Social Security number and taxes

In reply to wbjones:

I think the "Trust Funds" question is a bit of a political football.

When did Congress "borrow" those funds?

Well (as I understand it), the program was ammended in 1983 to attempt to accumulate a surplus to prepare for an aging population. Everyone thought this meant that there would be an account somewhere with a bunch of cash in it.

But the SS Trust Fund never did hold cash. Surpluses were always held in the form of "Special Issue Government Bonds". (aka: IOUs).

The question never was whether there is a bunch of money sitting somewhere to pay people.

The question is (and has always been), "Is the US Government able to fulfill it's debt obligations?"

Paying those bonds is a future debt. The bonds exist, and have accumulated.

The future question for politicians will be a choice of 2 options: Raise taxes to pay the debt, or allow the program to fail. Both of these options are political suicide.

So, it's not that Congress has "raided" the Trust Fund- they sort of always did. It's that our (unreasonable) expectation was that a surplus of cash would be accumulated. Now, the question is, will Congress pay it's debts?

The debts are beginning to pile up. The program deficit started in 2010 (about $50B per year), got worse in 2013 (now about $75B per year), and is expected to jump significantly in 2018.

Current expenditures for Social Security and Medicare (paying the debt of those bonds) is now about 38% of the federal budget.

Forbes: Is the SS Trust Fund solvent?

SnowMongoose wrote: People living (on average) something like 16 years longer than when SS was started, also not helping.

Hmmm... sounds like killing off a few folks would be good for the budget. (Hugely sarcastic, with a tidbit of truth)

Yanking this back on track (sorta): if you have a company, can you use its TIN (Taxpayer ID No.) for their 1099 purposes? The TIN shows the $ going to your company, then your company pays you under your SSN.

SSN theft is a pretty sizeable problem, unfortunately. The SSN has morphed from a number unique to Social Security to something that's almost universally used as an ID number, which was NOT the original intent. Without getting into political finger pointing, the problem is that abandoning it for those purposes would be sort of like trying to put toothpaste back in the tube. With that in mind, the best bet for the average individual is to safeguard that number; something I have done my best to beat into my kid's head.

In reply to Curmudgeon:

I think you meant EIN (Employer Identification Number), not TIN. A TIN is either a SSN or an EIN.

The answer to your question is yes, he can supply his EIN instead of his SSN, but not all companies have EINs.

I think mtn is a small company (only 1 person). It is likely he never applied for an EIN.

In reply to mtn:

Maybe that brings us back to the elephant in the room...

Are you actually trying to run a company? Is your goal to build a viable company, carry appropriate insurances, file appropriate taxes, etc?

Then get some professional advice/ assistance. This will probably include (as a minimum) an EIN, an accountant, and a lawyer. It likely will also include a corporate structure. It may also include various licensing, insurances, etc. It will also grow into all the PITA stuff we all hate- paperwork, taxes, regulation, etc. That's all part of business.

Or, is your actual goal trying to reduce or eliminate taxes? Did you do the work and accept full payment (no withholdings) in the hope and expectation that they would not give you a 1099, and you would therefore avoid tax liability?

If that's the case, I can't help you. That's tax evasion. But I can point you in the right direction to help get things right, and posture your business for future success. But THAT will cost time, money, and energy (see paragraph #2 & #3).

SVreX wrote: In reply to Curmudgeon: I think you meant EIN (Employer Identification Number), not TIN. A TIN is either a SSN or an EIN. The answer to your question is yes, he can supply his EIN instead of his SSN, but not all companies have EINs. I think mtn is a small company (only 1 person). It is likely he never applied for an EIN.

You are right, an EIN. I thought (and could be dead wrong) that if you incorporate, even if it's a sole proprietorship, you need to apply for an EIN?

FWIW: when we were working on my dad's estate we had to get it an ID number separate from his or our SSN's, that might have been where the TIN thing came from.

Datsun1500 wrote: I don't read anything here that suggests he's not going to claim the income. He's claimed it before without a 1099. It sounds like he just does not want them to have his SS number.

I agree, and wasn't suggesting anything else.

But, as you have noted, withholding the SS number is not an option.

In reply to Curmudgeon:

You can't incorporate as a sole proprietorship. 2 different things.

You can have a corporation with no employees.

Man, this thread blew up. Thanks everyone, SSN has been provided to them.

I for get the specifics on this but you can get a Tax ID#. I did this severial years back due to consulting I was doing. Again I forget the specifics and I think there was a cost for it.