would be laughable if it weren't so insulting and typical of the people who don't get what the protests are all about. Almost nobody goes into known low paying fields expecting to be wealthy at the end. Students know they're not going to get rich off their social work degree, maybe they do it because they have a conscience and want to help people (what idiots, right?).
Idiots for wanting to help people? No.
Idiots for taking on a debt load with no realistic expectation of being able to service that debt? Yes.
my notebook page would say:
I AM A PRODUCER!
Grizz wrote:93EXCivic wrote: It isn't just graduates with "useless" degrees that can't get jobs. I know many many people who have just graduated with an engineering degree who are really struggling to find a job. Most of them are working at restaurants and other places to make it by while searching for an engineering job. I will agree I know lots of people who went and got a degree in things like theatre and women studies and etc. (that pretty much mean they will never have a decent job) but it isn't just these people who can't find jobs. I got so lucky to find my job. And I don't know how you figure colleges are glorified baby sitting services.Colleges are glorified babysitting services because highschools(and everyone else for that matter) push kids into going there, with no real idea of what they want to do, and a list of do nothing classes and degrees that are a massive waste of time. Plus, the stuff they keep pushing people into(this is true of tech schools as well) is mostly computer related, and that market has a ridiculous turnover rate and is already flooded.\
This I agree with. If I had a dollar for every friend of mine from high school that decided to go into theatre or political science or women studies or etc I would be a rich man. I told all of them, "you will be broke and unemployed or working a E36 M3ty job when you graduate." They all told me either no we won't or I will figure it out when I get there. I think there is a time and place for college but everyone says you have to get college degree and then you add the ever rising price of education, it is really no wonder a lot of people are in debt and pissed off. Not saying I agree with all of them. I think a lot of people should have thought before they chose their degree. There are plenty of people with degrees in technical fields (engineering, science, etc) that don't have jobs. They are smart people who can contribute to society but instead of the government encouraging development in those areas, they see them bailing out the banks.
Also - Someone should have told the chick above when she was in high school that you don't need to spend $35k to dive muff.
Grizz wrote: A degree or training is only helpful in the field it's related too, not so much any where else.
I have to disagree. While I work in the field of my degree, many of my friends and coworkers have degrees unrelated to their careers, and they definitely had their educations on their resumes. Some employers regard a degree as indication of the ability to finish an extended undertaking, of the ability to assimilate and organize large amounts of information, and of the ability to communicate that information. Proof, no, but an indication. It can help to get a foot in the door.
It depends on the type of disconnect. Art History or English looking for a job in project management? Dandy! Computer Science degree looking to turn wrenches, not so much (this one I tried myself), and I think this was exactly what you're referring to; I was genuinely conflicted about which way to go, but I think they assumed I'd vanish as soon as I could find a development job. But it's not universal, and I think the degrees people are most down on in terms of "why'd you go get that useless thing?" are the most adaptable degrees, if for no other reason than even if your English degreed applicant was going to run out and take the first tenure-track teaching job that came up, that would still give you a 0.0003% chance of losing them.
Josh wrote: This would be laughable if it weren't so insulting and typical of the people who don't get what the protests are all about.
I get exactly what the protests are about, young people think their lives suck, and since they fully expect the government to solve all their problems(without realizing that the govt is the root cause of all their problems) they can't bitch at them, they go with the old standby of people who have more than they do. I've been unemployed for six years with a berkeleyed up knee and no real income whatsoever, do you see me costing the state millions of dollars standing around and crying about those evil bankers and corporate bigwigs who, hand in hand with the federal government, have sent this country to hell in a handbasket? No, I do whatever I can to make what little money I get, and I actually live within my berkeleying means.
Josh wrote: Almost nobody goes into known low paying fields expecting to be wealthy at the end. Students know they're not going to get rich off their social work degree, maybe they do it because they have a conscience and want to help people (what idiots, right?).
Yes, they are idiots.
Josh wrote: What fits your definition of a useless degree, anyway?
Womens studies, African studies, basically all the idiotic PC feel good classes put in place since the 70s.
Josh wrote: Only about 50% of law grads are able to find jobs in their field right now. What about architecture, education, structural/civil engineering, construction management, IT, sciences... the list goes on.
And? Where did I say you had to find a job in your field? I said people who get a degree in fields that have NEVER had work are stupid, not fields that don't have work right now.
Josh wrote: There really hasn't been anything an 18 year old could have chosen for a career in recent history that has any sort of security or guarantee of a job, aside from signing up to be sacrificed in wars that a majority of us don't believe in.
BullE36 M3, get a forklift cert, CDL, learn a trade and you'll never be out of work. The only reason I'm not still doing HVAC work is because of my knee. A willingness to do any berkeleying job there is will get you farther in life than a peice of paper ever will.
DILYSI Dave wrote: Also - Someone should have told the chick above when she was in high school that you don't need to spend $35k to dive muff.
I don't think that's a chick...
JThw8 wrote: So while the Occupy groups may have some valid issues they need to get to work, if they work hard enough they too could be part of that 1% they hate so much.
You are aware this is the GRM board? I think it is safe to assume ALL of us on here are not the 1%. So by your logic EVERYBODY on here did not work hard enough because we are not the 1%?
I also think it is safe to assume that most or all of us will never be in that 1%. So why are so many of you fighting for them? (You do realize that the 1% has already bought lobbyist and politicians to fight for them, right?) Don't worry about them, they are doing just fine without you.
Maybe some people go to school to be or take jobs that are enough to take care of themselves and their families or to satisfy their moral needs? Not everybody wants to be a multi-millionaire. Maybe we aren't all capitalistic greedy pigs?
The middle class complains that the poor are stealing pennies from them not noticing that the rich continue to steal dollars.
Josh wrote: This would be laughable if it weren't so insulting and typical of the people who don't get what the protests are all about. Almost nobody goes into known low paying fields expecting to be wealthy at the end. Students know they're not going to get rich off their social work degree, maybe they do it because they have a conscience and want to help people (what idiots, right?). What fits your definition of a useless degree, anyway? Only about 50% of law grads are able to find jobs in their field right now. What about architecture, education, structural/civil engineering, construction management, IT, sciences... the list goes on. There really hasn't been anything an 18 year old could have chosen for a career in recent history that has any sort of security or guarantee of a job, aside from signing up to be sacrificed in wars that a majority of us don't believe in.
I understand what you are saying. I think why people are having such a negative reaction is that many of the images show people who have got themselves so far into debt while perusing a degree in liberal arts which for the most part are either going to be very lower paying job or there are no jobs available. I agree that there aren't many jobs which have any sort of job security the point is that there are some degrees which have no job market and haven't had a job market. Also many of the people (that are being shown) went to private colleges that cost a lot of money rather then chosing a college they could afford.
Edit: I still don't know what the point of these protests are. They do just seem to be lots of people pissed because the rich have money. I mean I understand why people are pissed off but why aren't they trying to find some kinda job.
ok, i'm too lazy to read the definitions of the percentages. where's the line between the righteously underappreciated 99% and the evil 1%? i need to know how far i am from my goal...
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