Living with a car from the present - 2019 Bolt EV

In reply to Rons :

Problem is right now that the business model for some of the networks is to collect subsidy money for installation, not for charging.

If a 220 mile return trip with no local chargers is in the cards occasionally, consider that you can always stop on the way and recharge. Sure, you might have time for a sit-down meal with a 50 kW charge speed - although really, you just need enough energy to make up your range deficit, it's not a "charge to full" situation. But a rare situation like this is vastly overshadowed by the daily time savings.

Keith Tanner said:

In reply to Rons :

Problem is right now that the business model for some of the networks is to collect subsidy money for installation, not for charging.

If a 220 mile return trip with no local chargers is in the cards occasionally, consider that you can always stop on the way and recharge. Sure, you might have time for a sit-down meal with a 50 kW charge speed - although really, you just need enough energy to make up your range deficit, it's not a "charge to full" situation. But a rare situation like this is vastly overshadowed by the daily time savings.

Well put

Agreed, for my situation, 95% of trips are easily within range, my garage at work has 3 plugs available, and there are actually more chargers than I realized after doing a bit of a dive into the charging apps.  I'm leaning more towards 'non-issue' now.  Im guessing as you get used to discharge profiles and such, you get more comfortable with range as well.

Interestingly, the local Come-as-You-Are used to have 4 plugs; they removed them since they ended up just being brodozer parking slots.

Keith Tanner said:

Problem is right now that the business model for some of the networks is to collect subsidy money for installation, not for charging.

I think you (or someone in the thread) mentioned that Tesla Superchargers fail "open" in that customers can charge their cars even if the Supercharger can't communicate back to the Mothership.  If the subsidies had a mandate for similar behavior, or an industry-agreed method of collecting uptime and reporting back with subsidies contingent on hitting X target, I think we'd see a much different service model.

Rotaryracer said:

Keith Tanner said:

Problem is right now that the business model for some of the networks is to collect subsidy money for installation, not for charging.

I think you (or someone in the thread) mentioned that Tesla Superchargers fail "open" in that customers can charge their cars even if the Supercharger can't communicate back to the Mothership.  If the subsidies had a mandate for similar behavior, or an industry-agreed method of collecting uptime and reporting back with subsidies contingent on hitting X target, I think we'd see a much different service model.

Agree 100%. And yes, I have posted that about Superchargers. Checked with a friend who works at Tesla, if they can't confirm they SHOULDN'T charge, they do. I think it should be a requirement.

I experienced this when my free Supercharging ran out. I didn't get a notification (it was supposed to happen on a certain date, but nobody got around to actually making it happen). I didn't find out until I was on a road trip and plugged in. The car still charged, I got a note in the app that told me I had to set up a credit card if I wanted to do it again. But the priority was to ensure mobility, not payment.

I forgot to post this from our date night a week ago

I have over 65,000 miles now. It's a bit squeaky here and there in heave, but otherwise it's flawless.

The van has just over 80K, although it's a year older. It's going to the dealer for a valve body since it shifts bizarrely. 

The Bolt continues to not shift. It's wonderful.

I really appreciate your regular updates.   
just out of curiosity  if you drive on the battery, let's say on a freeway  if you drove at say 55 instead of 65 would you get further before the engine started up?  More range?  
Or doesn't it matter?  

frenchyd said:

I really appreciate your regular updates.   
just out of curiosity  if you drive on the battery, let's say on a freeway  if you drove at say 55 instead of 65 would you get further before the engine started up?  More range?  
Or doesn't it matter?  

The Bolt has no ICE component.

In reply to dyintorace :

Oops I confused the Volt  with the Bolt.   I do that often, well because a Volt is an EV to me and a Bolt is more like an ICE.  
  OK even better. Will you get more range with a Volt going slower or say 10 miles /hr faster?  My gut say faster causes more drag but maybe the lower RPM is less efficient?  

I can't speak to the volt. The Bolt seems less efficient as speed goes up. I could get more specific with data if you want, but it would take some doing to eliminate enough variables. 

I'm getting an average of 4.2 mi/kwh since I got the tires. 

In reply to tuna55 :

Aw, it's just range anxiety. I'm normally very prudent when it comes to refills but if I had to go another say 5 miles than the car says it can go, could I slow down enough to stretch it those 5 miles?  Freeway minimums around here are 40mph. If I slowed down to that from say 60 mph.  Would it help me stretch the range?  
 I realize everything is different terrain, weather, heck even maintenance on the car. Etc 

  But knowing I have an extra few miles if I really needed them•••••
    Long story  you can ignore if you want. During the Fuel Shortage of 1973 some gas stations were only open for a few hours.  I was driving my Vega Across western Montana  late one night. I got a full fill up in Billings and headed west  cruising at barely 40  mph my fuel mileage went from barely over 20 to over 30 that night. Sun came up and in the distance there was a gas station with its lights on.  I think I saw 3 vehicles on the road all night ( none in my direction )  I had propped up a paperback on the steering wheel, read a sentence,  glanced up to confirm no one was around.  And read another. Finished the book as I looked up and saw the lights of the gas station. 
 

In reply to frenchyd :

Lots of  information here:  Chevrolet Bolt EV Range at Constant Speeds (roperld.com)

I can not vouch for the accuracy but I think it has some good general guidance towards what you are after although the specific graphs do not cover very low speeds.

A sample graph from the website: 

In reply to fusion66 :

Sure seems to indicate that a40 mph speed would add significant range.  Thanks. 

Long long ago when I was very hesitant about EVs (so, pre 2012) I made some comment about how they would have to consider liquid cooling cables if fast charging was the goal, no matter what the battery chemistry ended up with.

I wonder how much energy is lost via heat from the charging cable.

Whats fascinating to me is that the higher power chargers are actually more efficient than the L1 chargers.

In reply to tuna55 :

I'm pretty sure the V3 Tesla superchargers have always had liquid cooled cables. They started installation of those about 3 years ago and it's pretty much all they've installed since other than some of the 75 kW urban chargers. I don't know about the high power EA chargers but it wouldn't surprise me for the high voltage CCS stuff.

Level 1/2 chargers are AC whilst fast chargers are DC, so you don't have the conversion losses.

In reply to Keith Tanner :

the 150kw+ EA charge stations do indeed have liquid cooled cables, since about 2018. 

Keith Tanner said:

Level 1/2 chargers are AC whilst fast chargers are DC, so you don't have the conversion losses.

Right, but Level 2 is significantly more efficient than Level 1.  I'd love to see the breakdown of why that is.  

I have a friend who works on the energy storage side of Tesla, I'll see if he knows.

ProDarwin said:

Keith Tanner said:

Level 1/2 chargers are AC whilst fast chargers are DC, so you don't have the conversion losses.

Right, but Level 2 is significantly more efficient than Level 1.  I'd love to see the breakdown of why that is.  

Line losses due to voltage, probably. A Level 1 charges the car at 120v, a Level 2 charges at 240v. They're not really doing much, just forwarding the supply voltage plus a pilot current that tells the car how many amps it can draw.

Interestingly, the difference is exaggerated at lower charging amounts so there's some sort of overhead at startup. Battery heating? From the summary of https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/7046253 

 On average, Level 2 charging was 5.6% more efficient than Level 1 (89.4% vs. 83.8%). In those charges in which the battery took up less than 4 kWh, this difference in efficiency was even greater: 87.2% for Level 2 vs. 74.2% for Level 1. 

I'm finally reading this thread, and had to comment on this.  

Keith Tanner said:

Heck, BMW's had a real-time efficiency gauge since E30 days at least. I think it was just a vacuum gauge, but it was marked in consumption.

My 1966 Barracuda has a Performance Gauge like this...

Bumping this thread because January 1st is coming and the new EV tax laws will come into effect. I might be looking at trading in the BMW i3 for a new Bolt. I love driving the i3, and the space and range is perfect for me, but it's a BMW - tires are very expensive and getting it serviced locally has been *not great.*

I am seeing a surprising number of 1LT models availability right now locally. Looks like GM has some sort of Friends and Family deal to knock a significant amount off MSRP as well? It only seems to go through January 3rd though. 

One big thing to note is the feds have given themselves an extension though March to figure out what cars qualify for the full and partial federal rebate. This news article says this means the Bolt (and some others) will qualify for the full $7500 until the rules are posted, though I'm not so sure that's the case. 

Thank you for bumping this thread.  
   I've been looking at Chevy's EUV.  With its price point, rebate, and larger size.  It may well be the perfect replacement for the wife's Honda CRV. 

Well I can answer any questions or offer free test drives in the area. I am coming up on 70K miles. The hatch struts are getting a little weak in the cold. Other than that, it's still the best car I've ever owned.