RV, TT, Toy Haulers ect...

I have been researching this for a while, I found some great threads. Why? I would like to bring my family to the Track, but the days of a bag of potato chips, water, beer, and sleeping in the back of a hatchback are not going to cut it for them. Maybe on occasion a campsite. It would be my wife and 3 children under 5 years old. I am looking for something that can accommodate race karts but also do the crapcan Endurance race, I just rent so sleeping arrangements work. Tow duty would be a newer Cx5 and Cx9 towing capacity is 2000lbs and 3500lbs, hitches are rated for 4500lbs, there are defiantly limitations. Most tracks have bathrooms and showers except for Nelson Ledges, at the same time they are at the age were a adult has to take them to the bathroom. I bought my daughter a kart, not sure if she will get interested but I have two other children. So when I look around the paddock nobody has a pop-camper (RV’s, toy trailer and general enclosed trailer), but a GRM member made a Kart Pop-up, not sure if this would work, with two karts. On Facebook I found another interesting setup which is an open trailer with a pop-up camper on it with room to store the toys on the outside. My other thought is just to use RVshare and rent. Atleast at first the only negative I see is that the pricing looks to be cheap but looking at a 2 night stay $75 for the cheapest trailer but then there is the Taxes and destination fee, after that you are looking at $450, plus camping fee if it applies to the track, which it’s pricing you out to a nice hotel or B&B with a pool. I put together Pro’s and Con’s just wondering if I am missing anything?

Pop-Up Camper

Pro’s:

• Easiest to tow out all the trailers
• Lowest maintenance
• Plentiful

Con’s

• All that I have enquired about need some leak prevention work
• No bathroom
• Smallest of space
• Not built to hall a kart

Motorhome 

Pro’s:

• You can move throughout the cab
• Can tow a trailer behind for race car/kart.
• Bathroom

Con’s

• Maintenance
• If you break down, few have the parts to fix it
• They are like Race cars and Boats where you spend lots of money and are hard to sell.

RV Conversions Ambulances/Sprinters/Box trucks

Pro’s

• You can move throughout the cab
• You can design it the way you want it, it can tow are you can make it into a toy hauler

Con’s

• Some of the pre-built ones can be scary
• Another vehicle that needs maintenance, insured, registered.

Travel Trailer

Pro’s

• Come in a variety of different sizes
• Less maintenance then a RV.
• Bathroom

Con’s

• Unless it’s a toy hauler no room for Kart or Race car.
• Limited to the Cx-9, but best hauled by a truck with towing capacity

RV Share

Pro’s

• Lots of selection
• You do not have to maintain it, store it, insure it, own it or license it.

Con’s

• Lot’s of fees and for the cost you can stay in a nice hotel
• I have attempted in the past to book one and the Holidays are extremely difficult and if you are trying to book one a week in advance I haven’t had any luck.

Great source for Pop-Up campers

Great Source between RV, TT, Toy Haulers , Trailer living quarters, grassroots style

The worst thing about a pop up is you cannot leave it preloaded usually. We keep our bus stocked with the bed made, the cupboards full of food and kitchenware and clothes in the closet. It takes a depressing amount of time from your short weekend loading and unloading (when all you want to do is sit back with a cold one) otherwise.

I love JThw8, but the pop up is a stupid idea. Especially if you try to fit 2 inside.

My thoughts interjected in bold.  In the interest of brevity, I'm being blunt and very general.  YMMV and all that.

trigun7469 said:

Pop-Up Camper

Pro’s:

• Easiest to tow out all the trailers Yes and no.  They tend to be short, and unless you're careful, a bit light on the tongue.
• Lowest maintenance   Possibly, but not always.  They are a tent.  The constant up/down and folding/creasing of the fabric means that they will leak, and usually very quickly.  You also have the potential of having to pack up wet, which means you have to get it home, set it up again until it dries, then fold it up again.  Crank systems for the up/down (depending on brand) tend to be a frequent failure point.
• Plentiful  Agreed... usually because of the above.  People buy them as a beginner RV, end up not liking them, and sell them after a couple seasons.

Con’s

• All that I have enquired about need some leak prevention work  If they have already leaked, it's a non-starter for me.
• No bathroom  Some have small bathrooms that are basically a E36 M3 briefcase (porta potti) and a shower curtain
• Smallest of space
• Not built to hall a kart

 

RV - I'll assume you're talking about motorhomes

 

Pro’s:

• You can move throughout the cab  Everybody always lists this as a Pro.  I don't get it.  The number of times you use this feature will likely number in the single digits over the lifetime of the motorhome.  Everyone always talks about being able to use the bathroom without stopping.  I personally don't like pee splashing up on my bum.  I think the first time you try making a PB&J while on the road will be your last after spilling grape jelly all over the counter or the floor.
• Can tow a trailer behind for race car/kart.
• Bathroom

Con’s

• Maintenance  Also, you will be registering and insuring a motor vehicle.  Not a huge cost, but you'll be buying and maintaining a motor vehicle that sits idle 90% of its life
• If you break down, few have the parts to fix it  Just buy smart.  Nearly all motorhomes are built on common Chevy and Ford van/truck platforms.
• They are like Race cars and Boats where you spend lots of money and are hard to sell.
• One more con... once you get to your destination and level it, hook up water, electric, and sewer, and put out the awning, you're stuck there unless you want to continually repeat the setup/teardown process.

 

RV Conversions Ambulances/Sprinters/Box trucks

 

Pro’s

• You can move throughout the cab  
• You can design it the way you want it, it can tow are you can make it into a toy hauler

Con’s

• Some of the pre-built ones can be scary
• Another vehicle that needs maintenance, insured, registered.

 

Travel Trailer

 

Pro’s

• Come in a variety of different sizes
• Less maintenance then a RV.
• Bathroom

Con’s

• Unless it’s a toy hauler no room for Kart or Race car.  Toy Haulers are HOT these days.  Take advantage of someone else's depreciation curve.  Similar to pop ups, lots of people with more money than foresight dive into the toy hauler game only to find out they don't really use it much.
• Limited to the Cx-9, but best hauled by a truck with towing capacity  Agreed.  3500 lbs doesn't get you much TT.  How heavy are the karts?  Some of the newer bunkhouse models have a big, swing-out door beside the bottom bunk as an emergency egress.  Not ideal, but could you squeeze a kart through that?
• Another potential con:  TTs tend to require the beefiest tow vehicle per pound/length being towed.  Its the tail-wagging-the-dog thing.  TTs are about the only trailer that I never use the vehicle's tow rating as a guide.  If you can tow 7000 lbs with the vehicle and you go buy a 7000-lb gvwr trailer, it won't be a pleasant driving experience (of course depending on the vehicle in question).  It also has to do with how far you plan on going.  My last TT was a 32' unit that had a GVWR of 9800.  The F250 that towed it was more than capable of handling the weight, but I lived full-time in that trailer and traveled a lot.  After a 600-mile day of towing a 32' billboard that threatened to put me in a ditch with every breeze, it made for a long, stressful day.  Dually would have been a better choice.  If I had only been going 100 miles to a track or campground, heck, whole different story.  I would have risked that with a newer F150.  I mention that because within the limits of your CX9, I would hate for you to buy a 3500-lb TT and realize that the passenger tires and squishy CUV suspension just isn't up to controlling the sway.

 

RV Share

Pro’s

• Lots of selection
• You do not have to maintain it, store it, insure it, own it or license it.

Con’s

• Lot’s of fees and for the cost you can stay in a nice hotel
• I have attempted in the past to book one and the Holidays are extremely difficult and if you are trying to book one a week in advance I haven’t had any luck.

 

 

Great source for Pop-Up campers

Great Source between RV, TT, Toy Haulers , Trailer living quarters, grassroots style

I have never done an RV share so I can't speak to that.

One other thing I will add.  If you end up doing a towable (any camper, really, but towables especially), I strongly suggest against ANYTHING that says "lite" or "ultralite" for two big reasons.  The allure is that you get more length/space for a given weight, but A) Given the tail-wagging-dog tendency, you're just asking for even more sway issues, and B) I have never seen a lite trailer that wasn't made from the cheapest, flimsiest, cardboard junk I have ever seen.  Egregiously terrible.  Sometime, find an RV show and go on the last day.  After three days of people walking through an ultralite and poking around, you'll find sagging cabinet doors, carpet that looks 20 years old, and probably multiple things already broken or worn.  After three days.  Mom and dad had a mid-90s TT that they used heavily... as in a solid three months out of the year traveling all over the east coast from FL to ONT every summer.  It finally started letting them down, so they bought a new TT.  Dad got an ultralight because he figured it only had to last a few years because he's pushing 80 and realizes his heavy towing days are soon over.  It is wasted after two seasons.  Doors falling off cabinets, light switches failing, and we've discovered that the paneling (which we knew wasn't real wood) wasn't even paneling.  It was luan with a woodgrain sticker on it, and every where they put their hands on the wall to help them keep their balance has worn through the ink on the sticker.  The walls have shifted so far that the bathroom and pantry doors don't latch.  The pleather couch is cracking and tearing.  We laugh about it, but seriously... unless you plan to use your camper for only one weekend a year, just don't do an ultralite.

I think, for a karting weekend with the family, assess what you really need.  You definitely need to take one kart, maybe two in the future.  That could be done with a toy hauler TT, but I don't think you'll find one that you'll be happy with that the CX9 can tow.  That means a 1/2 ton truck/SUV would need to be added to the fleet.

TL;DR... blunt, honest answer.  You can't do what you want with a CX9, so consider alternative things.

That pop up camper on top of the utility trailer exceeds the towing capacity of your CX9

Have you considered a basic enclosed utility trailer?

A 6x12 trailer could be set up really nicely. Build a kitchenette in the front, and racks in the rear where the 2 carts could stow stacked. On the 2 side walls install fold-down bunks, and put an awning outside.

A rig like this would be really versatile. It would tow easily, and switch to camping space in a heartbeat. When you get to your destination, just pull out the carts and you're ready to go.

Consider it a "micro" toy hauler.

All the more complicated solutions are just that- more complicated. 

There are some ghetto/redneck ways of doing things.  I have seen trailers on which someone has strapped on a pickup/slide-in camper.  It's more common on gooseneck trailers, but it can be done on a regular flatbed.  Just get a trailer that is long enough to put the karts on it.  That gets you a real (but small) RV and all you're registering is the trailer.  I would guess the camper pictured here is probably in the 2500-lb range, but plenty out there in the 1500-2000 range.  Bonus is, if you really need a trailer for something, put the jacks down and drive the trailer out from under it.  Dad has been considering selling his, but it's a monster.  I think it's 3800 lbs.

Redneck toy hauler:

SVreX (Forum Supporter) said:

Have you considered a basic enclosed utility trailer?

A 6x12 trailer could be set up really nicely. Build a kitchenette in the front, and racks in the rear where the 2 carts could stow stacked. On the 2 side walls install fold-down bunks, and put an awning outside.

A rig like this would be really versatile. It would tow easily, and switch to camping space in a heartbeat. When you get to your destination, just pull out the carts and you're ready to go.

Consider it a "micro" toy hauler.

All the more complicated solutions are just that- more complicated. 

I was thinking that too.  Instead of buying a TT and fabbing a way to make it haul karts, but an enclosed trailer and fab a way to make it a TT.  One of the bonuses to a TT is the "self contained" part, but you could fab up a bathroom in a utility trailer.

I vote either rent a couple different types of RV and TT or get a short bus, class C,B or trade in one of the CUVs and get a RWD/truck or truck based SUV and an enclosed utility trailer.

Church buses, box trucks and other commercial vehicles can be had for very reasonable and are built a ton tougher than pop can RV stuff.  My goal is something big enough to pull a small car (Miata, Subaru wagon, etc) on a dolly or trailer and still be small enough to fit into 2 parking spots and will be a big box and a foam pad at first progressing to something women and children would be comfortable in for 3 nights or more

One other thing I'll say.  RVs depreciate hard.  Make yourself a pretty comprehensive budget before you dive into bus/ambulance/conversions.  My bestie and I went looking for a short bus and found plenty, but until you realize that you can't stand upright without hitting your head, and you have some design challenges to overcome, you might find it a wiser investment to just get an RV.

If you prefer an awesome hippie bus with plywood cabinets and a coleman stove, do it.   But you'll be at about the same price point as a used motorhome with a bathroom and plumbing and light switches.  Also, if you end up not getting the RVing bug and decide to sell, the market for plywood-conversion buses is much smaller than for manufactured RVs.  Makes it a little tough to sell.

Be very aware.  Things have calmed down now that it's not summer, but around here, COVID had RV prices literally 3 times what they should be.  I went to look at an 86 motorhome that should have been worth $3500, but he was asking 6000.  When I got there and noticed that the roof had leaked and rotted half the ceiling to the point where the cabinets were falling off the walls, I figured it was a $2000 chassis with a box that needed to come off.  There were at least a dozen other people salivating over it, it got into a bidding situation, and it sold while I was inside it for $8000.  Same thing happened with boats.  I saw marinas with empty lots and showrooms.  2-year old used boats were selling for above new sticker price.  It is calming down a bit, but just be aware that if you buy right now, you'll likely be paying an inflated price - further adding to depreciation if you decide to sell.

Here's how I answered a similar question: 

https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/project-cars/2001-ford-f-250/project-f-250-buying-and-restoring-slide-camper-ou/

Check out the photos of how poorly it's built for a primer on what you're getting into.

A few other thoughts in no particular order:

You're not going to save any money doing this unless you're spending at least a month or so of nights traveling each year. The RV value proposition is staying where there are no hotels, like the paddock/the state park/the middle of nowhere.

You don't have enough tow vehicle to comfortably do what you're trying to do without roughing it and/or having a white-knuckle driving experience.

Toy haulers sized for a full car are nearly impossible to find, especially ones that are also rated for the weight. 

CX9

6x10 enclosed kart hauler

best western

In reply to Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) :

I only had a second to skim through this thread... I'll have to re read the whole thing later.

I did want to mention the pro of moving from the front into the back. I don't know about others, but I only mean when stopped. The point is, and it is a HUGE plus for my life, I only have to find a wide spot in the road, and my wife can go back to the bathroom, and right back moving. no worries of finding a place big enough to park, no worries about weather, etc. Ton of other singular uses and reasons. Anyone that thinks things through beyond moving around while moving, can find lots of pro's there. May not be for all people, but is definitely a pro for most. There is some moving around my wife will do while driving that helps, but its less than the pros of not having to get out when stopped.

Your answer of not peeing on yourself bumping around reminds of the story of the new RV'er that set the cruse control, and went in the bac to fix himself a drink...

03Panther said:

Your answer of not peeing on yourself bumping around reminds of the story of the new RV'er that set the cruse control, and went in the bac to fix himself a drink...

Heh.  Wait til Tesla makes RVs...

I went with this. A 1996 Tiffin Alegro Star for the princely sum of $4500. It has been fairly awesome.

The Blunder Bus

I tow the car. It's on a Ford F53 chassis so parts are readily available at the local FLAPS or Rock Auto. It is super convenient. A weekend at the track is much more pleasant and comfortable.

I will say at 7 mpg it won't save you any money by not renting hotel rooms. You can stock the fridge and not buy track food though. 

We also do a fair amount of camping in it and it has been used a lot this year at my parents house to keep my family out of their house during Covid. 

You'll need a tow vehicle that can comfortably pull 5000 lbs, but a Forest River Wolf Pup toy hauler would work for karts and bikes.  A quick browse on RVtrader shows new ones around $20K give or take, and older used models for around $12K or so.

I've been searching for years and a toy hauler that can fit a car will be a massive and heavy 5th wheel and even then, you'll still be limited to fairly small cars - say a modern MINI or similar at most.  And your DD goes from a CX-9 to a 1 ton dually (probably a diesel).  And they're usually pushing 6 figures or more to buy new and they tend to hold value better than a lot of RVs. 

In reply to Toyman01 (Moderately Supportive Dude) :

That's a $20k RV here right now. 

In reply to Pete Gossett (Forum Supporter) :

Prices have been creeping up some. I've been looking for a local chassis to stick under SanFord without much luck. 

I'll disagree greatly with the comment about not being able to walk around a big deal. In my experience that's one of the biggest +'s of a motor home. I'll be driving on a long trip and the wife will walk up front with a sandwich, or a water. I  only stop for fuel on long trips. The kids can walk around some (but limited for safety reasons). All in all- everyone is much happier with this than riding in car seats. 
Your best bet is an older class A that has a working generator. You have A/C, water,  and electricity at the track- it's massively more entertaining. Heck, it's even more fun with buddies. We go for weekends and sleep in the A/C at a track and then have a great breakfast and feel more like a normal human.  

Looking at the constraints seems to narrow down what you can do.

1) need to carry kart

2) need enough space to sleep 4 

3) need bathroom.

4) under 3500lb

We recently rented a trailer through RVShare, and looking over all of the choices there, we managed to fund a 19' 3200lb trailer that we towed with an Escape.  For slow vacation, it was fine, but if we were trying to get someplace quickly- anything over 60mph was a no go.  For sleeping 4, it would be just fine, but to add a kart, that would be impossible.  They do have toy haulers, and perhaps you can find one designed for a single side by side, but I really question if you can find one light enough.

So realistically, the constraints says to me that getting a separate trailer for the kart is the better option.

Which means either buying an RV or renting one.  Or sleeping in a hotel.  One common thread to that is the Kart needs a trailer.  So, IMHO, getting that should be priority one.  That can easily be pulled with either Mazda- as you can get a pretty small enclosed trailer for it.

In terms of the RV question- experiment first.  RVshare and Outdoorsy both have RV's that can tow with- rent one of those to make sure it works.  Yes, you will be out the rental money if the set up works, and you can use that money for a purchase.  But at the same time, it also means that if you don't like it, you are not losing money re-selling the RV.

The other thing about renting is that you will quickly learn what is important to you when you go out looking.  Size, layout, storage (both solid and liquid), etc.  Until you experience it, it's really hard to know what you will value in an RV.  

I'll add that renting will also make sure you know what you want in the RV you build, too.  That's how we designed the layout of our tiny TT.  

10 years ago I used a Kia Soul tow, I am very familiar with trailer sway. I am locked into to the Cx5 for 2 years and Cx9 for 3 years, so in a couple years I will be looking for a proper truck. I currently have a small HF trailer that I use now that has a tool box, It probably ways 500 pounds loaded. I have thought about a normal enclosed trailer and putting in a bathroom, small kitchen, and built in cots. My concern isn't weight because kart, parts and tools is probably 200-250lbs, but the height of the trailer. Cx9 is a fairly aerodynamic the height may cause sway. Any thoughts? 

Ambulance, short buses, and sprinters are very intriguing, I have been following Sprinter Rv conversion groups in facebook and like the blank canvass on the outside. I am in the process of starting my own business and like the space to wrap it. Again Motorhome has all the things I want ready to go.

 The problem with 1 ton truck is I have a skinny driveway that goes back behind the house. I had a Dodge Durango, and was able to fit it, I like Nissan Frontier and Dodge Dakota, but a Dodge Ram seems to be the shortest among the full sized trucks.

I will check into outdoorsy, has anybody had good/bad experience with the rentals? I may check with my local RV place to see if they rent.

I'm confused by the use of "RV" in this thread.

Travel trailers, motor homes, campervans, caravans, camper trailers, fifth wheel trailers, pop up campers, and truck campers are ALL RVs.

I'm pretty sure you mean a motor home each time you are using the word RV.  Correct?

I doubt height would cause sway, but if height is a concern, wouldn't it rule out a motor home?

It sounds like you are saying IF you have a towable, you want to be able to tow it with the Mazdas, but an extra registered vehicle (like a motor home) is still an option.  Is that right?

I still say build a proper enclosed trailer for the carts. Tow it behind the Mazda, or behind a rented motor home. No difference. 

Sway is caused by an improperly loaded trailer, not height.

In reply to trigun7469 :

We did two rentals this year, and had great experiences both time.  Both happened to be with RVshare, but I don't see Outdoorsy being that much different. 

Many of the local rentals are listed on both sites.

One thing that I did notice is that the search system is different- and for our constraints, it was easier to filter with RVshare.