Would this give you pause? (car insurance content-sorry)

I'll try to be brief. I'm trying to get over my recently totaled car. There was a thread, maybe even two, but this is different. I sold my house in September, and moved in with my special lady friend. I am to be the first foothold in our new home some hours to the East. Well, The move isn't happening as fast as I thought. I have dragged my feet on updating address in the hopes of only doing it once.

So, when the car was wrecked (12/28/2016), I changed address to that of my special lady friend. I admit this was lazy. The wreck was a mess (hit and run, uninsured minors in a stolen car, if you haven't followed my other rants). Today, the insurance broker's office called, and said they had an address for me that I had never given. My mother's address. I have been parking either my truck, or my car there due to limited room at my special lady friend's.

I explained my situation, and said if there were any other questions, to give me a call.

They called back, saying that they must have my special lady friend's D.L#, D.O.B, full name, and Social Security # so she could be added to my policy("It shouldn't be any more money", my broker said). I really don't mind adding her to my policy, and we'll be doing that once we have a house together. I guess this all seems rude to me. How did they track the truck to my mother's? They didn't seem to know that address was someone related to me. Is it standard to demand my significant other be added to my auto insurance? Where was all this attention when no one would return my calls, and I had zero contact for 16 days after my car was totaled? Do they have time to send people out to see where I park my truck? It, or my other vehicle has been there more or less constantly since September. Has Google earth updated in that time? Would this freak you out just a little bit?

Disclaimer: I am not trying to slander the insurance company. They have a job to do, and I do have a nice, new (used) car, so I really shouldn't complain. I'm just a little ragged around the edges, and confused by the modern world. Nobody talks to me for weeks on end when I need them, and now I feel a bit badgered.

Was the truck at your mother's parked in such a way that the plate was visible from the street? The laws on what is done with police license plate reader data are pretty fuzzy in most places, and repo guys use them now too, and as far as I know, they are completely unregulated in what they can do with the data.

Big Brother and Sketchy Cousin are both informing on you.

If you have OnStar it can rat you out at any time.

I often wonder what influence my roommate has on my insurance rates. My company noted that there was another driver at my residence like that's any of their business as he has his own insurance and he certainly doesn't drive my E36 M3boxes. Also they sent out a letter a couple of weeks ago to the effect of saying that anyone driving my cars wouldn't be covered under my insurance unless on the policy. Well duh!

I remember going through that years ago when I had roommates. We need your roommate's DL# so we can add him to your policy. Never mind that my roommate couldn't drive a stick. Needless to say, I found a new insurance agent/company because my roommate has THE worse driving record for somebody who had never lost their license

Sounds about right. You got the "polite" notice...AAA just cancels your policy when they discover you have a housemate (who it never occurred to you to add since there is no way in hell they would drive your car). Glad the relative stranger (at the time) was willing to hand over full identify theft details to me.

Yup, still bitter at that crappy customer treatment ten years later...

When I had roommates, the insurance company never cared about them. I can see an argument the expectations for driving cars would be different for a live-in girlfriend than for he's-paying-me-rent-for-a-room housemates, though.

As far as your mother's address, were any of your vehicles ever registered there, or did a car loan company have it as your address? Did you ever file a change-of-address with the post office for that address? The insurance company gets DMV records and I think any business can subscribe to the change-of-address database. They may also have pulled that address off your credit report by accident.

First, take your tin foil hat off. It's all good. You're also correlating a claims department with underwriting. They are completely and 100% separate.

No, they do not have people out on the streets randomly tracking you down. Just doesn't happen. Every insurance company has what's called an SIU department (Special Investigation Unit), of which I used to be a part. They do not get involved with a lot of underwriting, unless there is some larger scale fraud attempt, such as a ring. They work on potentially fraudulent claims. They'd have no real reason to get involved in a situation like yours, I'm quite confident this was purely an underwriting query. I suspect they got your mothers' address from databases, as codrus mentioned. That stuff is public information, and it's more than auto insurance companies that have access to it. Underwriting has to do their due diligence to know what risk they are taking when they write a policy. Where is the car parked, who may have access to it, etc...

I can tell you from years of first hand fraud investigation experience that the number of people who lie about their actual address and/or who lives in their house, just to get cheaper insurance rates, is sky high. Ridiculously high.

So my suggestion is relax. You may think it's big brother, but it's not a conspiracy to get you. They just want to know what risk they are taking.

Klayfish wrote: First, take your tin foil hat off. It's all good. So my suggestion is relax. You may think it's big brother, but it's not a conspiracy to get you. They just want to know what risk they are taking.

, and as always, thank you for your time and patience, Sir. I recognize and appreciate that you spend a lot of time and effort talking people off the ledge around here. I'm really not hating on insurance folks, just a bit ruffled by current events.

In answer to other's Questions, No, I have never used my mother's as an address, yes, the license plate was viewable from the street of a cul de sac. You'd have to be looking for it. Not a highly policed area.

Back to Klayfish: It is not so much that I believe they are all out to get me, and I do recognize this is the broker I'm dealing with right now, not the actual insurer, just a bit funny.

I suppose my argument is with how the modern world works. Lots of manpower is allocated to clandestine research of a loyal, accident free client's personal life after an accident I was not responsible for, yet No one returned my calls when I was trying to make a claim? I just long for a simpler time. I really have nothing to hide, and would rather just be asked rather than someone finding out through whatever means were used.

Above all, I am curious as to how this information was gathered. Knowledge is power.

I wouldn't give them your lady friend's info. I don't really care why they want it. No. Sorry. I would just say I didn't know anything about my new room mate except they pay their half. If they want to know they can call her directly.

Actually I'd deny my truck was ever there too and ask to see proof. Just to be an ass and waste their time. And I'm curious to see how they track these things if not why.

When my old truck got smashed and the other party was responsible I got a check in the mail. No conversations. A guy took pics of it at the place it was towed... they mailed me a check. That was it.

Huckleberry wrote: I wouldn't give them your lady friend's info. I don't really care why they want it. No. Sorry. I would just say I didn't know anything about my new room mate except they pay their half. If they want to know they can call her directly. Actually I'd deny my truck was ever there too and ask to see proof. Just to be an ass and waste their time. And I'm curious to see how they track these things if not why.

This is exactly why the insurance companies will look to verify information. Responses like this. OK, great, you're basically going to tell the insurance company to berkeley off when they ask for information. Let's just say the insurance company accepts that answer and writes the policy without knowing anything about other household residents. Now that same person lets the mystery roommate (girlfriend, mistress, girlfriends' mistress...) drive the car. Said mystery roommate has a few too many at the bar, goes out and kills someone. Guess who's going to get sued? Yep, same person who told the insurance company to berkeley off. Guess who's going to have to step in and pay/defend that person? Yep, the insurance company. Sorry, no. Not a good business proposition. When they ask for information, the only "invasive" intent is to know what potential risks they are taking when they agree to give you $1,000,000 in coverage in exchange for your measly $1500 premium. You certainly can say no when they ask for information, but don't then complain when they either refuse to write your policy, drop you, or give you sky high rates. Your choice.

wheelsmithy,
No doubt, just like any other industry, sometimes things can suck. Unreturned phone calls aren't acceptable, in insurance or any other professional line of work. Like I said, underwriting and claims are completely separate entities. They're not trying to spy on you, just properly assess their risk.

You don't have to provide that information to your carrier. Of course they have the right to non-renew due to non-compliance with underwriting guideline - requiring all members of household of driving age to be reported to the company. Some companies can "list" the other party if they have own vehicle/insurance & do not operate Named Insured's vehicle on a regular basis. Most companies won't list, they either have to "rate" or "exclude".

Most carriers will run an Additional Driver Discovery report (ADD), looking to see who all has received mail at your current and past address, in an attempt to identify any non-disclosed drivers. It will also bring to light any additional addresses you have/had.

Years ago I worked at a call-center at a Direct insurance company that did a lot of business in Florida. We had to ask about every name that showed up on the report: do you know a so&so, do they reside in your household, do they operate your vehicle on a regular basis, do they have their own vehicle & insurance, do they have access to your vehicle, etc. Because Florida is so transient, sometimes there would be dozens of names on the list. Many times that list would include the name MICKEY MOUSE and I would have to ask if you know a Mickey Mouse, does he reside in your household, etc.....

Anyway, nothing more nefarious than an Underwriting review is occurring to you. If your dirlfriend is clean, your rate most likely WILL go down. Avoid "excluding" her from your policy, if at all possible.

Klayfish wrote:

Huckleberry wrote: I wouldn't give them your lady friend's info. I don't really care why they want it. No. Sorry. I would just say I didn't know anything about my new room mate except they pay their half. If they want to know they can call her directly. Actually I'd deny my truck was ever there too and ask to see proof. Just to be an ass and waste their time. And I'm curious to see how they track these things if not why.

This is exactly why the insurance companies will look to verify information. Responses like this. OK, great, you're basically going to tell the insurance company to berkeley off when they ask for information. Let's just say the insurance company accepts that answer and writes the policy without knowing anything about other household residents. Now that same person lets the mystery roommate (girlfriend, mistress, girlfriends' mistress...) drive the car. Said mystery roommate has a few too many at the bar, goes out and kills someone. Guess who's going to get sued? Yep, same person who told the insurance company to berkeley off. Guess who's going to have to step in and pay/defend that person? Yep, the insurance company. Sorry, no. Not a good business proposition. When they ask for information, the only "invasive" intent is to know what potential risks they are taking when they agree to give you $1,000,000 in coverage in exchange for your measly $1500 premium. You certainly can say no when they ask for information, but don't then complain when they either refuse to write your policy, drop you, or give you sky high rates. Your choice. wheelsmithy, No doubt, just like any other industry, sometimes things can suck. Unreturned phone calls aren't acceptable, in insurance or any other professional line of work. Like I said, underwriting and claims are completely separate entities. They're not trying to spy on you, just properly assess their risk.

If someone calls me and says "We know your car wasn't at your house" I would say that in the process of determining risk, they are spying on me. I am not deceptive with my insurance company. I am not forthcoming either. If they ask me a question that seems over-reaching I ask why and do not answer it. If they ask for an adult room mate's SS# and info - that is not my information to give. It is enough that I did not add that person to my policy so it's none of their concern.

They can choose not to write the policy if they don't like my answers but if they do write it - then I expect them to hold up their end of the bargain. Nothing more. Nothing less.

When my brother moved in with me, we were excluded from each other's insurance policies. My rates didn't change. His rates didn't change.

Tell them the information they want and have them price it both ways. If it's cheaper to exclude, there's your answer.

Also, your insurance company writes their policies based on where you usually store the vehicle. If it's not at your home, they have the right to know.

Kylini wrote: Also, your insurance company writes their policies based on where you usually store the vehicle. If it's not at your home, they have the right to know.

I store my vehicle in short term parking at any one of 3 airports, hotel lots and so on as much as I keep it in my garage at home. But they didn't ask where I keep it. I wouldn't offer that information either but if they asked I would disclose it.

Huckleberry wrote: If someone calls me and says "We know your car wasn't at your house" I would say that in the process of determining risk, they are spying on me. I am not deceptive with my insurance company. I am not forthcoming either. If they ask me a question that seems over-reaching I ask why and do not answer it. If they ask for an adult room mate's SS# and info - that is not my information to give. It is enough that I did not add that person to my policy so it's none of their concern. They can choose not to write the policy if they don't like my answers but if they do write it - then I expect them to hold up their end of the bargain. Nothing more. Nothing less.

Whatever floats your boat. Your attitude is quite clear... "I am not forthcoming", "Just to be an ass and waste their time", etc... I'm impressed.

And no, if you're not forthcoming and withhold information they would have needed to determine whether or not to accept the risk, they do not have to hold up "their end of the bargain". You could easily be left high and dry.

Klayfish wrote:

wheelsmithy, No doubt, just like any other industry, sometimes things can suck. Unreturned phone calls aren't acceptable, in insurance or any other professional line of work. Like I said, underwriting and claims are completely separate entities. They're not trying to spy on you, just properly assess their risk.

As always, thank you for your clear head. I know its not easy. For What it's worth, I was always the bad guy when I was a mechanic. Someone must be blamed for what basically amounts to bad luck. I refuse to engage in that nonsense. I do, however,freely admit to being paranoid.

To go on further with the story, and I blame no one who tunes out, S.O. didn't outright forbid me from giving my insurance company her info, but let me know that she found that very invasive, so I started researching my options. The insurance company I went to (hers) said my claim was still open, and was reported as a collision, as opposed to an uninsured motorist claim. This sent me into a bit of a tizzy, and I went to see my agent. He was, thankfully, home sick. I then called my Claim Handler, and she actually answered this time. She was pleasant, as was I. She explained that the claim should be closed, and it should be filed under the proper uninsured motorist heading once the salvage title goes through (expected date, March 2).

Lexisnexis was the data base insurer #2 used to check my background. Knowledge is power. I would have had no problem surrendering this info to S.O.'s insurance, but must honor her wishes as best as I can. I'm afraid for now, I just have to stay put. My current insurer (#1) needs to put the claim under uninsured motorist. If S.O. doesn't want to give up her info, I'll have her omitted from my policy.(period).

It is funny, but I'm feeling pressure to tie the knot. That's the one thing both insurance companies seem to have in common. #2 even gave me amended, cheaper price quotes, were we to be married. We're middle aged people with squeaky clean driving records, and the newest car is 13 years old. All this will be amplified once we buy a house together. And so it is.

That's it for now. I appreciate everyone's input. My prevailing wish is to get this behind me, and get a darned job.