I think multiple tire choices complicate things. If you want to run the special class run the special class. If you want to compete for overall you will not be in a stockish daily drivable car.
Same goes for CAM. Allowing drag slicks and Hoosiers isn't the point.
the speed of this thread reminds me that we desperately need a "view unread posts" button on here.
I haven't read the whole thing yet, but I'm in. Hoping to bring a street-able e28 to the 2019 challenge.
I'm with pimpm3. I'm 100% for people running Hoosiers and drag tires. I think that's part of what makes this event special and I'd encourage anyone to get their car on the fastest tires possible to do well in the overall. If you want that snail trophy though, just the four Gastropod tires.
I +1'd every post I could find about 1 set of tires in CAM/gastropod.
In reply to mazdeuce - Seth :
Works for me.
(Might have some CAM guys not too happy!)
so, thinking of ways to promote the "driven down" and/or "daily-driven" Gastropod competitors, and thinking that Seth might not like charging for "team inducing shirts"...
maybe we should develop a special "I drove to Challenge" sticker that's big enough / prominent enough to show up in some pictures. I'd also be behind kicking in some $$ for some kind of "taco dinner" gift certificate give away as well for those cars... in lieu of being able to "take mazdeuce out for tacos"
are we concerned that having a "gastropod only" tire exemption limit of $400-500 would be confusing in the budgeting documentation?
I think having one does good in encouraging our members to buy "new-ish" tires, while helping to limit the overall outlay for the prep of the car in comparison to the "full on challenge" cars. It kind of splits the middle ground of the one the original intents of having an $80 tire class and the "unlimited 4 tires free" options.
I dunno if we've really gotten a weigh-in from mazdeuce/pimpm3 on their position on that?
In reply to sleepyhead :
Check prices.
In 300tw tires, the price point for brand new is basically $400-500. So I see no point in the limitation.
Expensive race tires are not 300tw.
I say leave it a treadwear limitation and walk away. Don’t make it more complicated than it needs to be.
In reply to sleepyhead :
Since the first four tires are budget-exempt for the Challenge anyway, there wouldn't need to be anything different in the documentation, would there? Since the subclass would be scored in tandem with the regular (and I meant that in the nicest way) Challenge entrants, any car that had the "wrong" tires or "too expensive" tires per the G-pod rules would get filtered out of the subclass, but every car would be compliant with the official GRM-sanctioned ruleset.
I'm with SVreX that the TW limitation does the job. After that it's just good shopping or spending money, whatever way you like it.
This whole thing exists within the umbrella of the Challenge. Follow the rules for 2019, come play. If you limit yourself to $1000 your in the running for the 1/2 price award. If you follow the CAM rules, you're in the running for their award. If you follow the Gastropod rules, then you get a chance at the snail. No matter what, we all get to go to Gainesville and play. How cool is that?
bobzilla said:
You don't even need an excuse for that one.
The discussions on tires appear to be moving in opposite directions in the 2 threads. Gpods are saying no drag tires, CAMs are saying yes.
I think both classes should have the same guideline.
I really think extra tires are a problem that solves itself in this class. We’ve agreed to allow 4 “free” tires. If someone brings additional tires (drag tires, etc), they have to be in budget. Since the Gpods are working with such a significantly lower price point, I think it is unlikely anyone will commit the money in their budget to drag tires. If they do, they probably won’t go fast enough to need them.
So, my opinion is still that an extra set of tires are OK, but they have to be in the budget. AutoX MUST run on 300tw.
I will go with the flow on this, but I think it would be easier if the rules matched the event’s overall rules.
Robbie said:I +1'd every post I could find about 1 set of tires in CAM/gastropod.
Let me be more specific - what I DO NOT think should happen is to have a team in CAM or gastropod run an autox run on 'CAM/gastropod' tires, and then switch to hoosiers and run autox for 'overall'.
6 tires I think is much more agreeable, but I think I'd still like to see someone find a compromise tire.
If you guys think allowing drag tires makes the class better, then I'm ok with it. Adding anything beyond "street car, four 300tw tires" should make the class better. I personally don't think it does but I'm not hugely emotionally invested in it.
In reply to Robbie :
I agree with that, but I’m not sure it helps the magazine.
It’s a car competition, not a tire competition.
Readers wont read the treadwear comparisons. They will look at the times, and compare the cars.
I’m open. Write the rule, I’ll play by it.
mazdeuce - Seth said:If you guys think allowing drag tires makes the class better, then I'm ok with it. Adding anything beyond "street car, four 300tw tires" should make the class better. I personally don't think it does but I'm not hugely emotionally invested in it.
I say allow it. It’s gonna self-police.
In reply to SVreX :
I actually think the current tires rules are confusing as berkeley for the average reader. I have trouble explaining them to people in real life. The only thing I don't like about 6 tires for Gastropods is explaining the whole "closer to real cars, except for drag tires of course" thing. It gets dangerously close to being just a low grip/has an interior version of the main event.
My vote is no drag tires, for whatever that counts for. Simple is better.
In reply to mazdeuce - Seth :
Ok.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ said:My vote is no drag tires, for whatever that counts for. Simple is better.
I agree GPOD should be simple. We may request they wait to run the drag strip for an hour or two to let the fast cars run. Both from an educational standpoint of the upper end of the completion and not getting debris on track.
I'm in agreement on the only four 250+ TW tires sentiment
I'm fairly new to GRM and have only done one autocross for fun and a few trips to Hallett with my Boxsters for DE. I plan to run a car in $2019 because I think it will be fun to build a car to the $20xx Challenge spec and to participate in the GRM community. I have been exposed to competitive driving enough to know that tires matter, but seeing how focused everyone is here on tires, Tires, TIRES, is somehow turning me off to the whole thing. Makes me wonder if I'm missing the point of this $2000 build-a-racecar thing or if you Dorks, have lost perspective. I don't know the history and barely know the rules.
...Just an outsider's perspective. I've got to mow the lawn now before the rain starts again.
How about "no slicks" and allowing DRs for the driven wheels only, 6 tires max for the event. As for the "driven part" simply saying DOT equipment required should be adequate, and we could always go out for tacos in our cars together to prove they are streetable. Also, how do I FMV a 1989 Plymouth Sundance turbo with a bad automatic? The car was free but it wasn't advertised so I can't claim it as such.
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