When is it time to panic

In reply to alfadriver (Forum Supporter) :

I’m blessed to have been born without the desire to live in highly populated areas, so my life has not had to change much. Rarely need go to places where a mask would help. So no one has had to yell at me in public, nor has anyone. 

If you are unsure of what I mean, you must not be paying attention in this thread. Or are being intentionally obtuse. There are many on here that are pounding “wear a mask” so hard, ya can’t “hear” anything else! And no, I was not referring to you.

By asking legitimate questions about effectiveness of sneeze guards, I have gotten a few thought out responses. But mostly I’ve been demeaned, derided, and even cussed at. Without putting effort into trying to keeping a polite exchange of information 

In reply to 03Panther :

I don't come to this thread that often.  Seems when I post facts, I get told that I'm dividing people and polarizing stuff...  How a pandemic became such a poltican hot potato is just a mystery to me.

I posted data why it works on both in and out.  And there's also the study of New York, Italy, and Wuhan that showed the change in cases when masks were mandated. 

Stupid board- here's the link to the mask mandate study- https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acsnano.0c03252

Which is why many are modelling the data to show that if we added that to the social distancing, the virus may go away on it's own.

In reply to alfadriver (Forum Supporter) :

You are getting pretty far afield of my short reply. I have not replied (for or against) to any of your data. 

From the beginning of this thread, people have been advocating wear a mask, with (largely) no explanation of what that entails.  Most of the time the assumption has been its for others. Info lately has debated how effective it is for protecting “yourself “. But mostly “they “ still only say wear a mask. 

That is all my reply meant. Sorry for any confusion. 

I also have not been coming to this topic very often.  I've noticed three things with the masks recently: 

1) A lot of people wearing them in their cars.  While driving.  Alone in the car. 

2) A lot of people walking down the street wearing them, with no other people around them (small town).

3) A somewhat shocking amount of "mask litter".

I think 1 & 2 are a result of simply people being uninformed citizens.  Which, unfortunately, is why we have a "mask mandate".  Like most laws out there, government decides to step in when people are deemed too stupid to make their own decisions.  And the people, in turn, blindly follow the law without any question as to why.  Wearing a mask in your car, alone, is akin to driving  along a deserted country road without using your high beams. 

As for #3....well, that's a symptom of a greater societal issue...

On another note....fire up those government printing presses!  Time to mint some more money and give it out to everyone!

In reply to volvoclearinghouse (Forum Supporter) :

While I don’t always hold my fellow humans in the highest of regard, for 1 and 2, I think some explanations have been offered here that make sense for at least some of those cases.  If they are going from one place that requires a mask to another in short succession, it may just be more convenient to leave it on.

In reply to eastsideTim :

Yeah, if i'm going to be going between lots of places it seems better to me to just leave it on than to repeatedly touch my face taking it off and putting it back on.  

eastsideTim said:

In reply to volvoclearinghouse (Forum Supporter) :

While I don’t always hold my fellow humans in the highest of regard, for 1 and 2, I think some explanations have been offered here that make sense for at least some of those cases.  If they are going from one place that requires a mask to another in short succession, it may just be more convenient to leave it on.

Yep. My most comfortable (and also the most effective) mask that I have does not go around my ears, but around the back of my head. I have to tie it twice. No elastic. It is much easier to leave it on rather than take it off, put it on, retie, and readjust so that it doesn't fog my glasses.

I did see one woman come out of a store, pull her mask off, get in her car, and put it back on. Pretty sure it was an involuntary thing (ever walk into the kitchen holding the remote, and not know why?), but still pretty funny to see. 

My wife just reminded me of when we were in the NICU with Angela, and we didn't know what was going on. Early on, for about 36 hours, we had to wear full PPE. Full fabric gown, full plastic gown with arms, head net, gloves, booties, and N95 (I think) face masks. THAT was uncomfortable, specifically the plastic gown.

volvoclearinghouse (Forum Supporter) said:

  Which, unfortunately, is why we have a "mask mandate".  Like most laws out there, government decides to step in when people are deemed too stupid to make their own decisions.  And the people, in turn, blindly follow the law without any question as to why. 

I get what you are saying here, but the law (at least in most states), does not mandate mask usage when you are in your car or walking down the street alone.  So they aren't blindly following the law, they are blinding following their perception of the mandate, without taking the 2 minutes to read what it says. 

To return to a page or two ago, regarding gold and silver prices.  They’ve continued to climb, but what is really worrisome is the spot price does not seem to be representative of what you pay when you want to have it in hand, at least in coin format.  1 oz Gold eagles are selling around $140-155 above spot, when I am used to seeing them closer to $70 above spot.  Silver is worse - 1 oz of junk silver (pre-1965 US coins)  is about $6-7 above spot prices, when it’s usually closer to a dollar or two.  Last time I saw this sort of mania was sometime around the Great Recession.  Usually I see big differences between spot and coin prices when the spot price is tanking and people are shopping for deals. 

I did check other commodity prices, and they’ve been going up a bit more steadily, except aluminum, which has had some weird spikes, but that may have something to do with news stories about can shortages.  So, inflation at the commodity level is happening, but there also seems to be a bigger rush into gold/silver as a “safe” asset.

I need to see what aluminum is going for at the local scrapper.  I’ve got a trash bag full of cans I need to take in at some point next time I go errand running.

I also generally leave mine on in the car if Its only a short time between stops. I may take it off while walking if my hands are clean but if they aren't I'm not going to keep touching my face/mask. 

In reply to eastsideTim :

I was just looking at that this morning along with treasury yields............

mazdeuce - Seth said:

In reply to eastsideTim :

I was just looking at that this morning along with treasury yields............

Strange times are afoot.  However, I’m assuming (perhaps wrongly) that some of the increase in prices of industrial metals is tied to economies reopening.  But with all the stimulus money running around, I’m sure some of it is just looking for investment returns.

eastsideTim said:

mazdeuce - Seth said:

In reply to eastsideTim :

I was just looking at that this morning along with treasury yields............

Strange times are afoot.  However, I’m assuming (perhaps wrongly) that some of the increase in prices of industrial metals is tied to economies reopening.  But with all the stimulus money running around, I’m sure some of it is just looking for investment returns.

There is LOTS of cash right now and everyone is looking for a place to park it.

I'm worried about inflation...

In reply to ProDarwin :

You're right- that's what I was trying to say.  Idiot humans can't tell you when you're supposed to wear a mask, when it doesn't help, and who it's supposed to help.  But they can tell you exactly how many Kardashians are playing in the NFL this year. 

I saw something on social media along the lines of "I'm assuming if you're wearing a mask while driving in your car by yourself, it's to help you to resist the urge to lick  the windows." 
:p 

Saron81 said:

I saw something on social media along the lines of "I'm assuming if you're wearing a mask while driving in your car by yourself, it's to help you to resist the urge to lick  the windows." 
:p 

So can you find one to fit my Alaskan Malamute's big nose? 

ProDarwin said:

volvoclearinghouse (Forum Supporter) said:

  Which, unfortunately, is why we have a "mask mandate".  Like most laws out there, government decides to step in when people are deemed too stupid to make their own decisions.  And the people, in turn, blindly follow the law without any question as to why. 

I get what you are saying here, but the law (at least in most states), does not mandate mask usage when you are in your car or walking down the street alone.  So they aren't blindly following the law, they are blinding following their perception of the mandate, without taking the 2 minutes to read what it says. 

This is a huge part of the problems I once called "knee jerk reactions" although I freely admit that's not quite the right term! Blindly following "THEY" SAID...

I think all three of us are trying to say the same thing, if I'm not infering too much for what ya wrote. Thanks

volvoclearinghouse (Forum Supporter) said:

In reply to ProDarwin :

You're right- that's what I was trying to say.  Idiot humans can't tell you when you're supposed to wear a mask, when it doesn't help, and who it's supposed to help.  But they can tell you exactly how many Kardashians are playing in the NFL this year. 

Saw that right after I hit "post!" Well said

eastsideTim said:

mazdeuce - Seth said:

In reply to eastsideTim :

I was just looking at that this morning along with treasury yields............

Strange times are afoot.  However, I’m assuming (perhaps wrongly) that some of the increase in prices of industrial metals is tied to economies reopening.  But with all the stimulus money running around, I’m sure some of it is just looking for investment returns.

I have a legitimate question for guys that know more than me bout this... means almost anyone!

I know almost two years ago, when "we" add a 35% tariff to import steel, the price of domestic steel went up 35%. I can only assume that was nothing more than greed, and the assumption the public is too dumb to notice. But why did the price of scrap DROP 60% at the same time? Is there an answer besides greed?

eastsideTim said:

In reply to volvoclearinghouse (Forum Supporter) :

While I don’t always hold my fellow humans in the highest of regard, for 1 and 2, I think some explanations have been offered here that make sense for at least some of those cases.  If they are going from one place that requires a mask to another in short succession, it may just be more convenient to leave it on.

I have seen the reasonable responses for several folks on here, and makes sense in those cases. But most of the folks on here do use their brains.... I can not make that assumption for the public. In general, I'd be willing to believe the % of reason is much lower

In reply to 03Panther :

My understanding is that it was driven largely by the decrease in exporting scrap to China. That market was driving scrap demand in the US. This article discusses it a bit. 

03Panther said:

eastsideTim said:

mazdeuce - Seth said:

In reply to eastsideTim :

I was just looking at that this morning along with treasury yields............

Strange times are afoot.  However, I’m assuming (perhaps wrongly) that some of the increase in prices of industrial metals is tied to economies reopening.  But with all the stimulus money running around, I’m sure some of it is just looking for investment returns.

I have a legitimate question for guys that know more than me bout this... means almost anyone!

I know almost two years ago, when "we" add a 35% tariff to import steel, the price of domestic steel went up 35%. I can only assume that was nothing more than greed, and the assumption the public is too dumb to notice. But why did the price of scrap DROP 60% at the same time? Is there an answer besides greed?

Probably because we sent most of our recycling and scrap to China to be processed. They put a matching tariff on things coming from America I believe, so the scrap yards basically had nobody to buy their stuff.

In reply to 03Panther :

well, a tariff "protects" american companies because it is a tax on companies outside of america. So it essentially makes a 35% breathing room for US steel companies to be able to compete. It does many things, some good some bad, depending on who you are. For example, it keeps jobs in america. We generally have higher costs of doing business in america (labor, environmental cleanliness, raw material cost, etc) and without the tariff you could argue that the international competitive landscape means that companies need to move out to compete. Also, it does make steel more expensive (as you noted) because the cheap steel from other places is now marked up by the tariff amount, and the local steel producers no longer need to price compete with the lower price. That then usually has a trickle down effect in that products made from the steel also become more expensive. I'm sure you could do a PhD thesis on all the things that happen from the creation of a tariff. 

But as to the drop in scrap price, a lot of the scrap was being purchased by steel producers in other countries. If they suddenly aren't selling as much as they used to because the price went up, then also it follows that they suddenly don't need as much raw material coming in to make steel with. I'm not super versed in the steel market, but there could be some weird stuff in raw material sourcing where it is better/cheaper for offshore steel to start with scrap and better for onshore to start with fresh ore or something like that. If the onshore companies own the mines, there may be federal or state incentives to use the natural resources instead of the scrap, for example. 

edit, and, as posted above, we are not the only country who can create and enforce tariffs, duh!

p.s. a HUGE part of why many people believe the US to be so successful in our history is that we enacted a federal law early on that prevented states from being able to tariff each other's goods and services. Also, things like NAFTA are agreements between countries to not tariff each other in general. 

Robbie (Forum Supporter) said:

eastsideTim said:

mazdeuce - Seth said:

In reply to eastsideTim :

I was just looking at that this morning along with treasury yields............

Strange times are afoot.  However, I’m assuming (perhaps wrongly) that some of the increase in prices of industrial metals is tied to economies reopening.  But with all the stimulus money running around, I’m sure some of it is just looking for investment returns.

There is LOTS of cash right now and everyone is looking for a place to park it.

I'm worried about inflation...

I'm parking some extra cash into non perishable future supplies because i have the same concerns about inflation.  If i stock up now, and prices go up, I save money.  If I stock up now and prices stay the same, no foul. 
 

i will tell you a sheet of OSB is $2 more than it was in february.  Usually the prices go down in summer as more building materials are consumed, so it's worrisome.  I'm planning to add onto the house in a couple months and while I don't have permits yet i am thinking about just buying everything and getting it delivered now in case stuff goes up more.